Live from the Pathway Studios in Johnston Proper. You are live from the path. Hey. And you're listening to live from the Path. We're coming to you from the Pathway Studios here in, Johnston Proper.

It's good to be with you. It's a big Very good. Why is everybody looking at me like I don't You're the host of the show, Ben. No. Shoot. No. That's fair enough. That's good point. Alright. Anyway, hey, here's what we got going on the show tonight. First of all, Mike's got some Pope style advice. Mike, preview on the Pope style. It's I call it How to Say No. That's your clever title? Yeah. I love it. Actually, there's not a lot of content to it, to be honest with you. I spent all the time on that title. Okay. I think that's fair. Alright. So there's How to Say No by Mike Foose. Also, was an article that Hey. Hold on. Are you mocking me? No. No. No. That seems legit. Alright. Continue. Okay.

So we were gonna there's an article from Bill of It magazine called I feel like you're mocking me. No. I'm not. I'm not. It's I'm I'm gonna agree with Mike. Think you're mocking him. I'm trying to be supportive. Okay. Continue. Article on whatever whiz bang you were saying. Yeah. Okay. Alright. So from Relevant Magazine, there was an article called Don't Isolate Yourself in Christian Clicks. Why You Should Get to Know People Who Believe Differently Than You. And so we're gonna try to tackle that one. And see, I don't know. There there's a bunch of that Relevant Magazine always has these real hip looking people on there. This is because there's one lady with some plaid and a ponytail. There's a hip dude drinking Joe and a stocking hat, full beard. And then there's a guy who looks like he's not hip enough to be in a motorcycle gang, but he might, like, ride a bicycle behind a motorcycle gang. Yeah. Anyway. And they're all looking at something going on across the street. So I feel like this applies to us. Same people are also used in the article five practices we need to bring back in our lives. We're gonna read that one too.

Alright. They're linked. Alright. And then we have some advice on, on dear life and the path, and I think that's what's, that's what's going on. Hey. Hey. Heads up, man. Next week. Next it's time to clear the calendar, boys. I don't know how far ahead you plan, but next week, SilverSide is gonna be in the studio. Mike confirmed? Yeah. Yeah. They're coming in. This is still happening? As far as I know. Okay. Good. Alright. There's a there's a 90% chance SilverSide is gonna be in studio. I'm pretty excited about it. So so if if you don't remember, like, they've been on the show a few times before. They're one of my favorite groups of guests.

And they they always have pretty cool stories from the road, cool stuff what's going on in their lives in in playing music, getting in front of people who really need to hear about the the truth and love of Jesus. And you can pick up their new album. Mike, what are your thoughts on it? I listened to the whole thing. In fact, I downloaded the whole thing, and it's pretty solid. In fact, they have this one tune that Lord did where it's they took a voice mail of of their mom. Yeah. Their mom passed away, and then they took, like, the last one of the voice mails that she had from her on her phone and used it for the opening part of the tune, and then it starts rocking. It was it the the whole album is really good. That one in particular is pretty excellent. Wow. Sweet. Sweet. And and if you remember, with the last time they were in, can go check out previous performances that they've done. They've done been very, very gracious with us. They they did some acoustic performances, which is not something that they normally do, and they've done that on the show. And the last time they were in, they brought in those guys who sang who sang hallelujah, did a really cool version of of hallelujah. Mhmm. And, anyway, you can go check all that stuff on the website. Go to lifeinthepath.org. You can hear past interviews with Silverside

and some of their performances. I'm looking forward to it for you guys. I make sure you, you can set aside if you can catch it live, it'd be cool so you can be part of the chat stuff. If not, make sure you podcast that beast or watch it later on YouTube. Before you go and ruin it, I will our our friends. So

and all kinds of stuff. Document. I don't know. See when I and he was very

cool about the whole thing. Team.com and with Bob if you feel like he's he's just the guy to do it. He knows in the the Moin,

the peripheral city. Him and his team are just for the houses and stuff that I've looked at.

His team has just always been very, very gracious. So Bob, John, Bill, give those guys a call. Hey. Even if you don't know whether you're in the market, he's a good guy to talk to as to whether you should be. Yeah. And so go to the eisenhowerteam.com. Also, Westfield Veterinary Hospital. Go to westfieldvethospital.com for all your all your pet care needs. It's still the cusp of spring, boys. You can still get your pets in for all the the necessary shots and, things to keep the ticks away. Yep. It's Lyme it's Lyme disease season is what you gotta be looking out for. Did the dog get the Lyme disease? Oh, yeah. That's a big deal. Shoot, man. Lyme disease, Bordetella, you don't want those things. What's isn't that a pasta?

What? Bordetella? Bordetella and cream sauce. Isn't that a pasta? Yeah. My dog had that once. It was nasty. Because the because it's poorly made pasta or it's actually a disease? No pasta, like, drips off the dog. It's disgusting. Oh, that's fair enough. Alright. So to go to Westfield Veterinary Hospital, hey, you can even set that thing up online, you lazy bones. It's 10:00 at night, and you think to yourself, I really should do this. You can do it right now. Yeah. Westfieldvethospital.com. Get it set up. They're they're awesome to deal with this where I take my pets, where Mike takes his. They they're they've been dealing with this pirate cat, the one eyed One eyed Mabel. One eyed Mabel. So, anyway, they're the place to go. Make sure you hook up with those folks. Hey. Have you ever heard that song, need to breathe song called Abel?

Was like, I'm not Abel. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, like, I can't stop singing it when I see that one eyed Mabel cat, except for I change Abel to Mabel. And then it's just a side note. It's not a classic anecdote. That's not Breathe, though. Hey. You

should pick up their live from the woods album. They did they did an album live from the woods, and there's a song called difference maker. It's just awesome. It's an awesome tune. So, anyway, my throw out there for the month. If you get to Spotify, stream that beast. Otherwise, it's worth 99¢ or whatever they charge you for it. Pick it up there there's an album version, like a studio album, and then a live version, Live From The Woods. Pick up the Live From The Woods version. It's really, really good. And that's number four called Difference Maker. Excellent. Alright. Alright. So let let let's check out this article here.

Herrick sent this over. It's called Don't Isolate Yourself in Christian Clicks. It says, a few months ago, I started a new job in New York. I've begun to make some great relationships with my coworkers. I'm developing a new skill set. Okay. I'm a barista, but it's actually pretty hard to be a good barista here. And I'm finally settled in my new home. But I have to confess something. Until about a week ago, I've been hiding the fact that I was a Christian. You see, in my progressive rational mind, I decided that I wanted my coworkers to get to know the real me. Several of them are gay, a group many Christians have been unkind to. Another has clearly harbored bitterness against bible belt rhetoric, which has at times been heavy on the condemnation and light on empathy. I didn't want my coworkers to let me in with hurtful, narrow minded people before they got to know the compassionate, open minded person I believe myself to be. Right? It's an it's an italics. Did I represent it correctly? Is it right? That's how I would say it. Okay. Good. Theoretically, I can sleep well with that kind of thinking. But when I finally explained to my coworker one day why I don't work the Sunday morning shift mentioning that I'm usually at church, I understood why I've been resisting for so long. As soon as they knew I was a Christian, I felt that my behavior would be held to a different standard. He's a Christian, but he does x y z. Oh, here it comes. I swear a lot. Okay. I'm not one to Right. Close Right.

I am not one to close my bar tab too quickly, and I've even gasped, looked at porn before. I'm a blissfully imperfect person. And for the most part, I find myself daily seeking the Lord for help with those myriad imperfections. This has never been a problem for me and my friendships because my close friends have always been other Christian. I can bury my soul with a great deal of vulnerability because they get it, also in quotes. But now I've run into this challenge where I'm not in the throes of my sixteen years of Christian education, pre k through college, kindergarten twice, and it was an age thing. And most of the people who I'm in a position to become close friends with are not Christians. All this time, I've been assuming that that will open me up to a world of criticism, misunderstanding, and a lack of grace. In my Christian friendships, there's always been real wonderful grace and an understanding that we fall short, but the Lord is sufficient. There's even the freedom to write and speak sentences like that last one, rife with Christianese without the need for trans

