Live from the Pathway Studios in Johnston Proper, you are live from the Path. And you're listening to Live from the Pathway Studios here in Johnston Proper. We've got to put out a metal album. That's what's going to happen. You have a whole album with a metal tune? No, we've got basically 10 seconds of a song right now, but I feel like it's brewing. It's coming through the stew and it's wafting into the rafters. Yeah. Tickle, tickle, mini-pussets! I think it's pronounced Manet. I don't. I took some artistic liberty based on the tune. The emphasis is on the L, tech L. No, you're saying it like a real Englishman. Okay. Hey, real quick, Dan, did you hand out candy for the Halloween just passed? I did at the church. What was the best joke you heard?

Do people tell us at the trucker treat? Maybe one or two. We just kind of like, here, do you want some candy, little child? And they take it. It's kind of creepy. There was a guy driving around town in a hearse handing out candy. Oh, I kind of want to own a hearse. Yeah. Here's the thing. It's the kids. It's got to be old school. I didn't see that coming, Dan, what you just said there. Yeah, that's true. I kind of want to own a hearse. I mean, he was real creepy, actually. And we had to have a talk with the children because they were almost a half a block ahead of us.

And he pulls up with a bag, holding a thing of candy out the side of his window. And he's going, hey, you kids want any candy? I'm like, this is classic. This is a classic. No, you don't do it. And there they go, walking up there taking candy. Yeah, it's Halloween. Everything's going to be fine. He had a legit coffin in the back of this hearse, was wearing a mask, and his license plate was, he did. He did. I mean, he should at least have really white powder on or something on his face rather than a mask. Yeah. It seemed real unsafe. Yeah, but it seemed. Anyway, the whole thing was creepy.

Okay, so not many joke tellers at the drunk retreat. No, not really. Okay. I mean, there were a few, but I wasn't paying attention. Oh, okay. They weren't good enough to remember, at least. Right. Nathaniel, did you either take the kids out or give away candy and pick up any good jokes? Yeah, I took the kids out. What was the best joke? What joke did your kids tell? I told Eleanor to say, what did the cow say to the farmer? You're outstanding in your field. But she kept forgetting. Yeah, yeah. I mean, she might be a little young to pull that one off.

Too many syllables. And Finn was wearing a Spider-Man outfit. So instead of doing a joke, he did some Spider-Man moves as his… Oh, he just did it. He did the trick. Yeah, he did. He said, I'm going to pull off the moves. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Mike, best joke you heard? Mine was the butt cheek one. Where he said, what did one butt cheek say to the other butt cheek? We can stop this crap together. No. No. That's a negative.

And then Finn goes, that's not how butt cheek works. They're not using them right. Yeah, it's not like the last defense. You know what I'm saying? I don't think that's how it goes. And then the kid was not open to correction. No, no. He wasn't taking it in. I had a Hamilton one. I had the girl's tail. Hey, Nathaniel. How did we know Hamilton died in the winter? How's that? Because it was Burr. Because they're in Burr, Sean. Dang it. I haven't seen it.

It's not a movie. It's history. Isn't it a movie? Also. I haven't seen it. Yeah, I don't really watch the news, you know? It's not the news. It happened years ago. He was our first treasury secretary. How am I supposed to know that? Who's our treasury secretary right now? I don't know. Munchen. Who? Isn't it Munchen? Actually, I have no idea who that is. Exactly.

See? Who's the secretary of state? Condoleezza. That was like 10 years ago. Yeah, she's not been secretary of state for a long time. Isn't John Kerry the secretary of state? What? No. He's like a guy that was part of a sitcom that had a cast, and then he got spun off as his own B character. I have no idea who that is. I haven't seen it. No, that's the guy. Yeah, I don't know. Oh, wait. No, wait, wait. Which secretary of state?

Which state? Isn't there a… Wait a minute. Hold on. Others. Isn't there a federal secretary of state? Okay. Boy, this is embarrassing. I haven't seen that one yet either. This is now you… Oh, yeah. See, now you can tell I stopped watching the news. Oh, Anthony Blinken. I've never heard that name in my life. No. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

He's really goofy. He sounds like the team of Anthony Blinken and Anod. What is it? Thinking Blinken? I don't get those channels. Okay, forget it. Let's move on. I haven't seen it. Okay. We'll stop this crap together. That's him? That's him. Okay. Oh, man. Is he naturally blurry? Oh, man. He kind of looks like Jim Carrey.

What? Like an older… Like an aged Jim Carrey. No. Yeah, it does. Okay, anyway. Here we go. So, stuff we're going to cover. How much… What percentage of Christians do you think are tithing? Seven. Dan says seven. Mike, high or low? Oh, man. I don't know. That seems low. You want to give it a little bit of a boost?

20. 20. Nathaniel? I'll give it a tithe and say 10. Okay, 10. What's not in the middle? No, tithe. 10%. Okay, oh, you're going to say the tithe is the tithe. Yeah. Okay, okay. Here we go. Only 13% of evangelicals tithe. Half give away less than 1% of income annually. Colon study. Okay, I'll listen to the deets. While the majority of evangelicals say tithing, giving 10% of one's income to the church is

a biblical commandment, only an estimated 13% engage in the practice, while half give away less than 1% of their income annually, a new study shows. To the church? Like, through the offering plate? Let me check here. Let's see. The study, the generosity factor, evangelicals and giving, which will be formally released on November 1st, it reveals significant differences in giving among age groups. The research that inspired, I don't care about this, we calculate average giving for all evangelicals, including those who give nothing. This is a more complete picture of American evangelicals. Among all of them, the average is 2.4% of income to church and 0.8% to charity, for a total of 3.2% of household income going to church or charity. When the data was broken down beyond averages, which researchers noted are usually inflated by a few people providing large numbers, the picture was even more grim. The median for church giving is 0.57%. Yes, that's just over one-half of 1%, while for charitable giving, it is 0.1%.

