Live from the Pathway Studios here in Johnston proper. It's good to have you with us tonight. Hey, it's great to be here. Good, good. That's where we need a little bit of jazz in the room. Top of the world. A little bit of excitement. Here's what we've got going on the show tonight. So John Wagner's in studio. You might remember John. John's been on the show a few times. Always has excellent insight. Sure. And the occasional foul language. That's not true.

That's not what happens with John. So anyway, we've got some advice on Dear Life from the Pathway. There's a guy who's trying to strike the right work-life balance. Trying to figure out the right… Both kind of tie to provisions of your family. But balancing the responsibilities of a young working man. Man, that's easy. Okay, Dan's going to have that straightened out. That's not going to be a problem at all. It might not be. So we're going to talk about that. And also, I think maybe we'll kick off with this. But I was reading an article today about a Pew research study. And it had to do with Christians. And to be honest with you, I don't know who they're asking.

Either asking the wrong people or these survey results are blowing my mind. They're blowing my mind. I can't figure out what causes this type of reaction by Christians. And so I'll walk you through some of the data points. And maybe you guys can help me figure out… What was one of them? It was like… Sorry, I'm waiting for it to come up. But one of them was like, how do you know you identify as a Christian? Or what's the trait of a Christian? And 86% said something about belief in God. And what's the natural reaction to that question? 86% said belief in God is what helps identify you as a Christian. That seems pretty generic. Maybe Jesus?

Yeah. Yeah, so what are the other 14% answer? Right? Like, if your identification of Christianity is like you would agree that an indication of Christianity is a faith in God. Oh, so like they say God? And then 87% said, oh, yeah, yeah, that's it? Yeah. Oh, so it wasn't even like them filling in a blank. No. It was… Oh, wow. No, yeah. So hold on. Here we go. So it's a percent of Christians…

Oh, sorry. I may have worded this not quite right. So here we go. Percent of Christians who say blank is an essential part of what it means to be a Christian. Oh, this is even worse. 86% say believing in God. This is even worse than we thought, actually. It's worse, is it not? This is way worse. The other 14% do not find that to be essential. And in their defense, maybe they were thinking like, you know, like, well, no, Jesus. No, hold on a second. So let me look down. Let me see if I see… So there's a 14…

Hold on. There's not a belief in Jesus as a separate option in this list. So, yeah, that was a protest vote then for the 14%. I just… I don't… Like, I get maybe a 3% of a guy who's, like, completely misguided and voted in the last election for a Republican and thought, yeah, I'm a Christian. But, like, the 14% difference, I just… I'm having trouble with here. So here's… Hold on. Here's a couple other ones. A percent of Christians who say blank is an essential part of what it means to be a Christian. 71% being grateful for what you have. And that's the second top option after believing in God. So…

It's essential. So if you had to kind of… They don't have it as a rank. But, like, if the percent of Christians say it's an essential part of what it means to be a Christian, the vast majority say being grateful for what you have. Now, here's the thing. I don't know that I disagree with being grateful for what you have. But, like, in the list of things that otherwise I would say are essential for me of Christianity, this being kind of the second top agreed upon answer, does that strike you as weird? Yeah. Well, I can see over your shoulder the rest of the answers. It gets worse. So if some of the ones that are below this aren't ranked higher, I think I'm worried about a person's understanding of Christianity in general. Like, if you're going to define Christianity or being a Christian, like a definition, Webster's Dictionary answer, like, I don't think being grateful for what I have would be in that definition. Yeah. They kind of believe in God. Or we are pretty grateful.

It's like a bay. All right. We're pretty grateful. We. Yeah. Maybe that's why I'm struggling. It's just thought process. Maybe this is healthy. Something about this thing is healthy. Because it means, like, whatever we're talking about or whatever people are taking in, they're misunderstanding Christianity to a certain extent. I think Jesus said somewhere that they will know you're my disciples by the fact you're grateful. I am grateful for what I have. Like, that is just a very, it's a very, it's a moral focus pale thing. It's just not the essence of following Jesus, I guess. Like, are there moral attributes assigned to that, like, that come with following Jesus?

Definitely. I think he, there is a morality that he calls you. The cross itself is even an ethic. But, like, I guess this kind of struck me to think, like, it's a little farther off than what I thought. If that's kind of our number two. So, if you keep going down the line, percent of Christians who say blank is an essential part of what it means to be Christian. The third one was forgiving those who have wronged you 69%. Okay. That's up there. Yeah. And Jesus even ties that to things. Yeah. Like, that's even tied, he ties that in Matthew to something that's even a little bit difficult to parse coming out of the Lord's Prayer, which is, I forgive you those, forgive you in the measure that you forgive other people. Yeah.

So, okay. I mean, there's, there's, I get it. There's ethical language, but, like, that was below being grateful for what you have. Which, maybe that tells you something about our society is that, like, we are, we're not so tied up in being careful that, about what we have, but we are strongly concerned that we're at least grateful for it. Right? Because the stronger thing is to look what you have and say, maybe I shouldn't handle this. Right? Like, maybe this is, this is more than I need, or we're not functioning kind of off the principle of enough. But our, our standard then isn't, is to look at what have I, what have I put on the table? What am I willing to give up? It's more focused towards make sure I'm at least grateful for what I have. Sure. Sell your possessions, give them to the poor, follow me, or be grateful for what you have. Yeah. That's kind of your wall art theologian right there.

Sure, yeah. That makes a nice poem, you know, be grateful. But, but it hurts to, to forget people, you know. Yeah. It's more fun than not, you know. I'm going to hold bitterness. So let's, let's, let's kind of push that one over. Just, just be happy. Boy, that's, yeah, that's, that's really, that's insightful. I guess that's insightful to say, as opposed to, if I value being grateful for what I have, that would very easily allow me to dismiss giving to other people, like, as a strong thing. Because as opposed to saying, I have to give it up, I can just as easily say, I don't have to give it up, but I do have to be grateful for what it is that I have. And let's, hold on, let me see where that's at in the, working to help the poor and needy is 52, 52% versus being grateful for what I have at a strong 71.

And I'm going to, I'm going to leave 14% as the, as at least the margin of error with the separation between believing in God. If that's not a hundred percent, I just, we're functioning off a weird paradigm here. Uh, and here's the deal of believing it. I would say actually believing in, or following Jesus Christ probably would come in lower than that because Dan, to your point, I think you're right in that believing in God is actually a pretty broad thing. People can kind of take that how they wish. And so if you're not rocking a hundred on that, if you're at 86 on that, I can't imagine what following Jesus actually comes in on the pole. Yeah. Uh, all right. So let's go, keep going down. Forgive. But on your, you're helping the poor, right?

That, that's like everywhere in scripture, you're worse than unbeliever. If you're not helping your family member or, you know, Matthew 25, sheep and goats, are you grateful or are you feeding the hungry? You know? Yeah. Right. Yeah. But he leans on that example as an indication of what he's pointing you to. Yeah. And we're at 52, 52 are like, this is essential. You can take it or leave it. Sheep and goats are the distinction he makes is, did you, did you go to clothe the naked? Did you feed the poor? And we're like, eh, flip a coin. I can take it or leave it.

Jesus is hungry. Looks like he's not today. Boy, that's, that's rough times. All right. Uh, let's see. Committing, 48% are on committing to spend time with family. Actually, you know what was interesting? They were looking at this, um, and they looked at, um, highly, people that are highly religious. And I get that this is a difficult distinction, but it's defined as those who say they pray every day and attend religious services each week. Um, that's their definition of highly religious. I mean, you could take that in its worst possible light, which is, um, uh, you know, like a works-based formula of, uh, religion, or it's a natural outpouring of what they believe. I, I, I don't have enough information to make that distinction. So a little bit, that's, that's what they're using.

Um, but when you look at family balance, they said, um, the highly religious 40%, 47% gather with extended family, at least monthly, whereas 30% of not highly, highly religious gather with extended family, at least monthly. So like for those who say they are higher, highly religious, there's a 17% increase on how often they actually gather with extended family, which is instinct, interesting relative to the number of people who commit to spend time with family is about 48%. So all those guys are actually meeting with like, they're more likely to do it. And so it begs the question, like, which, which is the tail and which is the dog? Uh, do they value it because they do it or they do it because they value it? Or is it like, is it a wash between the two? I don't know. Good question. Uh, if you keep going down the list, um, let's see, percent of Christians who say blank is an essential part of what it means to be a Christian. Let's see, 63 or 67% were being honest at all times.