The temptation I've faced is to throw myself into my church community, become friends with a bunch of other believers, and then minister to a couple of coworkers, that I get to get sort of close with. For the first time in my life, though, the thought of that makes me uncomfortable. It feels wrong. It feels too easy. So there's more to this article. Let's stop there. What are your thoughts so far? Like, Eric, what jumped out at you in this article? It's

something that kinda resonated with me just because I I very much valued growing up. The friendships that I had with people really who were either outside the church or maybe belonged to a different church or really had no church background whatsoever. Whereas I myself came very much from a church background. But those friendships were very valuable to me because they helped to give me more perspective. It helped me to, among other things, kind of filter through some of the rhetoric that the church was giving me just to sort of weigh some of the pros and cons, I was able to see what are some of the things that the church is saying that has some real substance to it, and what are some of the messages that I'm getting from church that not

so much. Right. And being able to have, friendships who who with people who just think differently than me and have very different perspectives. It was just a very valuable thing for me. And, I I I see that that kind of our society is tending more towards, people just hanging out with people that think like them, and that's kinda scary to me. Be

now the person next to and it what God is like. All we're ever doing is,

learning about either my perspective, agree with me. Well, that's a good point. Right? Like, if if God sees the whole world, and and and that's his perspective,

it cannot be implicitly more valuable for us to only work under a narrow perspective Mhmm. Of which we only know the culture of which, you know, those If Jesus walked in a world where people didn't follow him, and we are not walking in a similar world, then we're we're not sharing with his eyes. And and as often as we may pray for his eyes to see people the way he sees them, that's very difficult to have that full perspective for otherwise not participating in it. Mhmm. That's a good plot. And and, Mike, this reminded me of something that we've been talking about lately. It's it's like some of the stuff that you grow up in the church knowing or or being told that, like, you you're not sure even where it comes from. And and I suppose without that exposure, if you're always around people who believe the same things you believe, you never it's possible that you don't get to the root of under your beliefs even came from or how or what they're filtered through. Yeah. It it because I've been going through this quite a bit over the last couple weeks

because I was I I mean, me and the wife were on a fast, you know, and and I spend a majority of my time with people who aren't Christians. And, you know, I I ended up having to explain some of my behavior because it's just straight up odd, you know, when you're ordering weird stuff off the menu and they you know, no you you you're like, I you know, I'm not gonna go out this time or there's free pizza. I'm like, no, thank you. And and so it it's funny how how different church Jesus and street Jesus are. Like and and it it's it's it's kinda hard to explain, but, like, some of the stuff where if I came up to you guys and I'm like, listen. I'm not gonna go with you. I'm on a fast. You guys be like, okay. Sounds good. You know? And and then that's the end of it. But but

it to a couple guys, you know, what a fast is and I mean, I it doesn't matter. I mean, after my actually

it and I is that, I have these and for You just want

to have good self And I'm like, okay. Know, like, I said to this

thing, and I thought I can continue eating what appears to be an all tomato salad and we can stop talking about this now. I guess then, let's that's good enough, you know, but, like, realize, like, I I I always knew that there was there was a gap. Right? But, like, understand the functionality church Jesus

are. And and and I think this Okay. Alright. Let's continue with the let's continue with the article. So he says, fear makes it easy to assume the worst. I've concluded that up until recently, I didn't even realize you could be close intimate friends with someone who wasn't a Christian. Sure, you could have a nonbelieving friend or two, but the goal was that they'd hang around your Christian friend group until they became Christians too. There are easy justifications for this kind of behavior. I know them well. They are the lies that I've come to believe through a very selfish unbiblical view of relationships. I've been so focused on myself, protecting myself, and how people might view me that I was missing the opportunity to be a good friend to someone just because they might disagree with me about some beliefs that I hold dear. I'd been assuming I knew that what someone thought before I even took the time to get to know them. I had this paralyzing fear of being criticized and judged by my non Christian coworkers. But who am I to say how someone is going to think and act toward me if I'm not even their real friend? It was the I was the judgmental critic, acting like I knew who they were and how their minds worked before we had a relationship with any sort of depth.

Step outside the fear that we're ostracizing others and more importantly ourselves with our faith. We have to get outside of our safe Christian cliques and be vulnerable with people who don't know Jesus, or else we'll continue perpetuate the lie that we think we're somehow inherently better humans that we can't be real friends with the sinners. I'm not sure that's where it comes from. I've come to know some remarkable people at work and beyond who believe very different things from me, but who I would now call my dear friends. I trust them with secret parts of my life that I don't trust with everyone I can ask them for advice without fear of judgment, and I can walk through life with them, loving them the way that god does, hopefully being a good friend along the way. Yes. These sort of relationships come easier between Christians because we can skip a few steps in the hard work of learning the depths of each other's hearts. That does not mean we have an excuse to shy away from creating meaningful friendships with people who do not have a relationship with the Lord. Wait. You thinking about that correctly? Has he categorized it correctly? It sounds like he's, he's made the step between,

being open and vulnerable in and, exploring deep meaningful relationships with Christians and Christians only. And now it seems like he's actually willing to expose his heart to people outside the faith and be able to just say, Hey, here's who I am. Here's everything about me. I'm gonna let you in on even some of the darkest corners. And I'm just gonna be open and honest with people who may not share his his overall belief structure, and yet he's still willing to be vulnerable with them. Is that important? I think so. Okay. Why?

Jesus did. And he he was incredibly vulnerable himself with, well, with his disciples, with with people from earth. And it doesn't get much more different than God and people from Earth. That's right. Have you have an implicit disparity between the guy who created you and the creation itself.

And so when when Jesus is in that realm okay. Okay. I can buy that. But where where does the where has the people of the church learned to have fake relationships? I sounds like he's he's afraid. He's had these fake relationships his whole life, and now he finally has a freedom to be real or something like, well, shouldn't you just always just be who you are? I mean, I I'm kinda having a hard time relating to what he's saying. Is it to how he got here? It's like, why why this was a why this was the issue to begin with? Well, like, he intentionally had to think, okay. I'm gonna I'm a Christian because

they're gonna take all these terrible Just say you are or aren't. Why can't you or live Jesus? And I think that's kind of where he's getting to. The conclusion isn't it, if I understood him correctly. So I I wonder if I wonder if that's kind of what Mike was talking about though, that, like, that there is there there does seem to be disparity between what would what would other my my Christian friendships and non like, I I don't I don't have any reason to make a distinction between those as to who I am or what I do. But I I think maybe what Mike's saying is that that perhaps,

there's a bigger disparity there than I think what we realized. Like, the thing is is the thing that he was concerned about doesn't happen. Mhmm. Is that a realistic fear? Or or is that something that the church created? Have we created the thought that, because of how we've talked about people who are not in the faith, it creates this chasm that makes it sound like there's some there's something less than people. There's something there there are people that might have like, just just as as some of the some of the people that speak on behalf or have claimed to speak on behalf of Jesus don't necessarily echo Jesus are the people who will otherwise will look at Christianity and have have a a negative reaction that our judgment to that don't speak on a giant group of people like that. And so, like, have we permitted at some points to allow this head this concern about what people think of Christians to keep us from being actual people with other people? And I think maybe that's what he's speaking to. And maybe it's just this desire we have to tell everybody to to you know, I don't like what you're doing. You know? You're using bad language. You should stop that. But why? I mean, they're not followers of Christ. Why why should they? I mean, you know, why why am I trying to get you to act like someone you're not? And maybe that's it. That that that he's got that inner inner guilt of of I'm spent my whole life

for no reason. But it's but it's not always that though. It's like, I mean Christ follower else's. And it is or not.

For example, if you're hanging out and they decide they're gonna out. Mhmm. And and, like, you're the one guy that doesn't wanna go and says that, you know, I'm I'm just gonna skip on that. And they're gonna say why.

And you say, it's just not for me. Right? Well, they're not fools. You know, there's an implicit judgment on on that you're not gonna go. And so now that like, without you saying, hey. I don't think you should do that or, hey. That kind of entertainment is just not for me. They're thinking, you think differently of us, mister I'm not gonna go. You know I'm saying? The point of view don't know Is right, but.

What follows. You know, you're you're gonna pass on a judgment when you things that they do. And that is gonna happen whether it came out of your mouth or not. Well, true. I I suppose it's going to be revealed. Like, if you're taking a narrow road and everyone else is walking a wide one, they're gonna see that. Right? It's going it's going to come through. But I I wonder if we have otherwise approached some of those some of the well, it doesn't it doesn't mean you don't it doesn't mean you don't interact with other people that are walking, I guess. No. Doesn't it doesn't mean that at all. That difference in lifestyle isn't something that's really gonna offend people until you start getting in their face and saying, hey, you need to, you know, change your lifestyle and I'm no longer I find that to not be true what you just said. Okay. So you My just experience is is that it does.

Okay. Whether you do it intentionally or not. It it it it gets there. Like, well, through I'm not saying, like, with a onetime interaction Mhmm. But, like, a patterned lifestyle Right. It does. It it starts to be I mean and and most people won't take it, you know, where offensive or or, you know, you know, that you're not to beef and you go, I just it's just not for me. You know, like, after a while, it starts to dig a rut. It it just does. Something seems wrong though if you're rejecting everything that they seem

to call fun and enjoyable. I don't know what kind of folks you hang out with, Herrick. Fair enough. But I I I mean, there's a reason in Jesus' culture, he was referred to by the religious uptight as a drunkard and a and a glutton, and it's because he hung out with people who knew how to party. Yeah. That's true. And so, you know, implicitly, he's not just hanging out with the people. He's probably also with them, but it doesn't mean that he's engaging to any kind of sinful level. It means that he's, he's showing up at the same parties.