Total giving to church and charity combined shows a median figure of exactly 1%. Think about that figure for a moment. Half of all American evangelical Protestants give less than 1% of their household income to church or charity. Is that surprising? Yeah, I guess it is. I don't know. I mean, does that count like giving to missions or supporting? Oh, yeah, that's the charity part. Yeah, that's that. Yeah. Wait a minute, that counts as a charity, even if it's a Jesus-centered organization? Yeah. Yeah. Hmm. Of course, these figures include the many evangelicals who give nothing at all. If we just consider those who donate to church, the average church giving is $2,600 with a

median of $800. And if we just consider charitable donors, the average is $1,067 to charities with a median of $300. So of people who are giving, it's obviously higher, but if you include the people who don't give anything at all, it drags the whole average. Are there a lot of younger evangelicals? Yeah. Hold on. Let's see here. They're going to break it down. The study found that people who were more engaged with their church and faith tended to give more to their church. Okay. The higher the household income, the more they were also found to give. Among evangelicals with a household income below $30,000, the median total giving was to be around $300,000. I always heard that was the opposite.

That the lower givers were giving a higher percentage? Yeah. The lower income were giving the higher percentage. This doubled, let me see, this doubled to $600,000 when people earned $30,000 to under $60,000. It more than doubled to $1,400 when the income was $60,000 to under $100,000. At six figures, median giving registered at $2,200. So I think once you get into the high ranges, yeah, it falls off. Yeah. Because if you're making $100 a week and you tied $10, you're like, ah, it's $10. You make $1,000 a week, $100 is like, okay, well, I can do that. But if you're making, like, $10,000 a week, making really good money, all of a sudden you're like, $1,000 a week? $10,000 a week, Dan. Some people live right. That's pretty high. Yeah, that's true. Suddenly you're parting with a massive amount of cash.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're like, well, shoot, I mean, that's like houses and, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's see. So what was the percentage again? Like, on average, it was .5? Yeah. So a guy who makes $100,000 a year, 1% of that is $1,000 a year, right? No. Well, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then half of that would be $500? So on average, it's $50 a month, basically? Yeah. A little less than that? A little less than that.

Kind of sad, huh? Boy, that's pretty tough. Probably $100 every time they come, and they don't come every week. So, because nobody does that anymore. So. Because no one does that anymore. We used to be active church membership was like, you know, three, four times a month. And now it's like, eh, once or twice a month we're active, we're engaged. I would say differently. Here's the thing is, I don't, I guess, it's just completely foreign to me. Yeah, me too. Like, I just never not go, I guess. I mean, unless you're out of town or something, you're sick or stuff like that, not a really big deal. But, you know, either you go or you don't go. The showing up, like, half the time is weird to me. Well, there's like, you know, soccer and stuff like that.

Yes. I guess they've got to mow the yard. Mow the yard. It's important stuff out there. Yeah. When we just got done walking, it's odd. Well, it's interesting, let me put it that way, how the Old Testament talks about things like Sabbath. Like, it talks to it as a much deeper notion and not just like a formulaic, hey, set it aside. But, like, it serves something more than that. It's a picture of what it is to be in God's rest on a frequent basis. And, like, and even the notion of, this was also something we covered in, it was at the back end of 2 Chronicles. And parts of Ezekiel, it talks about basically the land wasn't given a Sabbath because, like, the Israelites were continuing to farm when they shouldn't. They weren't giving it the seven-year rest like they should.

They weren't relying on God to provide during that time. And so not only were they missing out on God's ability to bless them when they didn't have to do any work, but, like, second to that, it had, they missed the picture of what it is to take that rest. And, like, God was basically saying, look, you're going to, the land's going to get the rest one way or the other. It's part of the reason I'm kicking you out of it. It will rest until you guys are, you know, you can have it back. And so it just, I don't, I can't say that I understand that fully, what I just said. It's, I get it. It's trying to tie our deeper picture. But I do know that, like, where God has set a pattern in there, like, you ignore that pattern at your own peril. And that we are missing out on something and where we filled it with human things. And I actually think the debate is a lot less pharisaical. Like, I could care less, like, on you deciding whether it's okay to work in your garden or paint something on Sunday than, like, the notion of being intentional about a day that

you were to set aside as holy that then to remind you of what it is to be in God's eternal rest. And, like, if it looks like every other day filled with your human kind of desires, even if they feel functional, that seems super risky. It says, the same group did a research in 2017 and found that the average donor outside of churches, so just in general, the average American donor gave 3.2% of their income to the church or to charity. Basically, the title was called, Americans are far less generous than they think they are. We find ourselves to be very gracious with our money. And, uh, yeah, we aren't necessarily. Do you think people aren't as generous because they feel like they're overtaxed? Like, hey, look, I'm, I'm already, I'm already paying. I gave it the office. Yeah. I gave it the, at the ballot box. Yeah, it was weird. Yeah.

I mean, maybe, maybe. Uh, although I, my guess is, is that, uh, here's the question. We saw, we saw Trump enact, uh, tax relief. I'd be interested to find out whether American giving went up in light of that. Someone had to have checked. It'd be interesting to know. Because I would have expected it. I would have expected those stimulus checks for people who, who bleed for it to just turn around, ride around and send it back to the government because they said they could use it better or say, look, we don't need this money, uh, or I'm too rich to get it. Then, then I would have expected those to end up in charitable hands. And so I do, I wonder, I'd be interested to go back and look, um, said giving was also found to vary by age, uh, with older Americans tending to give more than younger ones. The study sought to explain the findings by suggesting that people could have less comfort giving away resources to churches and charities because of the rise in the gig economy where income is less secure. Direct giving, which is more popular among younger people, could also be a factor in the

findings. People, particularly young people, are becoming more and more comfortable with crowdfunding, financially helping people they know or even just supporting an individual stranger in need. Agreed. Uh, and I suppose there's not a way for the data to kind of tangibly, um, account for that, account for that. Yeah. Younger adults were substantially more likely than older people to give money or help to a stranger in need, give money to friends or family in need, or especially to give to others through crowdfunding such as GoFundMe or Kiva. Uh, I, here's the thing is older people have been through this a time or two, you know, like, like it's really easy to get excited about something when you're younger and be like, yeah, we're going to do this thing. And then by the time you're 50, you're like, yeah, I've heard all this before that people are going to get up and do something. And then they gave all their amenity to that, whatever Jesus book.