Again, what's the, I, I, I, I'd like to talk with a 30, 33% who are like, yeah, you know what? I don't, I don't know. That being honest part, I, you know, it's just, it's not as, it's, uh, it's important but not essential. Is, is the, you think, I wonder if essential is like your deal. Yeah. Like you can say. You can get caught up on that. But like, I don't. If you're taking the test, the quiz, you know, you can get, yeah. It depends on the mood I'm in when you do those tests. Like you get caught up on a word like that. Oh, essential. I don't know.

Yeah. So, so maybe that's a good question though. Is it like, it depends what I had in a relative comparison. If you were to lay out three things and said, um, the percent of Christians who say, if blank is an essential part of what it means to be a Christian, if you had Jesus lying or, uh, helping the poor, like if you had to, if I had to, you had to ask the question of essential, I would say following Jesus at one as essential. And I probably would actually frame the other two as important, um, and related, but I suppose if you put me at a relative distinction, sort of following Jesus, maybe I wouldn't make that same thing because I would want to make the most of Jesus and less about my moral righteousness. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, but those things are more tied together than I think we want them to be. But like, um, I suppose, I suppose it depends how you're looking at it.

Well, and you know, if you're following Jesus, the others will start coming at some point. Uh, yeah, yeah. That's a learning process. Oh, Jesus said to do this. Maybe I should do it too. Yeah. Tricky. Uh, 63% said praying regularly. Um, 52% were working to help poor and needy, committing to spend time with families, 48%, reading the Bible slash religious materials, pamphlets and tracts and stuff, 42%, uh, attending religious services, 35%, a third, a third of, uh, of Christians say that attending service is an essential part of what it means to be a Christian. Wagner, what do you, what does that mean? I think that's pretty typical. Yeah.

Don't you? I mean, I think that's about right. If you, how many, what percent of your members of your church actually attend worship week to week? If you don't even go to the public and just say, hey, persons who say they're members of our church, how many of you attend on a weekly basis? I bet it's a third to, to half maybe. Um, again, I'm, my question is for this survey, are, is this a multiple choice or are they grouping together answers? No. Yeah. So I think you had to, you had to measure them individually. Okay. Okay. Like believing in God, essential, essential or, uh, important, but not essential, not

important. Well, and part of, I think, uh, one of the problems we have created as religious leaders or as Christians in general is we have made a really big deal over the last, what, 20, 30 years of, hey, what's important is you and Jesus, you and God, you and Jesus, you and God. And we've kind of left off community. You know, we said, hey, there's some bad churches out there. There's some bad buildings. There's some bad leaders. What's really important is you and God, you and God, you and God. So it's not surprising to me, um, that a lot of the things that are scoring higher here are me and God, as opposed to the way I relate to community, love God, but not love neighbor. No, that's true. And we need community, the Sunday morning experience. Exactly.

As opposed to anything else. When that's not, yeah. Like really most communities happening not on Sunday morning. That's just when you gather together and do your thing. But, uh. And serve the poor and help the needy and make sure people are fed. Right. Instead of. Yeah, that's happening all the time. No, right, right, right. We've settled there. It's, um, what, what Jesus has otherwise represented as an, as an all inclusive existence. We've separated into buckets. Right. And said, uh, okay, get this relationship with Jesus.

And the truth is, is like you, um, that is the biggest distance of reconciliation, right? Like where Jesus kind of reconciles you back to him. And so you're looking for some sort of full understanding of that. I don't know that we'll actually come to that completely this, this side of eternity. And so if that is always the pursuit and you're waiting to strike, straighten that out before you actually participate in the things that actually inform that vision of things, um, you'll never get to them. And so you never progress. That's, that's not going to come out right. I don't mean progress beyond your relationship with Christ, but you're not becoming deeper in that relationship through the means of which he attaches all those things together. And so they become peripheral as opposed to essential. Does that make sense? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Okay. Hey, here's the thing is like, if I want to, if 86% say believing God is essential and the Bible is what introduces me to know who God is, his aspects of his character, how he relates to his people, that's actually probably why we miss all the rest of that stuff because we don't rest, we don't recognize how integrated it is to our relationship with Jesus. And because you're right, dad, to your point, right? Like where as, uh, the scripture where it ties, it ties the, the plight of the needy bolts to, to God's redemption story, but also the reaction of his people to that redemption story as the prime example of those things. If our reaction is distanced by about 35% to helping them or not helping them, that shows that I actually don't quite have a grasp on the revealed characteristics of the God that I believe in, right? Like I may say I believe in him, but I don't know him, which would then beg the question like, to what am I believing in? Like, what am I filling the gaps in?

Um, that's interesting. Like how, how many people that believe in God or follow a God have no idea who they're actually following? Um, or would be, it would be offended. I guess it's some of the stuff that scripture otherwise calls them to. And that's how you can, I think that to John's point, that makes sense that how you, how you can write some of those things off. Uh, it's, it's not out of malice, it's out of ignorance. Correct. I don't understand how those things are tied together, but because I didn't actually engage in the way, uh, God has, God has reached out to me in scripture or through my community. Um, anything besides my ability to, I don't even pray regularly. So I'm just going to hang out and hope the Holy Spirit blows me around the street. And when that doesn't happen, I say, well, things must've been fine. And so I miss out on the depth of that relationship, uh, and the broad

odd life that it calls me to because I kind of settled for a, um, I don't know, a cognitive assent that says, yeah, God's right. And I believe in that. And it just left us at the doorstep, left us dripping from the baptismal pool type of thing. Huh? Uh, 32, see 35 was attending religious services. 32% said not losing your temper is an essential part of what it means to be a Christian. See there, I would put that at a zero. Yeah. I don't know. It's certainly, it's not essential. Yeah. Who put that in this test? I guess they're trying to come up with random things that sound spiritual.

I mean, I, I get it. Like, uh, it just needs to be right. It needs to be directed toward righteous things. Uh, I'm angry, I'm angry at people being, uh, being beheaded, you know, but like, you know, I don't know. Jesus overthrew the thing. I mean, I get it. It's just going to be tied to the right thing. Yeah. Uh, helping out in your congregation is a 28. Dressing modestly is 26. 26% dressing modestly is an essential part of what it means to be a Christian. Interesting. I get, you know, there's truths to all of these things. I was just going to say, depending on where you emphasize scripture, I mean, somebody's

probably sitting there thinking, lest I cause my brother to stumble. Absolutely. Check. Essential part of my, my faith experience. So some of these ones towards the bottom like that, you're going to have that. I have to be really careful because I'm hot, you know, so I have to really be modest. I wasn't going to say anything because it's been a while since I've been here. It's just embarrassing. And some of the guys, that's, you know, that's just how it is. So modesty is a big part of my faith. I understand three buttons down is reckless, Dan. Yes. You got to know where your problems lie. Yeah. Yeah.

That's true. It's like, there's some, um, these aren't out of left field, right? There's elements here that make sense. Um, working to protect the environment, 22%, living a healthy lifestyle, resting on the Sabbath 18 is tied in with living a healthy lifestyle and lower than working to protect your environment. Boy, I just, I feel like I would answer that. And that's a fault in my own thought process is like, how could I, um, I don't know how to reconcile my attitude towards the Sabbath to what God actually calls it as. I feel like I don't value that in a way that I should. And I don't recognize the healthiness that surrounds the concept of rest. Um, and so I think that probably is a right reflection and it's something that we simply cannot, maybe as a, maybe as a culture that we can't seem to get on board with, like I personally struggle with, like that I, that as much as I would, uh, if a sin fault comes up in my life, I, um, I'm more than willing to point out and say sin, me and God agree on

this, but like, uh, and, and, and I'll fight for my own repentance to turn from those types of things and not crawl back to them. Um, but I'm pretty dismissive at the concept of rest. And that's a, that, that seems like a fault in like the God that says, do this. And that, that's, that's core, um, that I'm more willing to dismiss that. How do you write that? How do we write that wrong? Guessman? I feel like I ain't right about that. Is that just, is that a risk in my environment? Yeah. I, I don't know. I just think it's culturally, cultural thing. I would say. Are we can't better at rest?

I, from what I read in books, I don't know. We applaud people who are overwork, you know? Yeah. I mean, time and money, time and money. Right. There's no, I mean. Neither of those have, both of those are diluted by rest, I guess. Right. So if you're, if our value, cultural values are time and money and rest dilutes both. Right. Uh, at least, at least in shallow concept, then we don't value it. Yeah. There's nothing productive in resting. And maybe we have a tough time defining what rest is as well. Like, I don't know.

Right. Right. Is the rest God's calling you to watching NBA all day long? Is the rest God's calling you to, you know, constantly sleeping outside? Is the rest God's calling you to resting in Him? You know, extra study, extra quiet time, extra prayer. Defining Sabbath is just as important as taking it. Yeah. Boy, that's tricky. That's a tricky step. Okay. All right. Uh, what, hold on. What else did I see here? Um, let's see.