Yeah. Now what he's doing, I don't know exactly, but, you know he's hanging out with all these people that would be normally unsavory so I don't know. Buva? Well so I think that we've created

and I don't know if this is in the church or this is just Christians in general, but we have created this us versus them mentality when it comes to Christians versus nonbelievers. And I I agree that there should be differentiation between the two. Obviously, we should be walking a different path and and be able to be differentiated by based off of our our actions and what we do and how we do things. To the to the point of this guy actually feeling like he needed to alienate alienate himself

because he didn't wanna be judged because of that or because he wanted to to avoid any kind of meaning meaningful relationship with someone who didn't believe. I I don't see a biblical place for that is where I'm trying to find it. I I just don't see see any part of of Jesus' story or anyone else's story that says that that you're not supposed to find yourself involved in their lives and being able to have many relationships with those people. Now I get that you should definitely refrain from that kind of behavior. If if they're going to a strip club, don't go with them. But

I usually offer to drive them because they've been That's yeah. That's totally fair. Feel like I can come pick you up, make sure you get home safe. Well and I think that's the right mentality to have because the snub nosed Christian is gonna go, oh, you guys are going to the strip club. How dare you? I hope you don't burn on the way kinda deal. Like, that's that's that's ridiculous. Like the cartoonist version. Yeah. Exactly. Where whereas a person who's not necessarily just looking at the fact that there's sin in their lives and they're about to to commit something that they don't care about, but more from the perspective of it's still people and it's still people I need to love on. I I am going to get involved in their lives. So I just don't see anyone who's honestly trying to follow Christ's heart on the situation and on people and on his his people that doesn't find themselves getting into the trenches and then getting into meaningful relationship with people. I don't see how those two can coincide. I get that that there's differentiation, but I don't see how that can be played out in a way that you're not in the trenches with people. You're not constantly in in weird scenarios with people because you're the one who offered to be the one light in that dark situation,

and you're the one who offered to be the one person that stood up for something that meant something more than just the fun that they were having but cared enough about their heart and their their them who they are that you're willing to take a stake and take a risk to be involved in their lives. So I was reading an article, and I boy, I I just don't remember the the nature of the article. But it was about a guy who was a Mormon or not Mormon. He got into

what's that? Scientology. Okay. So he got into he got into Scientology young, and then now he's I think he's like a professor at a Baptist University or something. And so but but but there's one part of the story that really stuck with me, and it was the guy picked up a a book by L. Ron Hubbard, and he was kinda reading through it. And he he went to school, and he was and there's a there's a teacher there that was an English teacher, and the guy was also a a pastor at a local Baptist church. And he stopped one day, he saw this kid reading this book, and he said he said, L. Ron Hubbard. And the guy and the kid starts to explain it to him. He's in high school. And and he talked about it little bit with the with the teacher. And the teacher didn't really say much about it, but he said he said, look. One day, L. Ron Hubbard is going to let you down. When he does, I want you to call me. And the kid, you know, he kinda brussels with that kind of stuff. And he he kept kinda pursuing Scientology, and it took, like, it was, like, three years or something. And and he he was reading some more stuff, and and he finally came to a place where, like, something wasn't connecting. Things were not making sense to him. And he said his first call let down some day. Thinking

and then the price to I think he's a professor somewhere at a at a Baptist university. But, like, like, the whole thought was is that, like, we we somehow and part of what Dan was getting at is that you

we've somehow decided that our job is is to call call balls and strikes, and that that that will lead people to Jesus. But, like Yeah. I only care what the balls and strikes are because I know who Jesus is. And the truth is is that, like, I think there is I think there is I think there is something that a a person that loves Jesus and loves people will always struggle with, which is how close how close do I get? How close do do I do my actions take where I'm helping to facilitate them doing something that I know will harm them? I don't see Jesus doing that. Yeah. But but but, like, it's probably as close as you possibly can. It's probably the right answer. Right? Is is you get as close as you possibly can. We are not facilitating that. But otherwise, like, if no one's willing to go that close, the guys that are already in it will never hear the hear the voice of Jesus. That's the truth. And so, I think that's something we're gonna constantly struggle with. I think you are seeing, it's very much a potential that you will go the other way. Like, do I will I wear proudly on my sleeve that, yeah, I looked at a little porn? No. No. I will not wear that proudly on my sleeve. Right? Can can I say that honestly to somebody whether they know Jesus or not? Yeah, will. It's it's part of my life. But like, you know, I I think that there's a there's a there is a a place where you can overdo that. Where, like, when we say, Jesus didn't become a drunkard, nor a tax collector.

But I think he got he got as absolute close to it as as he could. And frankly, he he knows that balance better than I do. I have to approach that with more caution. I am more susceptible to things than Jesus is. And so, yes, I think that about the other way. I think one of the things that we've done, though, is, like, you'll notice that when you when you get too insulated with the church, what helps me in the church is, like, I might call balls and strikes in Mike's life. Said, Mike, you know you, but we failed to out people who'd otherwise

don't trust the empire. Yeah. And and so so, yeah, I think you have to be be careful about that letting that bounce one way too far. But but if if there's ever indication that God is saying, I don't want you to be a human to other humans you know, actually, thought this entry. This is coming up in a in in our, our Matthew text for this week. But it was interesting to me that one of the things that Jesus is is that that that he he gives you the golden rule. Right? He says, you know, treat other people like you'd wanna be treated. And think of everything else kinda comes from his perspective. Right? Here's how God wants his people to behave, but he's given you something that has humanity baked into it. Like, how do you perceive things are supposed to be? How how how do you treat others and understand how you wanna be treated? And a lot of times, we we we we sometimes regurgitate that out as the things that otherwise Jesus has said. But, like, he's given us something very unique.

There's very unique humanity in us having to digest how what do I want? How do I feel? Even within the terms of of of who he created us to be. But, like, more than some of the other things where he says, no, this is just this is not how my people behave. This is not morally what I want you to do because it's harmful to you. They're coming from his perspective. Being able to kind of summarize the things that he said through a more human lens, like, that's a very interesting way for him to have presented that to us. And and, like, it also obviously harkens back to, you know, love God and and love people. But, like, it's just was I thinking about that this week as I was kinda preparing or thinking through that that that section of scripture. It's just a bit of a unique perspective. And so but it's interesting in the in the this concept or this discussion that, like, sometimes we pull some of our humanity out of how we deal with people. And, like, that's where people don't feel like humans anymore. Like, we they feel like whatever we've categorized them to be. And the truth is is, like, how they live their life, the things they think, the things they do, may very well be on the opposite side of truth. It's very, very possible. In fact, it's true for everybody in some way or another.

And and we'll never run away from that. But the truth is is once you start stop once you start identifying people and and and lumping them into the things that they have done or the things that they think or the worldview that they attach to, it it isn't what I want people to do to me. Mhmm. Because I don't think they understand Jesus rightly because they let me with some other guy who held a sign outside of a concert somewhere. It is wrong for me to do it to them simply because I will never be able to talk to them about Jesus if if our barrier is what they think that I think about them and vice versa. And and to be honest with you, the people whose whose theology or probably lack thereof is completely on the opposite side of mine, they seem to grasp that a lot better than I do. And frankly, that's why their conversations are making a lot more progress in in a culture like ours, is because they're actually treating people like humans at times, the the Christians aside.

Like, they're treating people like humans, and and and the church has got a wrap of balls and strikes. And we've perpetuated that some. And so I think we need to reglimpse our own humanity at times and recognize that we can't get involved in conversations. We can't possibly connect humans to Jesus if we start out with understanding humanity. And, and I think that's something where we've we've not done a good job. Obviously, to the extent that this guy felt like there was something that he had to hide, I don't have I don't feel that. I don't know. I mean Yeah. I have a little bit of a disconnect with what he's talking about because I don't I don't know that I've ever felt the urge or the need to have to do that. But then again, he's in a much more varied place than I am. I mean, even in this room, like, are people that whose jobs put them in a more varied situation than mine has.

What I believe is seems to be palatable to people. I don't know that I've ever run into trouble expressing what I think. And so so anyway, I I think that's kind of kind of where all that that stems from. And where we do have to be careful, and, like, it's pretty easy to get the finger wags out and say, Yes, that guy could go too far. Yes, he could. But, like, I think if you go your whole life and don't and haven't been accused of being a heretic at one way or the other, you're probably not close enough to sin. Close enough You're not probably close enough to people that are sinning. Like, it just you just you run the risk, and, it's a dangerous risk. That's the that's the narrow road. The narrow road is that, and that's hard. But, like, I think it's I I think it's kinda par for the course that that that some pious guy somewhere is gonna wave wave his finger at how close you got to a guy who doesn't believe what you believe. And it's not a comfortable position, but like, I think that's where the narrow road is. Well, I think the whole balls and strike thing, I was thinking of like, when your young children are learning what words are okay to say and what aren't. Yeah. And they learn one that's not, and then they hear their friend use that word, you know, their initial thought is they tell their friend not to use that word. Right. You know, well and and then you have to teach them, well, maybe that's okay for them, you know. Right. You know, or not okay for them. Know, it's it's Here's why we don't say it. Exactly. Other people may be looking at that differently. Their family might not follow Jesus, and and they're not gonna teach them that. Yeah. You know, and and this

is your rule. You know, this is for you. Yeah. You know, it's for our family. And and I think I think that's what this guy was struggling with a little bit, was that desire to to to call the balls and strikes on everybody. And he's he's told himself, I'm gonna back off from that and just be a real person, which yeah. That's good idea. So so it it sounds like he felt like there was there was some judgment from a Christian perspective if he didn't call the balls and strikes. Don't know that I got the impression that he feels like he should. I or that he wants to. I think he he feels like it's a burden upon him because he's a Christian that that is what he is to do.