What is that? What was that social media site? That's going to fail faith meat. Oh yeah. Yeah. I put a, I put a thousand bucks in faith meat, boy, that thing flattered out something fierce, you know, like, so after a while you go, it's not that you, that I think that they're less generous. They're just more, they're either more wise or more weary, you know, of going, look, I, you know, I've been part of this before. I hear what you're trying to do. But, uh, frankly, some of the crowdsourcing is just your laziness, you know, like you people used to go, look, I have this dream that I want to accomplish. So I'm going to work real hard. I'm going to have to work three jobs and I'm going to stay up half the night, still working on my craft so I can eventually make it this way. And now people are basically just pumping out of high school or halfway through college

and going, I just want to be at my goal right now. So if you guys could give me a bunch of money so I could, uh, get to it, that'd be great. That's just not how it works. Maybe it should work that way and maybe I'm just, uh, you know, looking at it in a very old school fashion. But like, uh, it just seems like folks are showing up with being like, it's really hard for me to go to school and work at the same time. So to take my stress level down, I'd like to crowdsource a bunch of money so I won't have to go to work anymore. That's not how this works. Yeah. I mean, the people are, are living and dying. Is it too much, Mike Potter, for the people to live and die in two decent rooms and a bath? Uh, my father didn't think so. Nathaniel, you haven't seen that either. Is that the, uh, the one they play at Christmas time? Um.

You've legitimately not seen It's a Wonderful Life? No, I've seen it. I couldn't remember the name. Anyway. I saw the black and white version. That's the right one. That's the right one. It says, so this was interesting, though. It said, in total, senior adults were 20% more likely to have given through congregations or traditional charities in the past three months or so than were those from Generation Z, but Gen Z was 31% more likely than seniors to have employed direct giving, to just giving it to someone. So they're basically just not running it through the coffers. What's the name of one of them crowdsourcing websites? Uh, GoFundMe. I'm on it. Okay, you continue.

Okay. How old did Gen Z people get? How old? What's the top age? I don't know. Didn't we have to look this up the other day? I thought they were still in their youth. Uh, that's what I thought. Like, aren't we still, like, they're still going to school? Yeah, like, I mean. No, no. 2000 refers to the generation that was born between 97 and 2012. So it could go far back in 1997. So they could be 20, 23. Yeah, they got jobs. Yeah. That could be.

Okay. All right. Anyway, I don't, I mean, I don't know what to do with this. We need to do better. I mean, it kind of makes sense, you know. Show up to church, throw a Twinsky in the plate. Sounds right. It seems right to you. No, not right that it's happening, but it seems like a normal thing. Yeah. Yeah, I don't think people give with the percentage in mind, which I think is actually all right. But, like, if you're expecting cash by whatever someone has on them, I guess maybe that's the gap. Like, people are carrying less cash, so they're less likely to drop incidental cash in there. Now, you might get more dependable income for people who are close enough to church that are willing to commit, like, a weekly give. But, like, the incidental guy that shows up every couple weeks isn't doing a bank draft

and has 40 bucks on him. It's just going down. I just don't think, like, people just don't have that kind of, they're not right. I don't know. People still write checks, Dan? You get checks? People drop a check in the box? Yeah. Yeah, we do. Interesting. Okay. Does the church have a Venmo? We do Venmo. Yeah, we do Venmo. Oh, wow. Most of our checks, though, actually come in the mail. Oh.

People do whatever that is, their bank check. I thought you were about to say bounce. People write in bed. Hey, does that happen, Dan? People write bad checks to the church? Periodically. Like, for big dollars? They try to look real generous? No, I think it's usually their normal thing, and they just, you know, let something get out of hand, a bill or something. Okay. Okay. Then they'll charge the church, like, an extra 30 bucks, or 50 bucks, I think it was, and we're like, well, it's not our fault. Yeah, right. We took this to good faith. Yeah.

That sluggard wrote us that check. Well, check everybody's bank account when they write a check. Yeah, right. Hmm. I don't know. Like, I don't think there's any, there's no surprise admonishment here. Like, we should be more generous. Yeah. We just should be. I mean, even in, like, I'm not concerned that it doesn't go through the church coffers. I would say, in general, we lack generosity. And maybe it's showing up in your day-to-day lives, but, like, like, and I like to think that it gets incorporated in that kind of way. But, in general, like, focused money on big things does make big differences. And so, like, you know, even Gen Z, Gen Y, like, don't bow out of being, of, yeah, help your neighbor, definitely. But, like, you know, everybody piling in to help the one missionary

or to make sure water and wells get built somewhere else. Like, that's all still fine, too. So, these are just crazy. What are you talking about? You found some good, you're going to support one, Mike? No. I mean, I've made it as if everybody on GoFundMe is some kind of college slacker. And that's not the case. Some of these are pretty cool, you know. But I just, here's the top fundraisers. The fire relief fund for a family has gotten up to $230,000. Some homeless guy that needed help in New York is up to $663,000. Funeral expenses for a dude, $117,000. A funeral expense? It's weird that people don't cap it. Say, look, I don't need more than this. Do not give me $100,000 for my funeral.

I need, like, $16,000. Yeah, this is just wild. I did one interview with the founder of GoFundMe, who, in the interview, they said that GoFundMe is now, like, the third largest insurance company in the U.S. What do you mean? Like, they, rather than people using, you know, insurance money for hospital visits and things like that. Yeah. They'll crowdsource it. Oh. Oh. Should we set up a GoFundMe for, I don't know, something? For Life in the Past? Yeah. I mean, we could use $117,000. We've never broadcast from Hawaii before. Yeah.

Yeah. How do we, how will people not hear if you don't go and say it, you know? Right. Yeah. Gotta take the word to them. 12 grand. I should do it. Is there, uh, okay. I'm in the faith section right now. I'm looking up. Yeah, what'd you got? Okay, we're trying to put the first monastery in Pakistan. That's 1,700 bones. Hey, man, how much do they want? Like a monastery? Like monks? They want to put monks in Pakistan?

Yeah, they're trying to buy land. Huh. Okay. What would monks do in Pakistan? Okay, hold on. They're trying, oh. God's Heart's, God's Heart Prophetic Conference in 2022 is trying to get the conference up and rolling. And, uh, they needed to raise 20 grand and they did it. Oh, they made it? Yeah. Ah. I don't know. Like, see, that's the thing where, like, hey, I want to put on a conference. Well, but, I mean, I suppose, it's, I mean, it's just, uh, I suppose maybe it's just because it feels easier than having to beat the streets. It doesn't feel right, Mike?

Yeah. I wasn't listening. Somebody's getting a bus repair in Chestnut Hill, Virginia. They only raised 1,600 bucks. You can't fix no bus for that. Oh, yeah. They need more help. Yeah. A church bus? Yeah, a church bus. Well, I, this is just crazy. Huh. Have you ever given to one of those crowdfunding sites? No, never. Nathaniel? No. No.