Working to protect your environment, living a healthy life. Here's the thing. I agree with those. I agree with those. And maybe here's the broad question. The reason I look at this, and I don't particularly want to spend a bunch of time, I guess, picking apart, um, our thought process here. But like, it's, um, we still seem overly focused, uh, or blindly focused, I guess, on moral rights and less on, um, rest, less on understanding the, the person and work of Jesus Christ and watching the moral rights kind of fall a lot. You know what I'm saying? Like, we're, we're more, we seem more attuned to, um, setting out the ability of your church as the Holy, of the church community around you or yourself as policing your own self as a Holy Spirit, as opposed to following Jesus and then letting that kind of permeate through your existence.

It's understanding that none of these things are completely off base, right? Like they're relevant attitudes, they're relevant concepts associated with following Jesus. But they're, um, they're still, they're still checkpoints. And I suppose it depends on who you are, but like, um, we might create a lot of righteous looking sniffing folk, um, and a very shallow amount of them following, actually following Jesus. And that's difficult. Um, because that's, that's actually the, that's not the right trajectory. Well, who's to say that when I don't start following Jesus and I get closer to his heart, that I won't be called to some component of righteousness that shows up on that list. So Jesus may reveal to me, the spirit may reveal to me, gosh, John, you're supposed to be focused on the environment. I'm just laying that on your heart. Make that a part of your righteous living.

I might say that's essential then, because God's told me that, or I might say it's essential. I need to stop lying or I need to be good to my neighbor. I need to, to serve the poor. So my hope is that that person who answered that is tied into who God is and how God loves. And God has said to them, Hey, go love the environment. That's what I've called you to do. You're a teacher. You're a preacher. You're a healer. You may not be all those things. Yeah. You know, so that, that's my hope is that those bottom, the bottom half of that test is really about who and where they've been called. Yeah. Yeah.

Not so much about, are all these things important or not, but yeah, I found that through the Holy spirit, this is where I'm supposed to go to the tree. I got to hug that tree today, whatever it is. Yeah. What was, uh, there are a couple other interesting things here. Uh, when weighing major life decisions, seven out of 10 evangelicals and nine out of 10 highly religious evangelicals said they prayed comparison, four out of 10 mainline Protestants and Catholics and eight out of 10 highly religious mainland products. I don't care about any of that. Nevermind. I don't know. Those don't seem like unnecessary distinctions. We pray more than you do. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. So I, I guess the, um, um, I don't know. It was, it just, it just struck me though at like, um, it has to do with the questions, I guess they asked, but Jesus isn't on the list. Right. And like a God is, but like just some of those gaps make me think, um, uh, what, what, what are we missing? Like, is, are we not talking about things right? Are we, are we still more morally focused than we intend to be understanding that, that like I said, there, it's not like the Bible is shy of an ethic. It's just, um, I, I struggle with, uh, kind of the pampering of, of Christianity to look like something that it still isn't because it's not Christ focused. Maybe that was my, my reaction is I thought like I, I would have expected it, if things were right in the world, um, kind of Christ to permeate through all those. And it, it was just a religious prop test, but that also could be the format of what they're

asking, right? Like if that's what they asked, it's not like you could avoid the answers and you had a certain, uh, line to be able to deal with. So maybe that's it, but all right. Interesting. Uh, all right. So here, here was, there was a, there was a dear life in the path, uh, that we got from a listener. And, uh, I thought maybe you guys can help me kind of parse this out. It's, it's pretty, uh, it's pretty basic, but he says, look, I love to work a lot. I like working three jobs and all that, but now I'm going to be in a position that I can work a ton of overtime for big money. Um, but I also have a young family. And so how do I both work hard and spend time with my family? How do I find the right balance between those two understanding that I want

to provide? Um, but I also kind of want to understand my, my right role as a, um, as coming up as a young husband or I am a young husband and coming up as a young father. Um, how do I, how do I do that? How do we start to parse out finding the right balance between those things? I'd say you can either rethink about your definition of provide. That doesn't mean just financially. Okay. And providing things, your presence is providing as well. So, so that's a, I mean, that would be a starting point. Okay. Okay. I mean, he has to do both though. Yeah. Right.

So like that's kind of his position for both. So like, uh, how, what, uh, how do you know, how do you know what's too much? Well, I like the overtime thing. Is this an extended thing or is it like, like permanent or is it like, Hey, we're going to go through a phase of six months where dad's going to be really busy. Um, but that's just part of my job. You know, so I mean, I, I go through phases where I'm like really busy and, and phases when I'm not so busy. Yeah. Uh, it's just, it's, it's just seasons of, of, of work. The farmers, some, some days they're, I mean, I, I'm not a farmer, but, uh, you know, they're in the field 24 seven for X amount of time. Yeah. And then there's seasons when they're not, you know, I mean, it's just kind of how it is.

Um, so if it's not a long, Hey, we want you to permanently work 60 hours, 80 hours, whatever it is a week. Uh, I wouldn't worry about it. I think we're like who, who decided 40 hours is like it, you know? Yeah. I mean, I can't, I don't know in my life if I've ever worked as little as 40 hours. I mean, since I, I mean, you know, I mean, so I always kind of troubled when people like, Oh man, I'm really working overtime this week. I worked in five hours. I'm like, really? I did that by Tuesday. I mean, you know, so it's hard to, to relate sometimes to that. Um, at the same time, like coming from my perspective, I have an open up schedule when I could, I, I, I could free up my schedule at other times, uh, and be with the family and the kids when they were younger.

Um, when other people were at work, uh, so yeah, you just make it work. You make it work. Um, but yeah, you should put a cap on it though. I mean, whatever that cap is for your family. I want to go over X amount of hours. Uh, so I don't know how much overtime he's talking about. Um, is it 10 hours a week? Yeah. That's hardly on. That's, you know, that's not that a couple hours a day. Sure. I think be aware of priority and purpose, you know? So if I, before I even start this process, if I can say, you know, what are my priorities and what is my purpose? You know, my purpose in taking this overtime isn't just to acquire more money, but is to

perhaps set up a savings account. So we have an emergency fund is to pay off some college debt is take care of a credit card is to, you know, make the baby's room, whatever it is. Um, that's my purpose. That's my priority. So I go, if I go into it without that, then whatever I spend time on just becomes my priority. Yeah. You know, so then I'm just blind and walking through. I just have to be doing this for 20 hours a day. I have no idea why. And I think that'll help guide him. You know, if, if, if, and he'll know that that season is done when it's done. Hey, I'm not seeing my family and I said they were my priority and I haven't seen my son, my daughter in four weeks and it's been too long. So I'm going to back it up.

Is God providing this opportunity for something extra cash? Right. Or are you just. Yeah. Yeah. Like whatever. I mean, yeah, I think that's a big thing. Whatever your priorities, what are you working toward? What are you, what are you doing with it? Um, so, so the right way to, uh, I suppose, yeah, I suppose I would agree with that. I think the, the thing is, is like, you have to, um, to, to what Josh was saying, and this is probably probably a combination of all these is that, um, all those things are valuable. And so, um, like anytime that you, I don't know, anytime it, what are you, what are you working for? Right.

Like if you were, um, if you're going to spend time and maybe you get to, you know, 300 extra bucks that week, but if you lost out on something that is otherwise intangible, that $300 can't buy it to you. Right. So like, um, if you set your value, actually, what was this? This is going to be an offensive thing to say, but I'm saying anyway, so like, um, it's, um, a lot of times when people talk about, um, people talk about the gender wage gap. Okay. What men and women make. Okay. I'm slinking out of camera. It's time to hide. So regardless of what, of what you think about that or how it got there, how our society either perpetuates that or it's completely reasonable to you. Um, most of the time, like some of, some of those distinctions are tied because ladies

are out of the workforce and they're, they're having children or spending time at home with children. And the truth is, is that like, I would actually consider like in those instances, the time that that, uh, is able to be able to spend with family and raising kids is way more valuable than the money that I'm able to generate at work, understanding that someone has to do it, but like, um, we're comparing things that aren't fair. You're comparing a strictly, um, apples to apples, like money to money. Whereas the experience that otherwise might've taken you out of the workforce has a much higher value to me than the time that I spent in the workforce and generated a few more dollars per hour. And like, I get that. That's like, I understand where the quality of the wages is coming from. So don't that's, I'm not attempting to speak to that. But what I'm saying is, is that like, we pulled ourselves out of seeing any value to the life experience that took you out of the job market for a year while you were having or raising

kids. Right. And so like, that, that's a, that's a, it's not a fair valuation. It's not a fair valuation of our life. Um, there are certain things that I simply won't agree to because the, I work to be able to spend that type of time with my wife and kids. And so if I get those priorities messed up and like, maybe I can have an excellent, fantastic career by the, I worked hard and I kept with the company and I'm 65 and I'm making 300 grand and I missed my kids growing up and I don't have a deep relationship with my wife because I couldn't spend the time with them. Like, what was I making all that money for? Yeah. Like how do, where did I direct my time? And so like, there's, um, there is a line there somewhere you're going to have to figure out what it is.