And so, you know, yeah. Yeah. You need to be free from that. Be free from that. Just be it's okay to be human. That's that's cool. Mhmm. But, like, but here's the deal. It's, like, part of my human story is I'm a human who needs redemption. And part of my human story is that, like, there are things that I struggle with that the world simply can't answer, but Jesus does. And so why wouldn't I wanna share that with other humans, you know, on a human to human level? Like, that that seems like the right place to have that conversation. And I I I think we just we sometimes walk into daily life with some sort of weird box around

what things are supposed to look like. And it's like, why you just live your just live your life and know that Jesus is a reality within it as opposed to even the even the thoughts of of the Bible as a rule book or the Bible as a as a handbook, I think sometimes cast the wrong thought process because it acts like we have to live the lives that those guys are living. But, like, I don't live Paul's life. That's the truth. I don't live his life. Now, Kent, are there things I can learn from how he he met he met Jesus. Alright? So, like, yeah, I can learn from that man, and there are concepts that I can take from it. But, like, I cannot recreate his life in my current environment and have any positive evangelistic effect on the world because the Jesus, in that circumstance, Jesus transcends circumstances, but, like, you know, it's just not the same it's not the same interaction. And so, anyway, it's it's just something we gotta be careful of is that we don't have Jesus is the prescription that that that that cures all ills, but, like, that he is also, like, a variant prescription.

That, like, it it will look differently in different circumstances, and we we don't necessarily have to carry those exact circumstances into everything we go to. That is not a burden of what you are forced to The Jesus' burden is life. You get to live your life. It may bring some things into it, that that, make it a narrow road, but, like, you just don't feel like you have to pile that stuff on. He ends it with, this great cloud of witnesses we have to surround ourselves with is a gift. Our Christian friends and the church at large are an amazing source of encouragement, strength, hope, and comfort. But let's never forget so focused on building each other up that we cut out everyone else. Otherwise, rather than spreading the message of a love that we've been empowered with, we spread a message of isolation and ivory towers of morality. Instead of making relationships that model those that Jesus had, we keep those who don't align with our beliefs at an arm's length, hoping that somehow there's that's still close enough to qualify as friend, never getting to know them before deciding who they are and what's best for them. I implore you Actually, I don't even know who they are. I know what's best for them. That's Jesus, what's best for them? I implore you, full colon,

do the scary thing of being yourself around anyone, and allow yourself to be vulnerable with people who hold beliefs that are different from, even hostile to, your own. Take the time to truly befriend some of the many people in this world who do not share your beliefs. Be willing to be questioned, challenged, even hurt. There are some of the great freedoms that come with the saving work of Jesus Christ, and a joyous part of redemption that I don't wanna miss. Yeah. So I was talking with a a good friend of mine, earlier this weekend, and he was just kind of telling me a a biblical perspective on learning, and it was, pretty cool just the parallels between it and, and just life in general. And he was saying one of the fundamental aspects of learning is that it's got to pour out. You don't just acquire knowledge, also need to pass that on.

I kind of see that happening as being sort of the downfall if people only ever hang out in the church and in their church clicks is that, you know, the Lord teaches you something and He blesses you in some way and that never really gets passed on. It only just goes from from Christian to Christian and it never goes outside of the four walls that that we've got putting up the building. And so we just end up holding this blessing to ourselves and and storing up the the good things that God has for really the whole world. We just end up hoarding it all to ourselves and keeping it to ourselves. And it just ends up perpetuating a type of almost religious inbreeding and it's bad. It's not the picture of life. Life is we receive and then we pass on. And, I think that's what's the that's what we're being called to is you you've got to interact with people outside your circle in order to pass things on. Right. If Jesus is the living water and we're the dam, that's a problem. Yeah.

Yeah. I feel like it's an issue. You don't ever wanna be the dam. That's another shirt. Put that down right there, guys. I don't wanna Don't be the dam. Yeah. Are we still Hey. This works on all kinds of Listen, KTA censor folks. That is used in a legitimate way. There's no reason to censor that from the normal broadcast. I'll use the other one after we pass the break. Alright. So anyway Hey. Actually, so I wanted to drop by this article. I here's the deal. I think that's a growing thing. I think I think that's something just to kinda hit this broad thought on this article is that, like, the narrow road says that we struggle with these things. So it says it says you're not not that you struggle with them, like, internally, but, like, living a living pursuing greater righteousness in a world that is not will always be a

complicated thing, will always require prayer and counsel, like and wisdom. That's just the that's just the nature of it. Running from it is the wrong answer. Being a dam is the wrong answer. Like, it's it's just a complication. And I think that's the holy spirit is here to sort stuff like that out. But, like, our our our job can't be to isolate it and protect ourselves and just say we will not be part of those things. It's simply it cannot be that way. So, anyway, so it's the same picture on relevantmagazine.com came with five practices we need back in our lives, how to reincorporate practices into your life that will give you a new perspective no matter how busy you are. Here we go. I'm just gonna I'm not gonna read the introduction. I'm just gonna read the, the things. One, silence. We live in a noisy world, and it's only getting louder by the day. Screens compete for our attention. Social media is always on our mind. Responsibilities pile up as we age. There's never a moment it seems to pause amid the craziness to take a breath from the rat race to escape the franticness

of life. If you've forgotten the sound of silence, try to rediscover it. You might be surprised by what you hear. Agreed. Oh, yeah. That's true. You do I mean, do you but do you purposely do that, anybody? Sometimes I will turn my radio off going, why am I listening to this? For some reason There's always noise. You know? I always turn I once well, I have to turn stuff off. Whenever I I go for, like, a walk or go exercise or anything like that, I have to have my music on or something. I have to have some kind of noise. And I was on a really long walk recently, like a six mile walk about halfway through nowhere near a charger and my phone died. Yeah. And I was sitting there, like, really angry for a good five minutes. Like, how am I supposed to possibly walk the rest of this way? I'm not gonna be motivated at all to do this. And then I kinda just stopped myself, and I'm like, you know what? I haven't really done in a long time. Just sit and listen. And I kinda just did a real quick introductory. God, I I'm just gonna listen. I have I absolutely no idea what's gonna happen. I have no expectations for you saying anything. Frankly, sometimes I don't really know how to differentiate whether my mind is just going, true.

And I'm like, god, is that you? Or if I don't know what's going on. I like I like the god's voice in your mind is some sort of, like, seven year old's impression a ghost. It's a ghoul. It's a total I'm like, this dude definitely has to be God. Like, there's no way that that's not me. But I've found myself doing that more and more often, and I'm not any better at it. But I actually I I'm starting to enjoy it more and more and more. So, yeah. Alright. Do it. Silence it is. I don't do that. I sometimes I drive without the radio on. Like, sometimes I'll do that. It does feel like more a heavier moment. Like, if I if I drove twenty minutes and and, like, didn't have the radio on, it felt like I was thinking of something epic. But I probably wasn't. I was like, there'll be a sandwich at home. I should make a sandwich. That's sad. Feel like you're like you driving a two ton mechanical beast with a steering box,

and you this can't hold your attention. You're like, I'm bored. I am bored. There's nothing going on. And, like, I've done that. I've shut off the radio in the in the in the truck or whatever, and I'm driving. I'm like, I'm just tastelessly bored. Like, I just something needs to happen here. And so you turn on the radio and, like, this is not doing it. And it's it's just amazing. Like, the simple joys of when the car first came out, everyone's like, this is gonna take all my attention. I really gotta pay. And then nowadays, you're just like, just just this driving this giant machinery is just not doing it for me. I'm gonna there's millions of people around me. I'm there's barriers. There's turns coming. I I can't do this very long. I'm I'm bored. You know, it used to be that you you would say, like, I want I want the eyes of a child, right, to see the wonder of a child. But the truth is, like, we're ruining we're ruining children. Like, my kids are ruined. I'd like and I'm ruined along with it. I noticed that I was we were in the car the other day, and my oldest daughter's like, hey. Can I can I use your phone? I'm like, no. Look out the window. Like, let's figure out I'm gonna just oh, there's nothing to do in here. I'm like, there's a window. Like, play with your knees. I don't care what you do, but just like I say that all the time. They hate that. So I said, you know, just do that. Find something to do. And then, like, literally ten seconds later, I checked out. Pulled up my phone and I looked at something. I'm like, disaster. I've

done this. I've done this to 200. But like but now, you know what? I I feel like I wanna see the world the way the way, like, later generations see it. Like, the like, there's 75 year old people, like, who who look at the world and, like, they've seen it change. And they've and they've they they still they wonder at at nature. And they and they they wonder at things how things progress. And there's, like, it's it's not a simple understanding. It's it's a very complex understanding, but they look at the world with much more wonder than I do because I expect the world to work in a certain way. And I'm I'm it's hard to make to bring wonder to me. And so, I actually would like to see the world like a 75 year old man. Ain't that kinda funny, though? Because, like, I mean, like, the the the cliche that that that you always hear is, like, my knees acting up, there's storms coming in. Right? That won't be here in thirty years because everyone knows if a storm's coming in because they checked their phone. You know what I'm saying? Like, the guy that's in tune with nature or that weird implant he had starts acting funny when static charge comes in from Arkansas. Like, it'll be gone because no one will ever need that or think about it because they checked their the weather on their phone ten minutes ago. That will be a sad thing to die out. Yeah. It will. That guy's funny. Yeah. Now it's my weather app is buzzing. That's right. My phone told me it's gonna rain. This knee can't be trusted. Yeah. Here's actually, I suppose that still inspires wonder is that it's the old man who, like, a second before it happens goes,

honey, the phone's gonna ring. And, like, the phone rings, you're like, hey. How does this even happen? Hey. They I I I was at a training class one time. A guy was telling a story. Like, they thought lady this lady thought she had become psychic because because the dog could always tell they thought the dog was psychic because they thought the dog could always tell when the phone was ringing. And because he'd start barking, you know, and then the phone ring, and they it went on like like this for weeks. You know? And then finally, like, a buddy of theirs came over and said, hey, man. You have your dog's collar hooked up to the telephone line. And so and so, like, the dog was running across the yard with his collar tied to the to the telephone line. So every time it would ring, it would shock the dog. And he'd move enough for the signal to come through, and then the phone would ring.