I have. What'd you give to, Dan? Do you remember? I had a high school classmate in Arizona this, this past summer whose air conditioner broke and she's a single mom. Well, she's probably not. Anyway, she's on her own. Yeah. Didn't have a lot of money, put it that way. Couldn't afford stuff. And she's just like, I, I, it's ridiculous. I just need help. But, and so I thought, yeah, I'll throw a hundred bucks at that. Yeah. And helped her out. And a bunch of us did. And we didn't, we didn't raise enough to get her a new air conditioner, but she got some

fans and stuff. And I don't know what she all got. I think she got, she got close to a thousand dollars. She had like three or four thousand or something. I don't know. Holy cats. That's an expensive air conditioner. Yeah. I mean, I'm just, I'm talking in general. I don't think that is. Actually, I mean, it seems like ours was up there. Anyway. And then there, there was another one. I can't remember. I've done it a handful of times. Yeah. I think I've done a few.

And sometimes it was just, it was a way, someone else obviously cared about it. And they're like, hey, anything you do help? I'm like, yeah, I'm fine. I'll put 25 bucks on that. There's a church, it's not GoFundMe, but it's a church organization that will specifically help retired preachers who never made that much money in the first place. Maybe they don't have to be retired. But anyway, preachers who aren't making a lot of money that get into a situation, it could be medical, things beyond their control. And I've helped out a few times with that. Yeah. Hmm. But Mike, you're against. I'm not against. I just, I don't know. I think I've given some money to help people launch some albums before. Like when they were trying to raise money.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. To get it, put a CD out. But yeah, that's about it. Did he do a fun thing? Who's that? Yeah, yeah, Lindgren did, yeah. Yeah. I gave money to that. Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, anyway, we need to be more generous. Maybe that's something to be praying on this week. You know, like up it. It's one of the things actually my wife and I have been talking about is that, you know, it's coming up on raise time, bonus time here in the next three to four months and even tax return time.

And like, you know, your life, you will start to get used to more money. If you're not careful and you're not clear about how you want to use your money, you will get used to an extra loaf of bread and not being as prudent on how often you fill up your gas tank and like whatever. Like you'll find ways to spend it that aren't lavish. Yeah. Even. What a real jerk. I know. There's two loaves of bread in here. Two loaves. How did we come across such luck, Winchester? Well. Actually, it was something about Amanda and I were talking about what we haven't, like something that has changed is like we, like Mike lives kind of far out. I live far out too. And so you end up driving everywhere and I drive vehicles that aren't super great on

gas mileage. And like the only thing that's changed over the last year or two years is that like I'm not fretting having to buy all that gas. Like we don't have extra money, but like I'm not as worried about it. Whatever my raise was or whatever last year was enough so that like it covers the extra gas or whatever. And I thought like I wouldn't notice stuff like that. And you do run the risk that like you go from one year to 10 years and can keep making, you know, bringing in more money or getting, getting just bonuses or tax return stuff back. And like you just kind of get used to it and you look back and go, I wouldn't have imagined that I lived on this kind of money, you know, right when I got out of high school, right when we got married. Like I wouldn't have seen, like my house was tiny and you kind of had to watch everything real close. And like I probably live borderline luxurious relative to that person. And so part of the question that we were talking to each other about was like, how do you how do you make sure that it is that you're being intentional with your money, that like it doesn't

just start to cover up things and move up a standard of living when you preferred to increase your standard of giving or something, you know. So and so anyway, and we're just something that we've been talking about. Hey, there was an article and this reminds us of our secular versus Solomon. See if we fit any of these. This is eight marks of a sluggard. Yeah. So when when Solomon's talking about a sluggard, this is the type of gentleman we're talking about. Number one, the sluggard will not start things. The sluggard has a difficult time with initiative. He relies on others to tell him what to do. And his verbal output outstrips his actual production. He talks of great plans, but he just can't seem to put them into action. He may be distracted by pleasure and entertainment, or he may simply be unwilling to get dirty and work hard. Wait a minute.

What's pleasure? You say pleasure and entertainment? Yeah. Oh, I thought you said pleasure and entertainment. I'm like, what is that? It's a little salty for the gospel coalition. Whatever the case, the sluggard is known for a lack of genuine accomplishment since he can't seem to even start things. So I was listening to it. They were talking. I was reading an article. Oh, yeah, that's why. It was an article about, they're talking about the best employee you have at your place. And it's the guy that doesn't cause any hassle, foresees problems before they become problems and just fixes it, but doesn't insinuate himself as being in any type of authority. Uh-huh. Right?

And just kind of, and it's like they were talking about it being the most useful employee that you've completely ignored and forgotten about. So look out amongst your place and start thinking about, you know, the Tom that works there that like, he doesn't come in here trying to take over stuff or be in charge. In fact, he handles more problems. He makes my job as a manager or boss easier. And like, you just keep counting on Tom as if Tom's going to do all this stuff, but he causes you no hassle and it's fantastic. And it just came to mind when we were talking about that article is like, one of the things they said is he talks of great plans. It's like, he's going to get all these things done. And then there's no actually, no actual output. But the, but the, the slug, the, the guy who does great things, but doesn't say anything about it is just as easily ignored as the guy that says he does all kinds of great things and doesn't actually do anything. Yeah, that's true. No one ever notices that the guy doesn't do anything because he's always at the top of

his lungs, you know, barking in the meeting, causing a big stir. So I, I, it's hard to pick out this guy. Like the, the solid dude. Yes. The solid dude. And the, and the sluggard who does a big talk, right? The guy's like, you know, because people that talk big like that are just as ripe to take on Tom's accomplishments and say, yeah, well, Tom and I spearheaded this thing and you know, we, we got this handled, you know? Well, yeah. And sometimes like the guy who talked about it all the time, he gets, yeah, he gets credit for it because he's the last guy you heard say something, even if he didn't have anything to do it. Yeah. Like, well, my talk and move the mountains. Yeah. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. I've been sitting in my house saying to my wife for about the last year, about every day, Hey, I've got this piece of siding. I think I'm going to fix one of these days, uh, cause it blew off and I've got it and I can fix this. And I talk about it a lot, like a lot. And then I go outside and I see my neighbors on a ladder and I think, well, that's cool. And then I leave. Yeah. I say no. So I'm, I am a sluggard when it comes to certain things at home. Okay. I have to admit. Yeah. Number one, Dan is a sluggard. Yeah.