And this is, I would say it's too bad Mike's not here. Cause this, this, uh, question actually, I think sits in Mike's wheelhouse. Um, and it'd be one of the things where like, um, can you say no to something? Are you, are you looking out on your, on your life? And someone says, Hey, look, I'll give you another, I'll give you a thousand dollars to spend three hours out here helping me. And you're like, no, that's not worth it. My, my, I want to be home with my wife and kids. You can make another 10 grand a year. No, I won't do it. I want to be home with my wife and kids. I want to be able to spend that time doing that. And like, there's a responsibility to bring money in, but like, that is not the entirety of your provision. And, um, if you, if you succeed on bringing money into your house, but you fail at actually

providing leadership and guidance and directing people to your Lord and showing love and grace to your family, um, then you could have doubled your salary and you, you still failed in that area. And so I would say, yeah, that distinction relies on, um, uh, you will help make the right decision there when you set your priorities, right. And once you understand your priorities, you'll bucket your time, uh, and the money that you spend or the time you spend to get money, uh, into the right priorities. And so does that include working overtime? Yeah. At times it does. Like, um, sometimes like from, from my perspective, my wife stays home and that costs something, right? That's not a, that's not something where I've had some people, Hey, you're, you're real lucky that your, your wife gets to stay home with the kids. I'm like, well, no, actually that costs quite a bit of money that we, that we otherwise would

have, right. If she were working that, that wasn't free, that cost me something, but it was a right. It was a priority that we felt like we could do. And that was important for us. And so like, um, but that, but that's just a choice that we made and that's fine with it. But, but, uh, that's, that's a balance, right? That's something that had to choose that was worth it. So sometimes that requires that, uh, money has to come from somewhere. And if it's not coming from there, we have to figure out extra ways to get it. And so like, but that's, that's my circumstance and that's fine because that's what I asked for. But just recognizing that, um, sometimes that comes along with that, but that is just, it happened as a result of my priorities or what I felt was important, what we wanted to do. And, uh, every decision I made from there on is just a result of those choices.

So, you know, I guess just, just something to think about, just make your, um, just make your, sit your priorities down. Here's what I care about. And then, uh, how you can spend your time in light of those priorities will, I think will straighten itself out. I think very much. Yeah. I think Dan, Dan had some wisdom over there, you know, in seasons, would you say that again? I'm going to say it one more time. You can write it down. I think Dan had some, some wisdom over there, um, that in seasons, there might be times you have to work overtime and that that's the only way to be a good father or to be a good mother. You know, sometimes you will pick up that third job to be a good mother or a good father because there's things that have to be done.

So I don't think any of us are saying that, Oh, if you work overtime, you have bad priorities. Or if you take an extra job or you make, if you made a lot of money, you obviously didn't care about your family. Or both your parents work. Yeah. That's not what I'm saying. No, not at all. Just that make sure you're doing it for the purposes, which you intended to do it for. Yeah. You know, I set out to be a great dad. And so because of that, I got to get this debt taken care of. I got to get this car paid off. I got to make sure you've got something safe for college, whatever it is. Not just, I got to make some bank, you know, cheddar's paper. I got to have some of that.

For my pride. It makes me feel good. Look what I've done. I've done this great thing. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And I suppose aligning, making sure that your values are rightly aligned. Right. Not just that you have them weighed correctly, but that you actually value the right things. And that matches up with what your spouse and children value. Right. Because like there have been met guys who, I mean, they worked their bones off, man. Those guys were bone tired and barely got around. They worked so hard in their life to produce something that, to be honest, their family

didn't value. Right. They valued their time with him. They valued their relationship with him that they never had. And the guy thought he was just rocking it because he produced the money and he took care of a house. And the deal is, is they would have taken a house half the size and they would have taken, you know, one less car or a car that's 10 years older for some extra time with their dad or the chance for him to be at the bowl games or to, you know, to, to be able to be at home, to demonstrate the right relationship example with his wife for their kids. And the thing is, is, is that like the day, this is, this is commonplace for dudes. Dudes think they're firing on all cylinders. I'm nailing it. I got this thing down and it's not, it's really not what anybody wanted. Right.

But they're, but they're doing what they're doing the right, the wrong thing with the right intention. And, uh, but that's easily solvable. Figure out what the, what's valuable, not just to you or what you think is right. Hey, I worked hard. Isn't that enough? And then you come and sit your, sit your butt down and you don't do anything at home. Well, like you don't get to check out. That's not even what your family values. It's not what your wife values. The things that you thought they were giving them, um, isn't what they care about. And so, um, you actually have to lead in that area too, which is you start to develop, you pursue those relationships with your wife and kids and make sure that what they value, um, is what you're also putting as priority so that you don't make the mistake of saying, I value this.

I thought I was providing when you actually provided the need that they weren't asking to be mad to, to that extent. So it's just something that some of the consider that you may not, um, your perspective may not even be the right one. I don't know how many times I've been on the wrong side of, Hey man, this would really meets my wife needs. And then I find out that no, it didn't at all. It wasn't, I was completely wrong in that regard. And I would have known that had I been talking to my wife about it. Right. Um, but I just decided this is what's going to help this problem. And like, what did I, um, I thought about this the other day. Uh, one of my kids made me something, uh, and they left it kind of on my nightstand. I was out late doing something, um, for church or whatever. And I came home and it was like, uh, hi daddy.

I really, I really miss you. I like it when you play ball with me. And I thought of the list of things that I care about that I do with my kids, that's like on like 10 of out of 10. I don't like it. I don't like standing there and throwing the ball around. Like I'd rather read something to you or talk with you about something or go do like, there's a bunch of other things around my list. And this was the thing that was important to her. And I thought, ah, crap, like I got my stuff wrong. Right. Like I, um, uh, I want to, I want to meet her. She thinks this is important. And it's the last thing that I generally want to do. And there was, um, I noticed this one of my kids is like, uh, is a hugger and like, and

like always, I don't, maybe you guys got a kid like this, right? There's got to one kid, maybe a couple of them that like want to jump on you and hold, grab on and hang. And I'm like, oh, I just don't want you hanging on me today. Can you back? I just got in the door. And then I, and then I think to myself, what the heck? That's terrible. That's terrible. My kid comes in and wants to jump on me. And my first reaction is I've been sitting in my butt at an office all day. You do not need to be hanging on me. Those things are not even correlated. They don't even go together. It's so stupid.

And I thought, I thought that's just, uh, it made me feel, it made me feel foolish because I thought, first of all, where do I come with this? And I, it's in my mind that I don't want you hanging on me. I actually don't even care. But then I thought like this thing, look at the smile on that kid's face when she runs in the door and she makes a grab and wants to hang. And I, the first thing I can think of is don't, don't hang on me. Give me my space. Yeah. And I thought, and I felt so, I felt so silly and, and I've tried not to make that mistake again. I actually don't like it. I don't know why I don't like it. I just wanted you to let me go. But like, but like the joy on that kid's face makes me think I got my priorities wrong.

Like I just want to be able to come in and not have someone hang on me. And the exact thing that she really wants is to come in and hang on me. And I thought, okay, I can actually yes to that. I got the wrong thing. And the thing is that's such a short lived amount of time in the spectrum of life. I mean, they'll hit 11, 12 and, and it stops. I mean, it just, bam, it just, you know. Don't talk like that. I don't want to hear that. Yeah. Sorry. It's just, it's just over. So enjoy every hanging moment you have. Yeah. And then it gets to some point.

It's just like awkward. It's like, okay, you really shouldn't be hanging on me. But, uh, 26, it's time to let go. Can I sleep in your bed? No. Well, I think at 10,000 foot level, we're saying practically too, with this conversation is you don't set your purpose and priorities once. So you don't decide today, you know, I'm going to take this overtime gig, go back to the question. And I'm not going to do it forever. Yeah. I mean, you're talking about how, oh man, I looked back on that note and I realized I need to reset my priorities again today. You know, I'm going to look back on after this week of doing this. Let's talk to my spouse again. Let me talk to my kids again. What's important today? Yeah.