So needless to say, the dog is not psychic as previously thought. Technology ruins it again. Alright. So silence. We're in for silence. Two, purposeful conversation. Have you noticed that the older you get, the harder it is to have purposeful conversation?

I think it happens to all of us. As we age, we put on masks. We this got heavy. We learn to hide the bad and project the good. This results in superficial relationships and shallow conversation. I don't really have that problem, actually. I hate this conversation. Mike, take off your mask. Just be who you I mean, I I can't even talk on this plane, whatever whatever you're saying. Putting on mask or whatever. Having tough conversation. Go ahead. Continue on. I'm sorry. Anyway, if you find yourself lacking real friendships, make a point of identifying those you trust and begin opening your life to them. Yeah. Instance Your openness will curse them to share their life with you. I mean, here's here's the deal, like I've never stayed up at night going, I like real fridges. You think it's because of mask I wear?

Seriously, who do talks like this? Mike is the wrong audience for this article. Oh, yeah. Actually, so I I think the I think the The broader point. Go ahead. Point makes sense. It's how they've ordered it is is not does not tickle Mike's character. Who who who is the author of this? My inner self wrote it. Is it Cindy? It's under three masks. Paul Paul Perkins. Oh. Okay. He writes about living intentionally at paulperkins.com. He lives out Yeah. Bet. Paul Perkins lives out loud.

He wears no masks. The art of creating about developing your artistic craft. Oh, for FSA. I'm gonna bring him on, Mike. You're gonna you're gonna be friends with him. I'm gonna I'm gonna interview him and go, we don't have anything in common. Let's do this thing. So so I I would say that, like, I I stink at unless I well, I would say unless I know you, I'm very bad at superficial conversation, but that that actually makes sense. Like, the closer you are to people, the more likely you are to have purpose for conversation. The people you don't know I was at some guy's birthday party over the weekend and like, there were a couple dudes that were standing around me, like, hey, how's it going? I'm like, well, how's your job? And I thought, I don't really know any I don't know anything else to ask you. So I'm gonna get some coffee.

And I got tea instead. Anyway And the real barn burner. That's what I'm saying. So I don't know. I suppose being intentional, maybe it goes back to the previous article is like, you open up your life to? But like, I feel like I don't wanna open up this guy and say, hey, by the way, I was dishonest with my wife three weeks ago. So and I leave my socks on the floor. What are your thoughts? Change me. I think we have a unique room here. There's maybe,

well, there's certainly a minority of people who are actually good at small talk. That's a point. Good point here. Yeah. Yeah. Mike, you're alone in this one. I would say, who is? You're really good at that small talk, I'm a social wizard. I made friends with two, three people today looking through garbage. Solid point. Hey, So I told you we were junking. I ran into some old ladies in a Toyota Scion on Friday night. And, I mean, this woman's probably 80 years old. And I walked up, and I started looking through the garbage. She was looking at it. I said, hey, man. How's been going tonight? It getting anything good? And she goes, oh, no. She had a wear and a fanny pack. She goes, oh, well, no nothing great. I did find a sack of fire trucks. I thought, sweet. Like, that's kinda cool. Grandma found some fire trucks. She goes, yeah. I'm gonna put them in my garage sale in a couple weeks. I don't even have any grandkids. And I thought, will you shifty old bitty? Like, there might be some kids sifting through looking for fire trucks, and grandma made off of them so she could bonus on them at their yard sale. Yeah. Anyway, heads up for the old ladies. It was a nice Toyota Scion. I thought maybe she knows how to run her life, and I don't. That's probably the truth of it. I thought the purpose of a yard sale was to get rid of stuff. She's collecting stuff to make big dollars.

Social Security ain't what it used to be Eric. Alright. Number three, selfless service. If there's one advancement that defines our generation, it's social media. While the increased connectivity is great, it also transformed each of us into many celebrities. Ain't that the truth? Among an ever widening circle are every thought in a 140 characters and image refined with filters it broadcast for all to see. He acts like he ain't fortunate for it. This leaves us in a perpetual state of plotting and planning how to capture another Facebook black, another Instagram heart, another Twitter favorite. For all its benefits, social media and the obsessive affirmation seeking it spawns can easily nudges towards egocentrism where our social standing is what matters most. The solution to our culture's me driven mentality is simple. Service. Looking to give while gaining nothing in return, and that means no status updates announcing your good deeds to the world. Is this a room that really cares about the number of likes they get on a message? I don't know. Mike cares. Yeah. I do. Yeah. This article was written specifically with Mike in mind. I couldn't this guy I mean, I I said bad things earlier, but I feel like this man is my soul.

Being being honest, yeah, at one point in time, that was totally me. I thought that that the more Facebook friends I had or MySpace friends that I had, the more popular I was at school. And that kind of carried on a little bit into late teenage years, like 18, 19 years old. 23. 23 years old, probably 24, still working on that one. Yeah. I I think you're prone to that still. Looks like a ten minute epic video this week. I'm I actually expect to want you guys to bring that up. I I honestly so I I mean, it was good. I'm not saying it wasn't good. Just At one point in time, that would have been my mentality was to post that just so I can get, you know, a 100 likes or whatever that is. But I legitimately I I want to post that stuff or or get involved in that stuff because you guys don't realize how much stuff happens behind the scenes. No. Like, everybody sees, like, a post that I'll put up whether it be a five minute, ten minute, twenty minute video. I'll get 600 likes on it. You guys don't realize how many instant messages I get if people are just like, dude, you don't realize what that did for me, or you don't realize how how impactful that was, or people reaching out to me like, hey, anytime you ever need help or I've been struggling with something like that. I've never been able to find the words to say, but the fact that you said it like that makes perfect sense. That's the biggest reason I do. I honestly could care less about the likes because I get them if I post a picture of me in yellow shorts or I get them if I post a picture of me, like, serving other people. It does not matter, But I would much rather do something meaningful that people are legitimately gonna get things out of. No. Yeah. I'm for that. I could go without hearing the long conversations on your legs ever again. But, like, those videos, I think, are alright. Yeah. Agree. Time you post a picture and kinda you in the mirror or whatever, whatever you got on, people like, oh, Troy. And then they're like like, they start talking about your physique. And I I can't That blows up pretty quick and I'm trying not to do that can't take that in. I I read it and I think to myself, I I need to sit in silence somewhere. Yeah. I need to sit in silence, do something nice for somebody, and have a meaningful conversation at the same time. My inner soul is wounded. No

more yellow shorts picks, Troy. This is where it is to be a meaningful relationship because I'm out. I can't do this anymore. Troy's legs wear a mask. Here we go. Of of gorgeousness. Here we go. Intentional adventures. Growing up, every day was an adventure. That seems to be romanticized. Pick up games and afternoon swims, practical jokes and late night parties.

Heck. I didn't live this way. Saturday I was gonna say, wow. One egg for breakfast. Saturday morning brunches and long walks at the park. It wasn't just the fun activities that define that season of life. That's a Christian thing to say. Life comes in seasons. It was the attitude, the belief that every day was full of wonder and potential. Life was whimsical. Heck, he might have been in the pipe. What did you say? Got second grade. I was gonna say, what was it like to live in every nineteen eighties movie about a group of kids? Like, are you serious? My my childhood was, hey, man. Do you wanna go play a video game for six hours and then end your night eating a bunch of cheese pizza? Sure.

Here's the deal. Third Every day is a mystery. Third Level four. Third grade was a lot of things, but whimsical was not one of them. Do you take long walks in the beach and nice afternoon swims and then Sunday brunches? No. I remember having a pizza pocket on Sunday afternoon when I sat by myself. Practical joke. Anyway. Truth. This man might live a life that no one else can. Get out the house. Go, mom and dad. I grew up in a small town. I knew every inch of my neighbor's yard, our yard, every field around. I mean, we Go for afternoon swims? What's

that? Did you go for afternoon swims? Yes, actually I did. Yes, I did too. Clear Lake, Iowa. It's similar. Yeah. About a mile out of town, there's a there's a bridge and we'd go bridge jumping. And Yeah. You know, it yeah. That does not exist. What's that? There's no such childhood. We've rode our bikes off I the had it. I lived Walked to the beaches and It was fun. Okay. We apartments? Apartment fellas? Yeah. Duplex. Okay. Same same deal. Alright. Okay. Yeah. We didn't have any bridges to jump off of. We we got the broom where the guy upstairs is too loud. We got our entertainment was, hey, man. Make sure you go clean out the shed. Alright.

Here's who who's the guy who's saying knock three times? Tony Orlando? That guy ruined trying to get people to calm down for everybody. Because you knock three times on the ceiling to get them to shut up and they come down and like, I thought you wanted me. You know what mean? The last time, Jerry. Tucks on the pipes. Alright. Even if you're in a cubicle Why is there exposed piping in here? What a dump.