Okay. Let's see. Are we guilty of the following sluggard behavior? Number two, the sluggard will not finish things. Even if you have the wherewithal to start something, you may still be a sluggard. Another quality of the lazy man is that he can't finish things. Once he gets to work and bumps up against some difficulty resistance, all motivation vanishes and the sluggard retreats back to ease. I got to get to ease, bro. I don't know if this describes me. This don't feel like ease at all. Listen to this guy. This is someone who has a growing stack of half-read books. Okay. On his desk. All right. Now let's not go there.

Yeah. Okay. Yep. Sluggard. I'll be guilty. A host of home projects still awaiting completion. That's true. But in my defense, there's like 200 items on that list. Multiple promises to friends and family left unfulfilled. A collection of almost written articles in the queue. And a gym membership that hasn't been used since January 2018. Hold on. This seems oversold, though. Yeah. I don't like this guy. This would also be the mark of a guy that's doing his darndest to try to fulfill and be an active member in his community, his family, his work, and also improve the way and live

his life intentionally. Yeah. Right? So like you can't… The number of times that someone has said, hey, could you help me do this? And I'm like, sure. You know, just give me a call or whatever. And they'll call and they're like, ah, I can't do it. I'm sorry. I can't make it then. Can we wait? Sure. No problem. Yeah. Right? And just push them off and push them off. And it's like, not on purpose, not because I want to be at ease.

There's just other stuff going on. I have 15 books I've half started and are not finished. And I don't think that's because I'm lazy. I feel like I just haven't gotten to it yet. It's because you retreat back into ease. No. I'm trying to explain away your sluggardness. It's not ease. I just… I think the same characteristics could be of a guy that just doesn't know how to tell people no. Yeah. Trying to… Yeah. So, like, you could be a sluggard or you could be having a hard time finding balance. Yes. That could also be true.

Time management issue. That's right. That's right. Yeah. So, so far, the sluggard won't start things or the sluggard will not finish things. Yeah. Okay. We're ready? Number three. Nathaniel may or may or may not be guilty with this one. Let's see. The sluggard will not face hard things. Yeah. A little sleep. A little slumber. A little holding of the hands. The sluggard will also refuse to face hard tasks.

To make his laziness, to mask his laziness, he will find refuge in cowardly excuses like there's a lion outside. I shall be killed in the streets. Confronted with hard decisions and potentially hard conversations, the sluggard is thrown into indecision, wavering between multiple options and will turn to entertainment to take his mind off the work before him. This guy's really got this on the mind. So, look at that guy out there being entertained. Netflix or Fortnite can be the opiate of the sluggard. Now, hold on. Netflix and Fortnite could also be the respite from a busy guy, right, who just needs to take a little bit of time to Sabbath and reset instead of being onslaughted all the time with crazy decisions. Yeah. The lion is in the streets. I shall be killed. I understand that's coming from a proverb, right?

But, like, does a modern man go, okay, this guy's starting to irritate me now. Now, because here's the thing, it's like this happens to me all the time. I'll get started on the thing and I'll hit a roadblock and I'll go, ah, man, I'm going to have to go to the hardware store. It don't make any sense to drive 45 minutes to the hardware store just to come back. Now I've lost an hour and a half out of my only free day to actually get something done. I'll just, now I'm going to have to push it off. We'll wait till Monday when I'm already out and then we'll grab this thing and whatever. And so, like, under this dude, like, that's the action of a sluggard who would go, this don't make no sense. I'm going to hold, I'm going to push this off. And then you go, I'm going to go spend quality time with my family instead of burning an hour and a half and 30 bucks in the middle of my only free day. Yeah. So, I don't care for this list so far. Yeah.

Actually, I'm not even sure the context, like, that part's funny, but, like, doesn't it make sense? If there legit was a lion in the streets, would you not go out? Isn't it all right to go, you know what, I'm not going out there. There's a lion in the streets. I think that's the idea of, hey, I don't know, but there could be a lion, so I better not go. Oh, oh, okay. Yeah, he's, yeah, it's not clearly a lion. He said there could be one. There could be a riot out there, so I'm just going to stay in my house. Yeah, that's like saying there's a lion in the contiguous 48. He could come our way at any moment. Yeah, there is a lion in the northern Des Moines, so. Yeah, yeah, okay. So, I mean, is it possible that he's also cowardly? I've seen that.

Yeah. Like, to say, because if there is a lion, let's say we heard tell right now, boys, that there was a lion outside in the streets, like, outside where we're recording. Yeah. Is it, and is it incumbent upon us as men to go out there and face this lion? Well, I don't understand why we're at odds with this thing. I mean, I could definitely go check it out and want to see what it's up to, and if it came at me in a threatening manner, I'd probably run away. I don't know that I'd get my spear out immediately and claim victory for the humans. I'd drive the truck at it, yeah. No, I'd call someone who deals with lions on a race. He's got a truck, too. So, what I'm hearing here is, Mike's who can eat, and we're good. Yeah, that's right. Mike's the sluggard. He says, hey, lion. I'm going to hit it with the truck, boldly.

I'll walk slowly home. Wait a minute. There is no standing edict on killing a roving lion. Mike's going to say, attack me, bro. I'm at my ease. I'll give you first shot. All right, number four. The sluggard is anxious and restless. What? Because he is living contrary to the way he was made, to work and build and accomplish and create, the lazy man is constantly restless and full of anxiety. He may long for greater productivity and accomplishment, but because of his unwillingness to work, he will exist in a perpetual state of craving without fulfillment. Eventually, these unfulfilled desires will wreak serious havoc on the sluggard's life. Yeah, okay. I've seen this in other people, for sure, where they're like, man, I just feel so anxious all the time, and I just can't settle myself.

I'm like, you didn't do anything today. You did zero things today. Yes. You're going to feel that way. I thought about it. Yeah, I can't sleep. You drank seven sodas. I guess you did do that. Yeah. Or you stayed up until like four in the morning doing nothing, and then you're like, man, I just can't seem to find a rhythm. I can't get my life in order. Things feel wacky. They're definitely wacky. They feel wacky because you're being wacky. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's like there's some innate thing within people where they find rhythms and habits to be disgusting. Right? Like anybody who has surrendered to a habit is a sucker that's being conformed to the man or whatever, you know, thing is outlined. Like there's no freedom in it. They feel like there's no freedom in habits. Yeah. And I actually disagree with that. I feel like there's intentionality in it. And being intentional is the ultimate freedom because you have the option to be intentional or not. You're living your life on purpose, not just letting things happen to you. And so that is freedom. Yep. Yep. Or they're like, I'm so stressed out of sitting around thinking about this stuff.