You don't just do this once. So communicate, communicate, communicate. What's your purpose? We went to the mall tonight. Mostly because I used to get some walking because I looked at my little walker thing and it's like I hadn't done anything today. I was sitting there but it's like, hey, let's go do some walking. So we're walking around and we'd walk by a store and I'm like, hey, we used to bring our daughter there all the time. Remember that? I'm thinking, she's getting married in three weeks. Yeah. I mean, just like, it just hit me like, holy crap, time flies. I mean, it is just, bam. So the balance is the big thing. I mean, make sure you have the relationship going. Make sure that you have those moments where you're playing ball and letting them hang on you and doing whatever happens.

But also the reading and the conversations. Yeah. But again, it has to be some them time. You know, if they're getting nothing out of the relationship that they want at some point, they'll just back off and say, yeah, this isn't really for me. So you've got to have both. And so sometimes your overtime is with your kids. You know, that is overtime. Yeah. And I kind of looked at it that way, too. Like with my wife, you know, and how we did work. She's always had a little part-time thing. And so we haven't been rolling in the money really ever, you know. But then we figured, well, later on when the kids are gone, she can work as much as she wants, you know. And we just hit that stage. You know, she just took on a different job a month or so ago.

And it's going to change some things for us, hopefully. But she can now. Yeah. You know, so you hold off for a few years. And anyway, I don't know what I'm saying. I'm going with that. It's just a marathon. You can't look at it today and tomorrow. It's a marathon. You've got to look at the whole race and pace yourself. And somewhere in there you find your balance. Or it's out of balance periodically one way or another. But it all makes sure you've got the end goal in line in your mind. And balance that thing. And so pull back once in a while.

Lean in once in a while. Pull back once in a while. Just like you do in a race, you know. Yeah. And I think you can use, you can let your community help you out with that stuff. Yeah. Just make sure you've got people in your life who will say, hey, dude, it's overdone. It's overdone. How many times have you been home this week? Get home. Yeah. Stop doing what you're doing. You know, like have people who would otherwise share your, like God sets your general priorities. Your family refines in what ways those otherwise blend out. And then your community helps you stick to them.

And so that's okay. Just make sure you've got people that are in your life that will say, it's too much. Like I've had that happen to me a couple times. And frankly, I've had probably 15 more where I wish it had. Um, or I got burnt on something or I spent too much time doing stuff. And, and, um, my relationships, my close relationship had suffered a little bit. And, uh, uh, I wish I'd been more clear with, with folks around me that knew different that, that could have, would have said that to me because I needed someone else to, to bring that up and say, look, it's too much. It's too much. You're fighting for the wrong thing. And I know why you're doing it. I know you have the best intention, but you're failing. And, uh, and so you need to write that ship.

And so then I have the opportunity to do that. And so having people that are close to you that care about the things that you care about, like your wife and your kids and your, uh, your other kind of priorities in life, um, they'll help you refine that where you stink at it, where you've gotten blind. Um, they'll, they'll rip off the thing. So that's okay. That's okay. All right. Uh, very good. Uh, dear life on the path. My husband is extremely critical of others. He almost never has anything nice to say about anyone. He bad mouths his coworkers, friends, family members, and strangers. That seems like a real peach. We don't have friends anymore because he doesn't want to be around them.

I don't understand his type of personality. Yikes. I can't, I can't do this without commentary. Mike's got to do it. He thinks his way of thinking and doing things is the only right way. And everyone else is wrong. He's open. Shoot. Maybe this is me. He's always quick to shift the blame when something goes awry. If he accidentally bumps into someone or breaks something, it's never his fault. The person was in his way or the broken object was junk, et cetera. What makes people this way? Is there any hope that he can change? We are nearing retirement age and I need my space.

I cannot be his everything. Holy cat. So he's been that way forever? Their whole marriage? Well, boy, sounds like it. Because my first thought was maybe there's some health issue or something, you know, there's some underlying stress or, huh. Someday he'll change though. Someday. Boy, I mean, that guy, this guy sounds like a caricature. And it could be. Like a six-year-old. She could be exaggerating. Boy, I really hope so. He has no friends.

He badmouths absolutely every category of person. Runs into people. Like he's a characteristic bully from an Adam Sandler movie. He's ridiculous. So what makes people this way? Is there any hope that he can change? We are nearing retirement age and I need my space. What do you say to this woman? This man needs a hobby for retirement. It sounds like belittling people and knocking them over is part of the options. They need to have their alone time. Man. What do you do here? I don't think it's ever too late for Christian accountability. I think somebody's got to be honest with this guy in a gentle way.

Maybe it's her. You know, hey. But they'll be wrong. Yeah, I don't want to harm you or hurt you or make you feel bad, but you're hurting people. You know, do you notice that we don't have a big hangout with? Do you notice we have to be alone because of the way you act? I love you. I want to do things with you. I want to be with you, spend time with you in public, and not have you accost people. So help me out. Let's work on this together. It's never too late to reach out in love for a little accountability, I think. That's my answer. Yeah, that's true. That's pretty optimistic, Wagner.

You see, I mean, he seems like if he's chased off every friend he's had and coworkers, friends, family members, and strangers. See, here's a little truth. I'm going to tack on the end of this. You know, I work with, I know a person just like this. Really? Yeah. And this person is aware that they do this, and they feel terrible about it. Oh. But they have no, they have, they feel as though they, this is the only way they know how to be. That's their instinct. You know, exactly. And as hard as they try to overcome this particular way of living, they can't. Or when they try, it backfires, and it's even worse, and they quickly fall back into old patterns. Okay. So I talk to this person very frequently, and it just tears them up.

Tears them up that he's this way. So before we were quick to say, like, wow, this dude is just awful. He knows exactly what's happening. He's choosing to be bad. You know, some people have an interesting way, or they don't understand how to be different. So I really do think that the only reason I'm being optimistic in this is I see the progress that comes in having conversations. Yeah. So you know you're doing this. Yeah, I know I'm doing it. And what are you actively doing to be different then? Right. You know, how are you trying to live differently? Well, I tried these things, and it didn't work. Okay, let's come up with another solution. Let's try something different.

Grace, grace, grace. More grace. So, and I guess that's true, is, like, what we have is we have a man's life painted by simply what he does. You don't know anything about his motivation, whether he struggles with it or not, that kind of thing. Yeah, watch this man cry about having no friends, and then you'll know that it's not just one person saying, you know, he does everything terrible. Maybe he knows he does everything terrible, and he doesn't know what to do about it. Maybe she's such a bad wife, she's never talking about him. Bones into someone, and it's never his fault? I mean, isn't that a little child or so? Sure. Sure, okay. Sure. All right. In a practical sense, if they're getting toward retirement, she's worried about spending more time with him. She needs to find some things that she does alone.

I mean, I think every retired couple, you know, because you've spent your whole life either away from each other with one in the workforce and one at home, or both of you in the workforce. Either way, you're not together. Yeah. And then suddenly, like, 24-7 be together, you know, that actually is stressful for people, I've heard. So you've got to have your own thing going on. But, yeah, I love the accountability thing. I know personally, because it's happened so rarely, but when my wife says something like that that is, like, totally against what I'm doing, it really makes me think. I don't like it. But I may not respond positively at the moment. But usually I'm like, ah, she's right. Yeah. Yeah. I probably have about a six-hour prideful embarrassment. Yeah. Yeah.

I generally got to sleep on it, is when I get over it. Yeah. I really don't like to be told I've done something incorrect. You have a character flaw. Yeah. And, like, here's the deal. It's like, and I know this. I know this while it's happening. Yeah. And, like, it's more so because, and it's almost always my wife, but, like, because she's right. And I feel embarrassed that I've acted that way and not known it. Right? That, like, I had done something that I had unintentionally known, which is, like, the most easiest thing to get out of and say, oh, man, I didn't realize I was doing that. You're right. I'm sorry.

Right? Like, it's a built-in excuse or reason, at least. And that's, I'm at my worst when I've done something that, or acted in a certain way that I'm embarrassed of, but just, like, I don't want to hang on to it for a while. Not because, not because I think I was right, but because I know I was wrong. Yeah. And I don't, and it's just embarrassing to kind of deal with that straight up. Yeah. I can think of, like, distinct times in my marriage where I've been that way. And, like, the whole time, I'm thinking in my mind, I don't want to, I don't, I just let this go. All you got to do is say it. All you got to do is say it and let this go. And then something will come up and, like, you just make the choice to kind of keep it rolling for a little bit longer until you can find a breaking point that doesn't have, so you don't have to deal with your thing kind of head on. We'll roll back to your question now. What if every person you came in contact with told you that? Every person this person talks to, you know, he turns away.