The I think it it was the heater, Mike. The the knock the twice on the pipe was on the was the Yeah. Radiator. Knocked three times and twice on the pipe. Yeah. Twice on the pipe was because they lived they had a radiator. That didn't say that. You're just guessing. It could be the sewer pipe. What it is. Sewer pipe. Alright. Just sticking out of the living room. Even if She like our new furniture? It's doesn't make a cool clang. Even if you're in a cubicle, booba, caring for children or answering phones, the attitude that defined your youth is still accessible. Alright. Stop wearing the mask. It's simply a matter of living with intention and making the most of every moment. Choose joy, adventure, whimsy. There's time every day to do something fun. Here's the deal.

I I am gonna have a problem calling my wife and say, babe, I've chose whimsy this afternoon. Yeah. Mike, I need you to drive over here and fix this thing. That don't sound whimsical. Give me something else. I might have been Can you do something for somebody else? No. I'm gonna be spending my time doing some afternoon swims. I'm sorry. Do you do you need to be saved in a pond? Because that's where I'll be. Yeah. Okay. I I don't think he's talking about action so much as attitude throughout this. You can't say that in a modern cut. I I don't mean to break this this maze that sounds like a stripper. Yeah. When you say I choose whimsy, like that sounds like our culture was ruined it. I'm sorry. Anyway, choose adventure. The truth is though, like, and I find myself I keep I've said this in more context than I and I've said it even on the show, is like, like, you you live your days live your days like you want your life to be. And so like, if you don't on a daily basis choose to have those types of things in there, you can't be surprised when sixty years goes by and you didn't have whimsy in your No whimsy. And so here's the deal. Like, figure out what you like want your life to look like, and then try to try to make sure that happens on a daily basis, and they will simply accumulate and become your life. So, I mean, I there's truth to that. He just he just worded it in a way that's not palatable for this moment. Maybe we can all start floating six inches above the ground. And make days Hey, Mike. Are you doing anything on Saturday? Would you, by chance, like to go bridge jumping and then have an afternoon swim? Boy, howdy. That sounds whimsical.

Me and my friend Boover are going down bridge jumping. I'll make that a Facebook status and see how many likes we get. Do you have any overalls you can wear? Because I'll wear my overalls too. Of course, I do. Hey. That's what God wears because he is overall. That needs to never happen again. I think we need to make, like, a a pact as a show that that never happens again. Don't be the damn. Hey. Final one. Mutual encouragement. As a kid, I I played a lot of sports. No doubt. Although I enjoyed this competition, I mostly love being on the team and working toward a larger place.

Alright, Mike. In there, I've lost I've lost the other part of the room. In that context, every teammate becomes a cheerleader. There's nothing quite like the energy created by mutual encouragement that lives oh, we're done. We're just gonna let this thing go. There's there's no part of me. There's no part of me that

can get on board with any of this article. None. But our neighborhood got together and played sports. We just fought the whole time and argued. It was an out. It was not an out. It's like, here's what we need to start doing. Silence and then a bunch of other mamby pamby stuff that nobody really actually wants to do. Do you wanna play on a, like, a slow pitch softball team and get back to that youth dude Oh, I hear that you miss? Let's just admit it's a little bit Andy Griffith show and call it a day. Alright? That's that's the deal. Get your burlap sack, boys. We're going down to the pond. Oh, alright. Here's hold on. It's nighttime, Booba. Your mama be calling. Better heads back home. Hey, man. Them street lights be turned on. You best get home, boy. Back in the day when I used to go to the lake about every day, I I'd ordered online a big it was a big hand blow up mattress.

It was giant hand. It was it was awesome. Was that the end of that? That was really all. Mean, it was just cute. It was just cool floating on the lake on a hand. Waiting for that to get involved in something else that was happening. You just gotta stop. It was great. I had a rhino type bicycle when I was about nine. Was it whimsical? Alright. Alright. You've been listening to self shower. You've made the mistake to listen to life in the past. Not my fault. If you're on the podcast god god bless you. Seriously.

We got twenty more minutes of this. If you're on KTA, I I grant you a reprieve. Don't don't hold us against our sponsors. Thanks for listening to live from the path. We'll we'll see you next week. Alright. Transition one down. Transition one. Let's go play sports.

Ratio of Boo Radley's apple tree. Oh, man. What did oh, I thought of Boo Radley as as a sermon example this week, but I but I forgot what the context was, and so it's gone completely. I have to Evernote that stuff directly. Otherwise, it's gone. You can pull a day in and just bring it up anyway. Hey, guys. Boo Radley. Yeah. How you doing? Blow up glove. Thank you. What the heck, Dan? If

you were to have found a giant blow up hand, would you have purchased it when you were younger? That was the best thing ever. Heck yeah. This may not be the time or place, but get on my hand Hey, Philip. Story. I don't I don't know if this story has anything to do with what's going on right now, but at one point in time when I was a kid, I definitely bought myself a big hand mattress. Let's let's cuddle up in my giant hand to go on the lake. Oh, man. That's creepy. Alright. Mike Mike, you have pope style?

Yeah, guess. Alright. So the concept of pope style is someone has has accidentally told a group of people that Mike is possibly the pope. And now a bunch of people have showed up at Mike's house and will not leave his porch until he gives some kind of wisdom that would come from the pope. And so now he's gotta give us something that will appease the masses to leave his place. Mike, what do you got? So,

I I tried my I tried my first fast, for about three weeks, and I've never done it before. In fact, it all seemed whimsical to me, frankly. Like, I I people always said they did it, and it was deep. It was some kind of deep spiritual thing. I'm like, I I don't even wanna see this as necessary, you know. But, I my wife and I were talking about it after after we had a a sermon on fasting at church,

and, I was staunch against it. I'm like, no. This is stupid. We're not I'm not doing this, you know? And then I thought, well, crap. Why am I so against it? Now I feel like I have to do it just because merely because I said I'm not gonna do it, and I think it's stupid. I thought it can't hurt anything. And so, anyway, my wife and I embarked on this fast, and I thought, I I just don't I don't see the point in this thing, but, like, I'm I'm gonna do this anyway because I feel like it's I I gotta give away some of my will here. Like, I'm holding on to this not doing the fast way too hard. And, really, what it boiled down to was it was three weeks, and, it it was kind of great. It it was kinda awesome. And and I kinda got something out of it that I that I I didn't expect. Like, for some reason, I thought I'd come out with some kinda glowing perspective

that that the whole world had changed, and and I finally understood, like, God, you know, like I finally got it. He's like a giant hand. I didn't have to I didn't have to phone in my like like like I always struggle with, with a king, like with God is king. I struggle with that because I don't I don't have I I don't have an earthly king that I can put it as a perspective. And like, I just I I have a I I struggle with, like, sovereign authority with, like, really trying to, like, think that I that I I totally understand God in his place. And I'm like, I know what's gonna happen with this fast when I start. I'm like, I'm gonna come out, and I'm gonna truly understand god is king and, like, my whole world's gonna blow up. That's not it didn't happen. It it didn't happen. But what did happen, and it was it was kind of an amazing part, and it was happened, like, two days before the fast was over, It's like I realized that,

I can say no to things. And, like, it it was weird because it was just that simple. But I but I thought of, like, of all the things like, it like, this this fast was like it's not wasn't just like, hey. I'm not gonna eat chocolate. I was like eating beans and water. That was pretty much the thing, you know? And like, I never, I never, I never, I had, I didn't know hunger. I didn't know weakness in the whole thing. Like I prayed and I talked to God and all that stuff was great. But but just before it ended, I realized that that like, I can I can say no? I can say no to things. And like, there's there's certain sins that plague me that just plague me. And like they came up during the fast and I just said, no, Said, I'm I'm just not gonna do that, you know? And like, it it it was so odd that, like, I needed a a complete perspective change to realize that I I can just that there's sins that don't control me. Like, I just have to say no and say, God doesn't need this. God doesn't want this. God says, I have to say no to you. So the answer is no. Like and and it's not like he's forcing me. It's an agreement just like the fast was. Like, I agreed

to, you know, whatever, stick to this this strict diet. And like, I was tempted to get off it every once in a while just for for mere convenience. And when it came up, I thought, No. No. God and I agreed that this is what I was gonna do. And I said, No, and it was over. And I didn't lament it. I wasn't upset. I didn't It wasn't terrible. I just said, No. And it was done. It was just a fact of life. I can't do that. And it was funny. Like, I had some I had some situations come up where I'm where where one of my major propensities to sin is is to gossip about a guy or or or, you know, get angry for some reason. And I thought, no, God and I agreed that we're not gonna do that. And then it was just a, it was just a no. And so I think my pope style advice is this, is like, I'm not saying like,

a fast is like the fast for me, like something came out of it that I didn't expect. So I don't know that I'd walk into it, saying, like, I expect to do this work, God, and I expect you to give me this in return. But I would say that, like, when you trust God, more than you normally trust him, when you put the way that your life runs in his hands, like, the answers, they're just not as they're not as hard as you thought. You know? Like, it just doesn't turn out to be as big of a deal as you thought. You're not gonna turn into some kind of perfect dude or anything, but, like,

sometimes it's it is just as simple as saying, no. No, I'm not, I'm just not gonna do that. And then having it be done. Yeah. Yeah. That sounds, that sounds about right.

Buva, what are your thoughts? What so this is gonna play off of what you're coming from, but this is more of a question to everybody. But what kind of things would you say to someone who's contemplating going on a fast?

What advice would you give in regards to to intentions, to in regards to execution of doing it or anything like that? For those that that don't fully understand what a fast is about, why you would do it, and and what kind of expectations to have, what would you say to someone who who is contemplating doing it? Cause I know there's a couple dudes now that I mean, a couple of you have done fasts recently, so, what would you say to someone who's thinking about doing one?