You should stop doing that. Yeah. That's why people go out and build a garden because they just take their sitting around and getting encompassed by this world of thought and thought and thought and thought and thought. Like, yeah, it'll drive you nuts. You weren't built for that. He's right about that part. Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to keep my own company for an extended amount of time. Like people complain, I don't want to get in the rat race. I don't want to be in the nine to five. Like, you just spent 14 hours watching YouTube. Like, you tell me which one's more destructive. Yeah. Like, try the nine to five and maybe then move on to something else at some point. But like, maybe that's still a better option.

Yeah. That's the thing is you don't have to join like this archetype that you're thinking of that's stuck in the rat race of the office jobs, right? You don't have to go make quippy remarks at the coffee pot or whatever you abhor about this whole situation. Just don't do that. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I agree. Okay. Okay. Number five, the sluggard has constant trouble. The sluggard's life is beset by constant trouble. Since he fails to complete his work in the allotted hours, he's in a constant hurry to fulfill his responsibilities and often annoyed at those around him for taking up all his time. The sluggard may have financial trouble or live in perpetual messiness at home.

He may not be able to keep a job for any length of time because of his inability to discipline his time, shun distraction, and work hard. Simple responsibilities like paying bills and maintaining his vehicle will be neglected and cause unnecessary friction. The sluggard may desire to grow spiritually, but the disciplines of regular Bible reading, prayer, theological and devotional study, church commitment, and bathing, and consistent gospel relationships are just too much for him to bear. Okay, so I want to know whether we have any leeway here because I think there's certain people that are just not built, they just can't nail the rhythms down. They just can't do it. It's not who they are. Some people are just a firecracker. Yeah, yeah, if I'm looking out at the body of Christ and going, look, do I think there are plenty of toes and fingers and elbows that just nail, you know, consistent Bible reading, you know, and they do this well in devotionals and prayers and whatever, and they're great at this. And some people are just not built that way, but they can speak the gospel like nobody I've

ever met. And they just kind of, they breeze through life. They go, they get ready to be like, hey, we want to have you speak at the church. And they're like, sounds great. And they just wing it in there, right? And they sit down and they pray to the Holy Spirit, God, this is your show, not mine. And here it comes. The gospel comes out and it's on fire and it's doing great. And that dude ain't sat down for a consistent 20-minute Bible study in 15, 20 years. So do I say that this has to be a go or no-go situation for stuff like this? I feel like that's not for me to say. Yeah, I don't know. I think it can't be none. No, I think it can't be none. But I think this, is everybody the type of person who's going to crack up at 5.30 a.m. and take in the Lord's Word for 45 minutes? Like, read it.

I don't know. I don't think so. I don't think so. As a matter of fact, like, if you think, just think about this. In Jesus' day, like, people didn't have their own personal scrolls at their place to crack open at 5.30 in the morning. They were mostly praying. You know what I'm saying? And they were going, like, their discipline was praying, talking to God, and then they might hear people, they might discuss Scripture, they might hear it in the synagogue. They might have some memorized. Or at the temple. Yeah, they would have memorized some, but, like, they just didn't have the notion of studiousness study. And, like, I think highly of that. But, like, I think we, just like, just like people feel a gap when they don't have an emotional connection like some people have in worship, and they feel like maybe, am I missing out on the Holy Spirit because I don't feel that. I think you also run the risk for someone who, like, tries to sit down and read the stuff and isn't feeling like they understand it or are not getting it. And they feel like, well, maybe the Spirit, maybe I don't have the Spirit to help me understand these types of things because, like, I hate this. Yeah. I don't like sitting down and reading anything.

And now you've taken the thing they don't like to do and you've put it into a medium of which we say God is in, and they don't like it. And now it creates kind of an unnecessary guilt. Now, I do think, I think God, I think you should always be open to growing wider and a little bit deeper. So, like, if you're not a throw-your-hands-up-and-worship guy, maybe try it every once in a while. Do I think you can give up on Bible reading altogether? I don't. I think you're going to have to, you need to do some. But, like, there are means to do it that isn't, you know, did you read your Bible every day? I'm just, I think we just got to be careful that it's not a man-made intent to prove faithfulness by what, by we can show how our time was allocated. Do you feel like the, is it in Hebrews that says the word of God is like a two-edged sword, double-edged sword? Yeah. Is it the phrase, the word of God? What's the exact, that's the question, what's the exact one? Yeah, hold on. It's like, what, Hebrews? All right, double-edged sword, here we go. Double-edged sword, no, no, no, no, come on here.

Living inactive, like a sharp double-edged sword. What is living inactive? The word of God. Okay, the word of God. So, my thought is, is like, when that was written, were they talking about, they weren't talking about your Bible as it's put together now? Old Testament. Right. But, once again, not your personal copy that's sitting at your house. Right. That's read every day, right? Right. We're just talking about the things that God has said, or the things that God has had written down and recorded on our behalf, is sharper than a two, is living, and sharper than a double-edged sword. Yep. And so, once again, it's just something to keep in mind when we're putting things in perspective and going, look, you have to be reading this Bible every day. Once again, I think you should.

Really. I wish that I did this better. Because there's no downside to it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's literally no reason not to do that, right? Yep. But, you know, before you use it as a benchmark to, you know, slap people in the face, just realize that that's not what Hebrews was saying either, right, at the time. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And I think it's worth praying through. Like, just as, just make sure there's not things that are blocking in your life that are not allowing you to be able to sit and soak in God's Word that way. Like, to be honest, if you spend a lot of your time, you know, moving from device to device, like, it's hard to keep your attention. It's not the Bible's, it's not the Bible's issue that you have done, trained your body not to be able to take in information consistently.