He's got no friends. Every single person you talked to was, like, hey, you're not very smart. Yeah. Like, you've been doing this wrong. Yeah. Like, you shouldn't be doing this. You totally turned out on yourself. No, that's true. That's true. And, like, there's a natural defensiveness that as you work, even if you're trying to work that out, is you don't release that. Because the truth is, is, like, you give, to go the opposite way, that gives people some level of control of your life. Right? If they have the ability to speak something that otherwise changes how you behave, they've exerted some sort of power over you. And whether you can handle that in a healthy way or not is generally a combination of a pride issue, but it's also a self-confidence thing. Right?

How do I know whether you're right or not? I actually don't even – if I could be so wrong in that, what does that say about how I think, how I look at the world, and complete – especially complete strangers who seem to have a better line in my life than I do? And so, like, it's granted that that's a difficult thing to deal with, and it takes a right frame of mind to allow those things to change. And that's very hard with a lot of how we – I don't know, how we understand our own value. If we have kind of those misplaced, dealing with all the rest of that stuff is very difficult. And it's power that I don't want to give to somebody else. It is perspective that I don't want to admit because it proves that, like, I feel like I should have got it, and that actually doubles down on the things that I felt were wrong. So, yeah, I think that's all very difficult, actually, to be able to deal with that. Secular says, it appears you married a self-entitled misanthrope. Not knowing him, I can't guess why your husband is this way. Change is possible in anyone, if the person recognizes the need for it and wants to change. From your description, he must be a heavy load to carry, and I doubt he will admit the need. Not as optimistic as Wagner. If you want to continue this marriage and save your sanity after he retires, you must create separate time, hobbies, and relationships for yourself apart from him. And be prepared in advance for the fact that he won't like it one bit.

Does that seem right? Pretty close, except for the lack of optimism. All right. All right, all right, all right. Here we go. Let's see. I don't care about that one. That was mine. Oh, here we go. All right. Dear Life on the Path, I'm writing this as a warning. Oh, good. Oh, goody. An open letter to everyone. Especially to older women who get married and are overly optimistic about…

No, that's not right. Get married a second time to someone with adult children. Please keep your own money separate, if at all possible. Throughout our long marriage, I trusted my second husband to do what he promised me and my relatives. He arranged very good financial care for me in the event of his death and assured me that I would want for nothing. Unbeknownst to me… Sorry, Dan. Unbeknownst to me, until it was too late, my husband had left power of attorney to his money-hungry children, who proceeded to take advantage of his dementia and very old age. Tragically, he convinced… Oh, where'd it go? There we go. Tragically, they convinced my husband to divorce me. This brought me much heartbreak, shock, and lack of trust after a happy long marriage. Because I'm a strong person, I've learned to cope and take care of myself.

It wasn't easy and the process has been slow, but I'm succeeding. Along the way, I've learned some painful but valuable lessons. I would like my experience to help other women, especially older traditional women like me, who have spent most of their lives taking care of their husbands and are dependent on them to take responsible, proper, and loving financial care of us. Thank you, Abby. That was not otherwise designed to imply a direct circumstance, Dan, but I did sniff some relevance to something we've talked about before. I don't know. I didn't catch it. I didn't catch it. So is she saying that older women should make sure they're planning themselves for retirement and keep it separate from their husband? Yes. Yes, that's what she's saying. Yeah. Because otherwise circumstances can change.

Money-hungry children jump in, and they cause money to not be directed to the person that they expected it to go to. Yeah, that can happen. Yeah. I've heard all about that. So is that the right reaction, though? Separate the money? How do you handle that appropriately? Well, I don't know if it's separating money as much as make sure you have your own savings for retirement. And if it all is great at the end, then I guess you put it all together, and you have a great pool of money, but I don't know. So I'm a relatively young married man. Should I approach that with my wife now and say, look, I don't know that you won't be taken in and change your ways? Yeah, this circumstance was a second marriage, yes?

So the children may or may not have vested interests in this particular woman, may not have liked her, there could be some animosity. Yeah, that's not their mom. Right. Not that that makes it right or wrong, I just think that it makes the circumstance unique. That's true. And this wasn't a, like, they've manipulated this, if you want to assume it that way, during the marriage, like they convinced my husband to divorce me. In dementia. In dementia. I mean, so, yeah, they probably did. Yeah, yeah. I don't know, is there a reason the husband didn't give her power of attorney?

Oh, boy. Because, I mean, if she had power of attorney, I feel like that would have happened. And the money thing would have been straightened out. How often do you update your will? Yeah. So, like, if I'm not divorced, I love my wife, I'm not planning on getting divorced, but where I get divorced, you know, there's a whole bunch of things you've got to take care of. Maybe he doesn't update his will. Maybe his kids are now his power of attorney. When he gets divorced, he five years passes, he gets remarried, doesn't think to go back and do it. And then they end up in the situation.

Yeah. Maybe that's a point, is, like, you don't, this seems kind of terrible, but, like, it makes you have to consider what wrong things people would do. Yeah. Sure. So that you plan for them correctly. And that's something, maybe, generally, we don't want to admit. See, that's where, that's what I was thinking. Like, you know, I may or may not have had a situation where I had a father who assumed the best of his relatives. And so it would have been, like, an insult to say, well, I'm not sure that I trust you,

so I'm putting this money in a separate trust fund, you know, because I'm pretty sure you're going to try to rob my children someday. Yeah. Doesn't mean you shouldn't have done it, looking in hindsight. Yeah. But, um, I don't know, I don't know. I mean, if it were me, I'd do the same thing, though. You know, it'd be like, we're a family, this is what we're doing, here's my wishes, it's written, it's in writing right here in the will. Yeah. I've got to provide for my wife first. I'm blending stories, sorry. Yeah. They talked him out of supporting his wife. Yeah.

Yeah, they were just greedy. Yeah, that's tricky. And so, um, I, I suppose just, uh, not to say plan for the worst, but, like, you plan for the worst. Like, you just, just consider what circumstances may impact here. Like, having her as a power of attorney would have, would have done that. You know, and here's the deal, it's like, um, extreme circumstances do weird things to people. Um, and it doesn't have to imply that the root of their character is evil, but it does mean that sometimes temptations become too great for folks. And so, if you have the right, if you have a good option, it is to try to keep that responsibility off them. So, you know what, um, uh, be very clear in your, uh, in your trust documents. You know, this is exactly what is to happen with this stuff. This is not up to your discretion.

Um, this does not put too much of a load on someone that you know is, is unfair for them to carry. Um, wheels are difficult. Wheels can be contested. Trust, trust are a good call with multiple trustees and them that keep people accountable to them. Um, and so, I mean, there's ways, I mean, if you have a real shysty person, don't put them in your stuff, but like understanding that, um, dropping a, uh, a big amount of money can be a bad temptation to someone. And so, um, try to lighten that burden by being real specific about things or handling it through a, uh, disinterested third party or something. Um, if you want some, some assurance, because the truth is, is humanity gets on full display when big amounts of money are available. And, um, so like, of course it lies on people that they've reacted poorly to it. But like, if I want to avoid that circumstance, I just pull that responsibility

from them and maybe let it lie somewhere else. Um, if it's something that I feel like is important or that will cause risk in certain areas. So, and that stinks, but it's, it's just the nature of the beast. You know, I, I work, my other work is related to like, um, you know, people coming into certain like large amounts of money. And it's just, it's, it's actually very difficult. It changes the dynamics of people's lives and they don't have to do deal with it well. Uh, in fact, Buva would probably tell you this too, is like sometimes, um, it, um, it exacerbates rough parts of your character to put, um, to put opportunity within your reach and money will sometimes do that. Um, in fact, money will often do that. And so, um, you know, just be careful about where you're directing it. Even if you have good intentions, know that depending on when your life ends, that, that might be something that you put your own kids at risk.

And so you have to think through those things and it's difficult, but you, you can, um, you know, parent them even through that if you're the parent. And so just maybe some steps to take. All right. Uh, let's see. Dear, Hey, if you're joining us, by the way, Hey, thanks for hanging out with us, uh, tonight. We're, we're giving a shot to a broadcast live on Facebook. So if you're out there on Facebook, uh, and I'm trying to pay attention, make sure I catch any of your questions. So, uh, I appreciate you hanging out with us, but, uh, yeah, feel free to interact, leave comments and that kind of thing. And, uh, we'll give that Facebook stuff a try and see how things go. So, uh, secular advice, what was done to you is disgraceful. And I hope your letter will serve as a warning to other wives. If your husband had shown you the documents he had drawn up regarding his estate planning

and he and his lawyer had explained them all to you, this wouldn't have happened to me. The lesson here is trust, but verify. And I hope others will learn from your experience before it's too late for them. Um, yeah, I think there's also elements of that too, is, uh, I, I have a wrong underlying assumption that I will be around forever and be able to help my wife, uh, deal with certain things. And so I've not put, even at my age, I probably should have done a, should be doing a better job of putting things in place to make sure that things are taken care of. Like I handle a lot of, all of our financial stuff and I pay all the bills. I know where all our assets are. And, uh, there were things that she, she just wouldn't know about, um, if I were to die. And just in case, based upon that knowledge, you attempt to kill me, we do not have extensive assets. See previous conversation.