So I I can tell you exactly why I did it, and it was some of what I said, but like, we talked about on the show before where I said, you know, I always imagine me sitting on one side of the table and and Jesus sitting on the other. And, like, I look over the table and I say, here's here's where the parts of my life you can have control. And then I start picking things off and kinda put them in my pocket or putting them down by the bench and be alone except for this part here, except for this thing here. And, like, just for the mere fact that I didn't wanna do it was enough for me to say, I'm gonna do this. Right? Like, I didn't want him it's not like he he told me he didn't tell me anything about it. He's not like, you're gonna eat beans and and pure wheat right off the ground, and this is what you're gonna do. He didn't say any of that stuff. Right? But I knew, like, if I didn't draw it, if I didn't draw it strict, I wouldn't I wouldn't be depending on him for anything. And that's what I wanted. And that's that I did it for the mere fact that I didn't want to do it because I didn't want to give it to him. And I and I thought I'm not gonna I'm not gonna go through whatever three weeks of suffering for no reason. And I thought, you're gonna go through three weeks of this fast merely because you don't trust that God's gonna provide for you and you think it's gonna be suffering. And that's why I did it. And that might just be my personality and how Jesus deals with me. He deals with me different than he deals with other people because I'm his kid and he loves me and he knows how to push me around. And so like, I don't know if that's a good motivation, but that was mine. Okay.

All right. That's Pope's advice. Get, get off the long. Alright. What you got, Mike? You got the dear life from path? We got time for a couple of these. Ready? Yep. Dear life from the path. My brother is older than I am and has been in and out of prison. He has stolen my things and pawned them. I am married, and my husband and I are expecting our first child. We live in a time zone several hours behind the one my family is in. I am now receiving phone calls at 04:00 in the morning from collection agencies on the hunt for my brother. He has been writing bad checks and leaving my phone number as a contact number. I have managed to determine who his probation officer is, and I'm on the fence about whether I should tell her what he is up to. My dad is furious with me for even considering it since brothers and sisters don't do that to each other. Honestly, I'm fed up with his blood is thicker than water mentality when it comes to my brother's wrongdoings. He is now including my family in his schemes, and I won't stand for it any longer. What should I do?

How is he including your family in the schemes? I mean, than just leaving a a phone number as a contact. No, that's pretty much it. Sounds like she's like, woken up or yeah, her family's impacted because she's woken up and getting phone calls at four in the morning, I guess. I say turn them in. Dan says turn them in.

He's making choices. That's a con I mean, that's a consequence to his actions. He's passing bad checks. Yeah. I mean, mean, he's well, what are you protecting him from? If you turn him in, you're the one who turned him in. That's okay. And that He's the one who wrote the bad checks and gave my number. Right. But when he suffers the consequences, he's looking at you. Not looking at himself. That's okay. So, so

What I'm saying is he's not going to blame himself and start taking responsibility or anything. He's going to look sort of squarely at you. Oh, That'll be all your fault. That's the end of the relationship. I'm just That's probably good. Okay. I don't know why that would be good, man. Why would that be good? I don't I don't think he has a relationship with her other than he's using her and abusing her. I mean, if he wants to to leave it be because

she's protecting her family and that's that's on him. Well, mean, that that seems like a I can't cobble guy forever. No. I I just it seems like a slight overreaction. Like, her family's not under threat. Like, don't answer the phone at four in the morning. Yeah. Turn your phone on vibrate. Well, that's that's yeah. Ten to six. That's what I would do, but but, you know, I'm- But you would, you would recommend to exact revenge for- No, I even say revenge. It's just he's gotta be held accountable. I mean, whatever. Or I at least give, when they call, I'd say, well, here's his probation officer's number. Call him. He knows might know how to, how to get ahold of him. I don't know. I'm not seeing The police, yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like, I mean, police can do their job. I've done that with, with family members who were giving me numbers and, or giving other people numbers and calling me. And I'm like, Hey, I don't know. You have to reach them in prison. What the heck, Mike? What? The police can do their job? Yeah. Mean, hey, hey, like, oh, somebody Well, won't you go shackle him to the radiator and say, come pick him up, I mean, I get that right. But like, if you know that someone that you are that you're related to is doing something illegal, harming themselves or others, and you're like Yeah. Could protect that. Seem like my issue. Police will hope they'll hope the police find them. Yeah.

Is there a level of crime of which that goes away? There are guys storing bodies in your car? Well, mean, we might have talked about that, but I'm just asking. I'm just saying if you wanted to commit crime, I'm your brother. Alright. He's just passing bad checks. He's not in physically endangering someone's life. No. No. I'm just was wondering where Mike's line is. They're like Okay. The thought process is the police will do their job, like I mean, it's still it's still wrong. Hey, you're not gonna use my services. I get it. So no. I mean, I'm just saying. So so wait. So, Herrick, what level of breaking the law are you okay with to harbor a

relation? I I'm not gonna outsource relationship maintenance to someone else. I mean, if he's in trouble with the law, that's between him and the law. I'm not I don't need to do the law's job for them. That's just what I freaking said. Why don't you yell at Harry? No. I Th that's what I'm asking. So, like, to what level of law breaking is that alright with you? To what level of law breaking? Is he harming someone else? Yeah. Let's say he did. I mean, he harmed the I don't know how you can make the case he didn't harm the store owner. That guy's out money. He stole from him. So as long as he doesn't hit him ahead with a bat, you're alright. Well,

I mean, immediate danger of someone's life. That kind of part. That's the limit? What's that? It's the, like, it breaks his arm. He's not gonna die. That's all right? Yeah. Hey, he clubbed a guy at the seven Eleven. Yeah, he stayed at my house. No, it's not my responsibility. He's

has actually committed violent crimes is what you're describing? Yes, I I would draw a line at violent crimes. If he's not able to Well, physical harm. If it's if it's financial harm, guy has trouble making money seven eleven because your brother's passing bad checks, you're like That one seemed like my problem? Yeah. No one told him to open up a gas station. That was his choice. I'm just I'm I'm interested in your lines here, boys. I just I I I don't understand what about, I mean, the guy's a bit of a scofflaw. He's stealing from other people, and you know it. A scofflaw? It's even your phone number. Like, like, take take your impact out of it, okay? Let's take take the you're inconvenienced at four in the morning. I'll put I I mean, I've had that. I'll I'll put up with inconvenience from my family members at four in the morning. Happens. But

I'm talking about, like, this guy you know is harming other people and seems to be doing it consistently and has put has put you in the middle of that process. And you're basically saying, it's not my I'm not my brother's keeper. It's not my responsibility to have to hook somebody up, hook him up with the law when he's actually breaking it. Correct. Yeah. I'm with Eric. Sorry. Yeah. Okay. If he if I know that he's committing violent crimes, then, I'm gonna stop him. Is there a level of theft of which you don't have a problem? He could steal $10, 10,000, you don't care? If he tries to steal from the queen, I won't put up with that garbage.

No. I'll I'll let him. No no amount of money. Hey, if he's looking for some kind of help from me, no, there's not I'm not gonna help him go out of If he's the stealing money and blaming you and the police are coming after you, that's that's what he's doing. But he's but Herrick's innocent. Should be fairly easy to prove that. Yeah, that's really easy to prove. Hi. I was here. Hi. I've never met the queen. Yeah.

I don't know. I I I was just like, like, in the instance, it seems like you're you're able to keep yourself separated from the circumstance of which, like, you have to look at the guy who's running the seven Eleven in the face and know, like, that's how the guy makes money, right? That's how he feeds his kids, whatever. I didn't steal from him. No, I know that. But like, you know who did and you're simply saying, Not doesn't seem like my problem. Hope you find him. It's not That's a lie. Do you know who did this? The guy at the seven Eleven is not gonna come up you. Yeah, right. He asked every guy that goes there. And you just happen to attend the exact same seven Eleven out of what, spite? I'm

just asking if he asked you, Do you know who did this? What then? It's not my job to rectify your sins. It's your job to rectify your sins and to deal with those. I can help you and I can help counsel you and say, you need to go out and take ownership of your actions, but it's not my job to take responsibility for your actions. Unless it's a physical unless it fit like, that's not universally true. Unless it's a physical problem, and then it is your responsibility? Yeah. Because you're about to cause physical harm to another human being. Yeah. I don't understand why the physical harm is the distinction. Like, why why isn't financial harm a distinction? Loss of property? Yeah. It's just material. It can be replaced. Well true, but like, I mean, did not the old testament law deal loss of property? Mhmm. And if you see a man wait, if you see a man's wayward cow, you're supposed to do something about This is the man If I see a wayward cow, yeah, I will get Hold the cow and it back to the Is on a is not is not the the man the seven Eleven owner's wayward money in the pocket of your brother? It's not wayward. It was purposely It's running

away. I don't really care. I I will tell my brother he needs to return it. And if his brother leaves if my brother leaves that over at my place, then yes, I'll go return it. But If you see it running down the road, you feel like that's you're supposed That that Herrick Miami vices himself out and goes looking for the guy? Yeah. No, no. I'm just I'm I'm trying Do I need to shake down my brother? Is that what you're asking? But you don't even have to shake him down. You know where he's at. But the the this question is not implied that she knows where he's at, first of all. No, that's true. It's possible. It's possible you don't know where he's at. I mean, he was living in my house, that's probably different.