Yeah. And so, you know, maybe it's something you need to work through. You've got to fast some stuff so that you can properly enjoy or take in God's Word. Similarly on, you know, kind of on the worship side, if you, or just in general, say, I don't know if I'm having encounters with the Spirit. Like, you know, have you closed yourself off to it? I actually was thinking about this on the way, on the drive in, is that, like, is it possible that folks, including me at times, I think, like, don't have the same experience with the Spirit? Because in general, I find it risky, emotional involvement with things is risky. Like, there's things that I've closed off in my personal life that says, look, if I get emotionally invested in a thing, these people are going to run me around. They're going to run me ragged. And so, there's a protection that says, let me deal with facts on the ground, let me deal with information, and let me hold it in balance and try to think reasonably through it. And then, and that's, that's what I'm open to. And that's why I don't, like, Bible study is important to me, because I feel like I'm

gathering information. But that same protection in my worldly life, in my human existence, also could be a hindrance to being open for the Spirit to work and move in your life, because I'm only willing to take in information. I don't trust things that are kind of, that feel like it's beyond that. And so, like, is it possible that, like, I feel super psychologized by myself at the moment, but, like, am I emotionally cut off to the Holy Spirit? I mean, I don't know. I'm just something I was thinking through. Yes. Are you emotionally immature? Is that what we're saying? Yeah, I didn't say anything about that. Yes. Here's the joke I came up with at the Halloween, though, is, Nathaniel, have you seen the Lord of the Rings? I haven't.

Finally, you caught one that you took in. Oh, boy. Okay, okay. Hey, how do you know, what does Gandalf say when he gets constipated? What's he saying? Pooh shall not pass. I thought of that one myself. Nathaniel, don't laugh at jokes. Nathaniel, are you going to tell that to somebody else and claim it as your own? I'll be all right with it. I might. It's fluttery. I might. Dan, have you seen that one? Have you not seen the movie? Who, me? Yeah.

Oh, it just wasn't funny, huh? No, I was laughing on the inside. Okay, okay, fine. I'll get to it. Anyway, yes, mature, immature. That's what happened. Okay, all right, we dealt with the sluggard on that one? Yeah. Okay, hold on, hold on. Finish this out. Boy, I'm tired at night, boys. Yeah, I think everybody's tired. It's been a long day. Let's finish out the sluggard, and maybe we'll do an advice all the day. We'll cover a different article later on. Six, the sluggard is a nuisance to others. Because the lazy person is unwilling to work hard and develop his skills, he has little

to offer others. He's mostly a nuisance to those who might require his service. Like vinegar to the teeth and smoke to the eyes, so is the sluggard to those who send him. So, unproductive, unfocused, concerned about self more than others, the slugger drives his employers nuts and won't survive long in any environment that requires diligence and self-denial. Ultimately, the sluggard is in the same class as a thief and vandal. Yeah, they don't see it that way. But yeah, they certainly are. I actually run this with people, not so much in my workplace, but like in personal relationships. Right? Like they just constantly are referencing like our relationship in terms of them. Yeah. You know, and at some point, like the part of me that I don't really like, like will show up and go, you know, every once in a while when you call, you could say, how you doing, Mike?

Right. You know what I'm saying? Like house things with you. But it's never the case. It's always like something's way on fire at their place. Yeah. Because they're sluggard. One crisis after another. Yeah, right. And you're like, and then you feel like a jerk for saying, for thinking, maybe this could be a little bit more balanced, you know, like maybe we could have this, you know, so it was a little bit more even that made it even seem like there was a relationship here, not just a caretaker and, you know, someone who likes to set themselves on fire all the time. But like it very much feels that way. And most of it does stem from flat out not doing any of the hard thing, definitely for sure, or anything in general.

They're like, you'll never believe what happened to me. I bet I will. Well, I bet I will totally believe what happened to you because your lack of doing anything about it. Absolutely. Go ahead, Dan. I was saying, if you have one at work, it brings down the morale of everybody. Yes. If they keep getting away with it. Yeah, agreed. Actually, I think the thing I was going to say might be covered in the number in the next one. So let's go to that one. Number seven, the sluggard is self-deceived. A sluggard's commitment to serve self and maintain an idle existence may be so strong that he will oppose any arguments from those who attempt to nudge him out of bed or away from his computer or phone.

The sluggard's self-deception may manifest itself in grand business proposals that resist outside critique and have little basis in reality. This seems like a couple of the artists we had come through here. Yeah, right, right. Here's what I'm going to do and change the world. So I guess what I was thinking was that notion that we were just talking about where it just feels like someone's using you. They've got their own crap going on. It's always them. They're never asking about what you're doing, what's going on at your place. It's a very one-sided relationship. And any pushback to that, the sluggard does not deal with shame because it requires some level of self-reflection. And frankly, the mountain that would fall on them when properly self-reflected cannot be taken in all at once. And so you have to just deny the whole thing. When you stack stuff up so high, the notion of to come to reality is a massive, massive

burden. And so people can see that crap coming from a mile away. And so they say, look, I can't cede any ground here. Otherwise, I'm going to have to own all this sluggard behavior. And I don't want to. Yes. And so, no, I just called to talk to you about my problems. How could you be so self-centered and try to push back on me? Yes. Yeah. That's a guilt factory. I'm out on it. Slow, consistent accumulation of wealth through steady work habits is unattractive to the sluggard. So unrealistic dreams of quick money may dominate his mind. Hey, these guys are constantly selling stuff on the Facebook marketplace. Yes.

Yeah. Hey, I got this. You have any need for this? No. Why would I want a garden hose? It's got Elvis Presley tattooed on the side of it. Yeah. I have no need for this at all. I thought of you, though. We'd get to a good price. I don't want that. At all. Nope. It's not uncommon for a sluggard to craft spiritual-sounding excuses for not working hard by appealing to biblical teaching on the necessity of rest, the fact that salvation is not by works, the need for a balanced life, the danger of acquiring wealth, and so on.

Look at this guy. In every case, the sluggard will walk in and out of conversations with his counselors convinced he is smarter than them all. The sluggard is wiser than his own eyes than seven men who can answer sensibly. Proverbs 26. That is, yes. That's true. He's getting better. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Number eight, the sluggard won't become a leader. Sadly, because of his laziness, the sluggard will not wield much influence. Isn't this kind of implied in sluggard? This seems like an unnecessary point. He certainly won't become a leader, for leadership requires diligence, sacrifice, long hours, pain, and perseverance.

The sluggard despises these qualities, so he will labor under the supervision of those who have devoted themselves to hard work. And yet, there's good news for the sluggard. Indulging laziness is contrary to our design as humans and contrary to our calling as Christians, but we can't draw ourselves out of the morass of inaction by sheer determination. We need God's grace and a glimpse of Christ revealed in the gospel. Okay. Now, here's the deal. I'm going to part company with this guy just a little. There are plenty of people who are super-duper lazy and sluggardish who, without following Jesus, got some work, paid their own bills, started washing their face, and mowed the grass. Yes. And so, the thing, the hyper-spiritualization from the sluggard, when he said, hey man, we need rest, salvation is not my work, I need the need for a balanced life, this is the same cat who'll be like, yo, I'd like to do something different, but I wholly trust in the power of Jesus Christ. Yeah.