It's like eight 50 somewhere in a credit union. I mean, $8 and 50 cents. So it's not worth killing me. My wife does not know about it. Actually. I got like, I put $5 into a credit union 12 years ago and I have $5 and 36 cents. And, uh, I don't know. I mean, they, they really need to institute a program where they just send me my five bucks back and say, look, we just, we don't need you, buddy. They're sticking it out. God bless them. So, uh, okay. All right. All right. Let's see.

Let's do, uh, let's do one more here. Dear life in the path. I have encountered an over hugger. I hug often, but respect how others feel about it. This person does not extend that courtesy. His typical hug involves picking the recipient up off the ground, which I think is his way of showing off. The last time I saw him, I offered my hand. Instead, he yanked me in and said, we give hugs here. It felt invasive. I know he is trying to show love, but he puts his own desire before the needs of others. I want to tell him not to hug me anymore. However, it's complicated because we are part of a loose knit athletic community and people hug left and right at our events. I hug a lot of people, but I'm polite about it.

Not only would I likely have to declare no hugs to him in front of others, but it would become obvious that we don't hug. Am I odd to not want him to hug me? Would I be wrong to just tell him I prefer a handshake? Over hugged. How do you handle these affairs, boys? How do you handle it? That's not legitimate advice. I'm sorry. Guessman, are you a hugger? Not really. No, not really. Not really. Dan, would you call yourself a hugger? I'm a toucher.

I will often touch people on the shoulder like, hey, while I'm shaking their hand. Mostly because I know some people just aren't huggers, so you give them space. Wagner, are you a hugger? I'm a recipient of hugs. If someone offers me a hug, I hug back, but I don't generally approach people with hugs. If someone throws me the open arms, I'll throw them the open arms back. We'll go get it, but I don't walk up to somebody like that. Yeah, yeah. You can test it out. It's all right. You can test it out. Okay, okay. All right, so what's the right answer? Just say you don't want to be hugged. Excuse me, sir.

I really appreciate your friendship, but I would not like a hug today. What about tomorrow? Or tomorrow. In fact, I don't like to be hugged. Just tell them you've got a personal bubble. I've got a bubble here. I've got a problem with germs. I don't like your body hair. Whatever it is, it bothers me. Thanks, pal. But it's just his hugs that they have a problem with, right? Just his hugs? Yeah. You can hug me, but why don't you just leave my feet on the ground? Or I don't know.

It seems like you just have a problem with this one guy's hugs. Yeah. I wonder if this is actually the root of stuff or if there's something else going on under here. Because here's the deal. It opens with, I hug often, but respect how others feel about it. He's like an elitist hugger that says, I have respect for people. This guy overdoes it. And so I'm very judgmental about his hugging. He's like a snob. It's a hug snob. Exactly. Yes. I think he's probably getting ready to retire. His wife wrote us earlier. Like, how often do you see this guy that it's an issue for you?

Like, he put in his letter that this guy's putting his own needs above others. Well, aren't you doing the same thing? Like, let this guy hug you. Yeah. What do you, yeah. Just let, I don't know. Isn't that, is it? It lasts too long, right? No? Walk away. Like, he surprise you with hugs? Right. From behind? Like, who do you pick you up and you don't see him coming? Like, just turn the other way.

Go pick up the basketball. Shoot some more hoops. Whatever it is. Yeah. You can get away from a hug. Trust me. Plenty of people have gotten away from my hugs in high school. Let's put it that way. It's all right. Now I had a high school John Wagner image running down the hallway chasing after a group of folk. Doing your best. Just doing my best. I just like to cuddle. So, yeah, actually, I'm kind of with Guestman here. I know this sounds, you've got two options here.

I think the option one is difficult. If you tell, you can be honest with him and say, look, I just don't like to hug. But if he's like a gregarious hugger, you know, it's possible he's not going to take that right. You know, he's going to say, hey, hey, I don't really want to hug today. Oh, of course you do. It's going to go in for one. And then now what are you going to do? Now it's a joke. And now it's like every time. Now it's over the top. Yeah. Like you might, because there are people that are like that, right? And so like as soon as you introduce that, it's like, hey, that's the guy who doesn't like hugs. We're going to hug it out. Like he just assumes that you're wrong and you just need more love to set it straight.

What is this world coming to? There's guys, there's guys, in fact, I could see that happening to me because I would be the guy that would try to put it off. And then now I'm in some kind of altercation with the man. I really don't want your hug. And now I look stupid. I look really ridiculous yelling at a man because I do not want his hug. Perspective. Gregarious huggers put you in a weird position. So I think to stay out of that particular conversation, I think I've just got to change my mind on it. So assuming he's not giving me head lice with his body hair or whatever, I feel like I just have to, if he's a big hugger, I just need to jump right in and say, you know what? I've changed my mind. I love it. Hug away, Bruce. I think that's the right answer. His name is Bruce.

Yeah. You've got a Bruce in your life. We just figured that out. Yeah. He doesn't bring me down and he gives hugs. That's what he does. So yeah, I think I'm going with the embrace the hug from Bruce. But you're still, you're on talk it out. I'm on personal space. Hey, if you've got a problem with it, just say, hey, I can't deal with your hug right now. I like you. You're a great guy. I'm not all about your hugs. And then I would say, that sounds like a guy that needs a hug. And then I go in and hug you.

Right cross. You're going to physically assault me for wanting to hug you? I'm just laughing at, I think these are great. I appreciate Life from the Path being so popular to receive these requests. But I mean, like, dear Life from the Path, there are children starving in Africa. Dear Life from the Path, we're concerned about the welfare of widows and orphans. Dear Life from the Path, there's this guy who hugs me too much. I don't know what to do with myself. That's what I'm saying. Just take the hug and move on. I'm saying you are one public defense away from having a gregarious hug. You're turning the tables and making you look silly. And there's no reason to open yourself up for it. And Dan, I'd be careful with saying I'm a toucher. That didn't strike me as odd.

I didn't specifically say shoulders. Don't get a bumper sticker. It was a dramatic pause. I actually found that I, oh man, actually this puts me in a weird spot. Because now I'm thinking that maybe I don't have a right. But like, I'm not much for hugging folk. But like, I have found. You don't even hug your kids. I don't. I just want to stand from afar and judge your mother's parenting. So, but I do find that like, there's certain groups of people where I'm like, yeah, this seems like a hugging situation. I'm in. Like older folk, I feel like they want hugs. And so I've said, I'm in.

I'm new hugging in here. And there's some people's moms that I'm like, I feel like this family hugs. I'm in on this thing. But like my family, we don't do that. But I've never, like, I'm not, I don't think I've ever hugged Mike ever. We've not done a brother moment ever. Hmm. Wow. Yeah. I don't know, shaking hands or anything. Hmm. You know, I used to meet with a group of guys in Colorado. And they're all like this manly men guy, you know. And we'd always like end the week. There was like this one, there was just one big group hug section.

Which you wouldn't see that out of these guys. And it seemed natural then. It was just like, they're like bear hug, you know, like, bam, bam, bam. You know, slapping each other's back. And they just seemed to work there. But there's a lot of places that would be just odd. Hmm. Yeah. I don't know. Okay. All right. Well, that's not a legit problem. I'm sorry we couldn't help you. Yeah, we didn't really offer much. No, yeah, that's true.

Suck it up. Or not. Or not. We offered you two chances. All right. Take the hug. Say no to the hug. Finally, here we go. Dear Life in the Path. Recently, a guy I've known for more than a year decided it would be best for us to part ways. Before Christmas, I had asked what he would like for Christmas. His response was, I don't want anything for Christmas. I want you. He's cheesy. You should have dumped him already.

A couple of weeks later, he told me the pictures, nightstand, candy dishes, and candle holders he had in my apartment were gifts from him because he loved me. Tonight, he packed everything up and left. I don't know exactly why, but I think it has more to do with his own issues than about me. Of course. Yeah. Yeah. I assume that he's the problem. Live from the Path, I feel I've been manipulated and used. Ironically, this man I thought was a friend is a psychotherapist. While we were together, he would discuss confidential information about some of his clients with me. I think I should report him. Oh, man. But on the other hand, I'm asking myself whether I'm only looking for revenge. Yes, you are. Should I leave him alone or report him to the American Psychological Association?

Or am I overreacting to losing him? I still really feel mixed up. Vengeful in Minnesota. What do you think? Is it time to call the APA? Well, she's correct. He has been using her. And yes, she's correct. She's just being angry. So move on. Work through the pain. Find someone else. Don't let him move in. I mean, where was your moral outrage when he was telling you this? Yes, but he has my candles on the nightstand.