Okay. Mean, what I would do when they would call me over a relative's situation, because they said, he said it was me. I would say, well, he, I, he's not here. He does not live here. Here's all of his contact information. Good luck. I mean, yeah. That's cooperating with the law. I'd I'd be happy And it to do wasn't even the law. It was like collectors and everything. That's, isn't that the problem this gal has too? So you, so you'd be all right giving him contact information.

Yeah. Because I I mean, here's the deal, it doesn't do you any good to I mean, you're no evidence, right? So like Mhmm. To the extent that you you're not convicting him, I I'm not gonna handcuff them as I He's here. Because you said Come get him. I get that. I mean Yeah. I think they already had their suspicions. I guess I'm I'm that's what I'm trying to gauge is it sounded like the way you guys talking that you simply will not cooperate. No, I didn't say that at all. Well, what what method of You projected that on me. You wanted me to be the softball. Mike, just take off the mask. Okay. So you would cooperate in turning him in? I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna walk him in there. If they ask where he is, I can say, it's where I seen him last. I'm telling the truth. Okay. That, that's what I'm asking. Yeah. That's all I'm saying. Okay. No, you were, you were saying exact revenge against him. Yeah. You were actively going out and saying, Hey, I'm gonna contact his parole officer. No. I'm saying here's all his contact information.

Oh, okay. Yeah. Alright. That doesn't sound the same as what you said. No. That's true, Dan. That doesn't really sound I I think you changed your position. No. No. Or or or okay. Give him the parole officer's information too. Here here's all the ways you can contact him. I feel like he's probably not in touch with his parole officer who's passing by Jackson. I'm not saying I'm gonna tackle him and and handcuff him and tie him up until the police get there. I'm not doing that. I'm I'm just saying here's how you can find him. I so so I so I would agree with this. I would help them contact in the same way I would, in the same likeness that if someone were to call and say, Hey, haven't seen Chuck in a while. Do you know how to get ahold of him? I'd say, Yeah. Here's Chuck's number if I have it. Yeah. So I'd probably participate in hooking people up who need to get hooked up together. I don't know that I would have responsibility outside that point. Right. Yeah. Cause I obviously can't, I like, they're suspected he passed bad checks. I mean, I'm also not the law. Can't really prove that. Right. And, and she sounds like the family is upset that she would even consider giving the information out. Yeah. I mean, yeah, they're just gonna have to deal with that. Like, it sounds like the dad would harbor him in the basement. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I would call that a mistake. Family's family. Brothers and sisters don't, you know, rat each other out kind of deal. Whenever that son learned those activities, maybe from dad. I don't know.

Maybe the dad's a moonshiner. That was not in the text. I'm just assuming that's what I think we could figure it out. Here's what secular says. Okay. Your father's obviously a moonshiner. There are no excuses for what your brother has done. If his father had given him a dose of tough love while he was a minor, he might've stayed on the straight and narrow instead of landing in the pokey. Oh, yeah. Preach it, secular. You know, you know that family? Sure. Do not allow anyone to make you feel guilty for protecting yourself and your family. Blood isn't thicker than water when abuse is involved and your brother's behavior qualifies. Amen. Contact his probation officer. With luck, when the collection agency calls again, you will be able to give him them, your brother's, cell, in parentheses, number. Get it? Cell like A42C Block.

Boy, I just don't like that whole I don't like that whole thing. You don't care for that advice? No, I just I don't know. There's a there's a tinge. It's there's vendetta built in there. You know what I'm saying? You've inconvenienced me. Not only have you committed the crimes, but now you've inconvenienced me, so take this retribution. So, is the distinction there is, like, are you trying to help right wrongs or you wanna turn the screw? -Yeah. That's -That's the question. -That's right. I feel like you wanna turn the screw. I think that it's coming from bitterness and anger and and how dare you involve me in your in your business and agreed his behavior is is not honoring to not your family, himself, god, whatever. Right? But, like, you want it to be the guy that, like, if the if the screwdriver's gonna get turned on you, I wanna be the guy holding it. Now you've gone too far. Now you're just a bitter person carrying that around for no reason. Yeah, I think that's true. I think I think we we we are in the business of righting wrongs. Could Jesus in the bit of righting wrongs? Vengeance is his, though. I, I thought once it starts to sniff of sniff of that, I suppose you gotta back you gotta back away from that. Yeah. I I I mean yeah. I I here's the deals. I think more likely, agree with everything you guys were saying, but, like, it matters where your heart's on at it. If if you're the guy that just wants to put the knife in, then you you're not thinking right. Okay. Here we go. Okay. Last one. Dear life from the past, I have noticed that some people in my age group, sixties, are becoming compulsive talkers. What?

Buva, how old are you? 48. These people don't ask wait a minute. These people don't ask questions of those around them. When someone begins to speak, the compulsive talker interrupts, usually in a louder voice, and returns to dominate the conversation. Some of them even continue to ramble on even when no one is listening anymore. I'm not sure that's compulsive talking. I tire quickly when I'm around these marathon talkers, but I'm too polite to interrupt them. It wouldn't do any good anyway because they seem unable to stop. When someone tells them they talk too much, they get offended, but the behavior doesn't change. Do you have any suggestions for how to handle compulsive talkers so I won't have to listen to the person go on and on? It makes me feel fatigued, irritable, and trapped.

All right. Here's the deal. They're, they're old. They can't hear. They don't know when anyone else is talking. That's why they interrupt. And that's why they talk loud. I'm they gonna hear rephrase this question. So it's more accurate. Dear life from the path. I'm a great person. People around me are not great. Yes. How do I, how do I commingle with people not as great as me? Love, I'm great. Shut up and grow some patients. Yeah, instance. Dan is willing to chalk it up to physical deformities. People around you are obviously not doing anything that they they're meaning to do. They just can't hear everyone around.

Imagine if it begins at age 60. Yeah. Grow some patience. Understand that if you're if you're talk me, boob, I didn't write it. Mike, grow some patience, man. If if you're in the business of loving on people, you're gonna find yourself in situations where you got guys like me that never shut up. Yeah. Deal with us, love us, listen to us, and have patience. And sometimes it's hard, booba. I can't It is a complete diff completely difficult. I understand that. -I see that a patient. I can't embrace your life choices when they're on the opposite side of truth, boo. And the truth is, you can't get back to it like that. -PETER: Patience. -PETER: You're gonna get a flag for you in continuous talk. Does anybody have any legit advice for this person? -PETER: Walk away. -: Yeah. Just leave. Leave it. It

alleviates feeling trapped. Hang out with younger people? -: Yeah. -: They don't have as many hearing issues? Speaking of Touch the person on the shoulder. -: Say, Hey, it's all a bit much, Earl. It's a bit much what you're saying. I mean, they're having trouble hearing and so that's why they're talking so loud and never really positive. I don't think that's legit. You don't think that's it? That they have a hard time hearing. The quantity of talking increases. Do you ever go into an older person's house and the TV's on? -It is up like 14. Way out. That would be evidence of someone who has a hard time hearing. Dan, It here's my house does kind of correlate. I mean, quantity of talking does not equal hard of hearing. Volume of talking does. Which was only he only one one of the issues.

No, he says they they they ramp up their volume to dominate the conversation. Here's the deal. My guess is that this is on. Like, he's if he's painted this as a broad cultural issue, there's something about how he communicates that seems very that that I don't think is, inserts himself into a conversation. So people do talk over him. Because like, you, you can find a domineering guy here and there, but like, you don't tend to find huge groups of them because like Like everyone in their sixties? Domineering people don't tend to hang about in groups because they get out domineered. Right. Right? They wanna, they wanna domineer other people in a conversation. And so like, don't see 10 of them all in an area. So if he thinks it's a broad cultural problem, if everyone else is to blame, he's actually probably the Hey, no doubt. You never see Tony Robbins and friends. You know what I'm saying? It's only Tony Robbins. Yeah. He shows up on his own. Yeah. That's something about how this guy communicates. It makes it easy for him to, to be communicated over naturally. And so I think it's less likely that he's around a bunch of nouverenneering guys and that there's some weakness in how he's communicating. Or like, he expects people to stop and ask him an opinion, and like, it doesn't happen. And so he feels like he's being interrupted. Interrupted. So if he was more assertive, then you probably wouldn't even be asking us? That'd be my guess. Yeah. Okay. Yep. Secular says, I do have a suggestion. Avoid people like this.

Everyone in their sixties. Avoid the entirety of that decade. If you can't avoid them, politely excuse yourself as quickly as possible. These people are sappers, in quotations.

And it is not unusual for them to drain others of energy, leaving them feeling tired, overloaded, and trapped as you have described, Like an alien succubus. A few minutes of getting away, you will start feeling better. Try it and you'll see. So basically, you've plagued every Walmart greeter and make a run for it. Yeah. Yeah. Don't know how these old folks' homes even survive with a bunch of, I don't know, scorpions running around all the time. Just stingraying everybody. It's isn't my experience.

Alright. You've been listening to Life From The Path. Thanks for hanging out with us this week. If you have, thoughts on the show, shoot us an email at [email protected]. Make sure you check it out next week. SilverSide is gonna be in studio. Get pick up their new album before before you get on the show so you can enjoy them that much more. Called casting shadows. Called casting shadows. Check us out during week at lifeandpath.org

for past clips, and be faithful in the means. Gotta take care of the ends. Thanks for listening to life in the path.