So I'll look past this. Yeah. Well, yeah, that's tricky. Gessman, what do you think? Call the APA? I think she knows. I mean, she's stating all the things that she understands where it's all coming from. I got to agree with Dan that, yeah, just move on. It's over. It's time to be done with it, huh? Yeah. Is there ever a… I mean, what would have to be the circumstances for it to be okay for her to call the APA? We said this, yeah. Murder?

But even that's protected, isn't it? It takes you in the back of the trunk. Is that protected? I don't know. That's still protected. I don't know. She's going to report this to a group of dudes who do the same thing. How would you even do that? They go home and tell somebody something. Yeah. You know, they're like… They're going to cover him. What are you going to… Is there a corporate office where you're like, hey, I wish to tattle. They got a hotline.

Can you give me to the tattle department? I feel like I wouldn't take that seriously if I was a receptionist at the American Psychological Association. Maybe I would. Maybe I care about my work. I don't know. That just feels like a little much. I don't quite understand, though. So he said something cheesy. I don't want anything for Christmas. I want you. A couple weeks later, he told me the pictures, nightstand, candy dishes, and candle holders he had in my apartment were gifts from him because he loved me. So he brought pictures, nightstand, candy dishes, and candy… What's a weird gift, isn't it? Well, he moved in with her.

Yeah. Oh, really? Yeah, because then he packed his things up and left. And left. Oh, I just thought he picked up the gifts. His briefcase? He picked up and packed up everything left. Those reports? It didn't say that they lived together, though. I think it's pretty implied. He took back the nightstand? Is that what you were thinking? No, pictures, nightstand. Oh, yeah, you're right. Nightstand.

Yeah, that's weird. He packed up his nightstand and left. We're going home. He brought his own candy, dude? Isn't that weird, though? I'm like, of all the stuff to bring into someone else's apartment, you're like, hey, I got a nightstand and a candy dish. And a candle holder? That's weird. Yeah. He's a weird… You're better off without him. He's a weird… He says cheesy stuff and brings candle holders. Yeah. Just think about, though, all the crazy things you did for your mistress.

Yeah. Oh, that's true. I really want you back. Yeah. Uh, I feel like a candy dish is a weird… That would be enough for me to say something ain't right. Something ain't right. Like, what, like, uh, so, I'm trying to think. Wagner, when you got married… All right. What did you… It's a long time ago. What remained… Like, when your stuff combined, what of your stuff was still around? Oh, for at least a year, I had my, like, good man, lazy boy chair.

Okay. You know, like, your college lazy boy chair that was yours. Your body fits in. Nobody else's body fits in it. Yeah. I had that for a bit. And maybe, like, a PlayStation. I think that's about it. No, no, you didn't have any decorations in the place? No, no, no. But I didn't have any of that. I had my recliner. That's right. Okay. And, like, a toy.

And that was about all I really had to my name at that point. Okay, that makes sense. Yeah. So, I got to keep both of them for a little while. Okay. Okay. Guessman, what did you… What was in your… When you guys got married, what of yours remained in the place? Similar. I had a couch that was, like, 10 feet long. So, like, I could fully stretch out on it. Uh-huh. Yeah, that was gone. Was that in your…

It lasted a little while, but… Was it in your main living space? Yeah, it was. Don't worry, man. It was great. That's quality. But we couldn't find a cover to fit it because it was so long. Was it Grootie Town? It was, like, a tan floral pattern. Oh, yeah. It's a tan. It's pretty awesome. Yeah. Tan flowers. Beautiful.

But, yeah. I had a PlayStation, but, yeah, that didn't last long. That made it play out, huh? But, yeah, similar. I didn't… Yeah. Didn't bring you that stuff with you. Dan, do you remember? Oh, yeah, yeah. I had a recliner as well that I got from a guy I worked with who he had it for 20 years, completely wore it out, spilled beer all over it, and… Just broke in. And then his wife was making him throw it away, so I said, well, I'll take it. Took it to my dorm room for a couple of years, and then it was at our house for at least a couple of years.

My wife hated it. Every moment. It was ugly and worn out and dirty and gross, so she wouldn't sit in it, so it was great. It was awesome for me. And I had a king-sized waterbed, the old full bladder things. I bought that puppy when I was working two jobs in high school, going into college, thinking someday I'll be married, and she'll be so glad I've got a big waterbed. And, uh… Hey, when we were in high school… You were right on about that? I'm about to say, you know, I was smart enough. And I had a stereo, but I… Yeah. Oh, yeah, I had a stereo, I guess. Oh, yeah, yeah, let me…

I think the dude has to bring the stereo into the relationship. Is that too stereotypical? Because that seems right. Hey, you'll play on words. Okay. Nice. So, yeah, I was just trying to think back. I think I brought next… Almost nothing. Similarly. I didn't bring any furniture in. No decoration. The computer. The computer was mine. Did I mention I had satin sheets?

No, but you didn't have to mention that. There's no reason to bring that up. Oh, sorry. It's always about this time of night. Okay. Just having some memories. Okay, so now put all that together, right? Put all our experiences together. And then this guy, if we're right about moving in, he brings a nightstand, a candy dish, and candle holder. Like, isn't that enough for a red flag to say something's up with this character? Are these like dinner candle holders? Or like on the wall candle holders? Like a wall sconce that holds candles? Is that what you're saying? I don't know.

It's an apartment. I don't think you can hang your own sconces. Or romantic dinner thing, or… And either, actually, even if that is the case, I feel like this is a red flag. Ladies, if you see a man, and the only thing he has to his name is a stereo, a PlayStation, and some furniture that you both agree that this probably should make its way into the house, you may have found a keeper. If you find a guy that shows up and says, hey, you know what? Let me tell you some secrets so that you feel close to me. By the way, I want to bring some stuff into your place, like a candy dish, a candle holder, and, you know, a nightstand. I feel like this is a man to turn and run from. There's something very suspicious about him. He can't be trusted. And I feel like you'll take that to the bank. But maybe that's not his stuff that he brought in. It says it was a gift, right? Maybe that's a kind of…

Is this any different? Maybe not. It's not like it's mine that I brought. I got these things. I'm bringing them over. It's like, maybe it changes a little bit. I just can't be the same thing of you. Yeah. It was our six-month anniversary. I got you this nightstand. I'm just saying, this guy has a red flag waiting to happen. There's something weird about him. It's enough. It's enough for you. You're glad to be rid of him.

Don't call the APA. They don't care. And, yeah, it's just time to move on. And write this down as things to keep an eye out next time someone shows up to your place. All right. Secular says, let's see. Psychotherapists are not gods. And like other human beings, they can have their flaws. I understand why you would be hurt and disappointed. However, rather than look for revenge, you should consider yourself lucky you didn't invest more time in this flake. As to whether you should report his breach of professional ethics to the APA, I think that for the sake of the patient's clients whose trust he has betrayed, you should do exactly that. But after, your anger is no longer raging. Are you telling me that's not going to bring it back up? I am completely agnostic about this, but I want to talk about this guy that broke up with me.

Isn't it too late? If you really care about his breach of professional ethics to the APA, I feel like your time for healing is a little bit irrelevant to that. You should call them directly. So either you need to write it off or you need to call right now. I don't know, but this time to pass is like, well, I don't really care that he harms somebody if you really thought that was the case. That doesn't seem right. Yes, yes, no. Agreed. How do you feel about it? Wait, were you across the board no? You don't need to call? Like, is she wrong about that for the sake of the patient's clients? Or is Dan right that it's happening regardless? Like, in some way or another, stuff like that is coming out.

I don't think anything would come from it. I mean, she'll just waste time and she makes her feel good, I guess. Yeah, because actually, they're going to go to him and say, hey, did you tell her this? No, she's just upset because I spurned her. Yeah. And she stole my nightstand. Like, I don't know exactly how that works. All right. All right. Well, I think we've straightened out the world. You've been listening to Live from the Path. Thanks for hanging out with us this evening. And if you have any, if you need some advice from your Live from the Path, shoot us an email at info at livefromthepath.org. If you guys are hanging out on Facebook, we appreciate you joining us on our first Facebook broadcast. And we'll keep on that if you want to clear off your schedule every Monday night at, I don't know, roughly 10.05, 10.07, whenever we decide to fire this dump show up.

You can check it out. And we'd love to hear your comments and feedback on the show. In the meantime, big thanks to John Wagner for hanging out with us. Oh, thanks for having me, guys. Always good to have John on. Good stuff. And please, be faithful in the means. God will handle the ends. You've been listening to Live from the Path.