Tell me to change. I mean, the word of the Lord told you to change already. Stop running in the streets. Stop being smoked to the eyes and vinegar to the teeth. And so, I just, yes, but yes, the word of God has spoken on this already, on what it looks like to not be a sluggard. You could just react to that. Yeah. You don't need whatever this notion of the translation of the gospel that you're waiting on to rescue you from clear things that the good news has already spoken. I'm just saying, be careful not to crush that thing. So, this is the risk in what we talked about, is like, if you can't get yourself some decent Bible habits, which means you're not reading the Lord's word, and so you basically run your whole life based on spiritual revelation. And when God doesn't specifically come to you and speak to you and say, look man, you're being the smoke to the eyes. You're being the smoke to the eyes.

You need to get it. Like, the things that are of normal perception to most people that were like, I have to go out and work, and I have to show up every day so they'll pay me and not fire me. This requires a spiritual revelation to the sluggard. He's like, I don't want to, and unless God tells me I have to be here, I will not be here. Or maybe God tells me I do have to be here, and I think he's just wrong about that, and I will go home. You know, and so like, what everyone else has to do, I think they don't realize, they're blind to it, right? They don't realize that like, for them to be a sluggard and still be alive requires everyone around them to not be a sluggard. Right, right. So like, if everyone did what they're doing, then no one could feed you, or make sure you're okay, or, you know, get you to and from, or whatever, you know, or help you do anything because no one would have anything to give you. It's kind of the principle that we run into when we're talking about being generous, right? Like, if you are generous to the point where you are now a burden on somebody else,

I don't know that that was exactly the calling. You know, I mean, we want it to be sacrificial for sure, and we don't want you to be worshiping money, but like, if you give away every dime you have, and now your kids can't eat, now we have to go find someone else to feed your children. I don't know if that was prudent. I just don't know if that was the generosity described in Gospels. Yeah, right, right. Well, I think that, I think it's interesting if you look out, there's not a culture in the world who doesn't have, who doesn't say, look, someone's got to get up, then you have to do work. Now, it doesn't mean it's an office job. It could be, hey, your job is, you're making meals all day, or you're working the fields or whatever. But like, it's not a philosophical problem as to whether you have to do any work today. Like, somehow, with the maturation of humanity as a whole, no one has walked away going, you know, maybe we don't have to do anything. And so, you're an anomaly.

Yes. You're not a trailblazer, you're a doofus. And so, like, you gotta get your head on straight about this thing, and you're the outlier. And so, I guess that's the thing, is that when you niche it out and act like you don't need, I guess the point is, is that the gospel rescues many things. But like, the good news has already produced these proverbs, as an example. And core human kindness, of which God has shown mercy on the just and unjust alike, has made it clear that you gotta do something. And so, you don't need a specific spiritual experience to stop acting like a Jehu. Yes. And so, it's time to turn your life around and go do something. Yeah, and if you need help, let's say that you're struggling with this. Find someone who is not a sluggard, and ask them to help you figure out, how do I stop being me? Yeah. Directly. Yeah.

And they're gonna do this thing, where they'll be like, I'll call you every morning at 545. You can get up when I get up. You can try that out for a while. Oh, man, I don't know if I can do that. You are gonna do it. Because right now, you're a sluggard. And the thoughts that you had, the ideas that you have spurring from your mind, and the current pattern that you can look back on the last five years of your life and go, yeah, you don't make solid decisions, man. I mean, that's how you became a sluggard. Yeah. So you're gonna have to just completely bow out, lose every bit of pride you got, and go, help me. Yeah. I don't want to do this anymore. I'll do whatever you say. Correct.

Isn't that Ramsey who says that if you want to be wealthy, you should hang around rich people? It's kind of the same thing if you want to get out of being a sluggard, hang around people who aren't sluggards. Yeah. Yeah. That principle rocks, right? If you want to be a good dad, be around a good dad, right? Find somebody that you go, hey, man, that guy's a good dad, and then start hanging out with him, and start picking his brain. Yep. The good news of salvation, apart from works, motivates us to labor diligently in this brief life on earth for the glory of God, the good of others, and our own benefit. And the energizing spirit of Christ compels us to sharpen our God-given skills so we might be useful to our king and to our fellow man, to courageously face and complete difficult tasks, and to avoid the unnecessary trouble of laziness. That is something that a non-sluggard would say.

I feel like that's not the quotes of a… I don't think that just changes. I get… The good news changes everything. I'm just saying, like, it's still… Even the Bible itself, Jesus himself postures that he says something, and it's a tangible, true reality, and then you have to walk in it. And people have the option not to. And so there is volition here. And it is sinful. And so, like, I just want to make sure we don't hyper-spiritualize something that the Bible intends to be tangible, and for you to go, you know what, maybe I do should get up work so that I can eat today. Maybe that should be a thought that crosses my mind. Yeah, I don't know how you get past the opening gamut where you talk to a fella and would be like, hey, man, you need to go to work. Now, well, I don't know.

I don't know what else to say here. Right? Like, it's hard. Like, when you reach these… It's either a person's stubbornness or their blindness where you reach a thing that you thought was so obvious and really shouldn't be a discussion at all. And you're like, well, the first thing you need to do is you need to get up and get a job. Well, I got some plans. No, right now. You need a job right now. No, no, it's just not. And then you find them, like, three months later, still ain't got no job. And you're like, there's nothing else to say here. When you get a job, come back and find me. Is it wrong to set… Here's…

I've been struggling with this a little bit lately. Because, like, it seems wrong to set ultimatums to people. Like, in general, I don't like doing it. But there seems… There's a small difference in defining an ultimatum and a boundary. You know, that says, okay, look, this has to stop. Whatever this is, this has got to stop. Or, like, look, if we're going to have any type of continued relationship, it seems terrible that I have to even bring this up. But, like, A, you have to stop lying to me. And, B, you need to get up and take responsibility for yourself. These two things need to happen, or you and I just don't have any tangible relations to have. Now, is that… Is that… Is it ridiculous? Is it mean?

Let me reframe the question somewhat comically. Let's say there's a guy… Let's say the guy that calls you… He calls you every morning at 9.30 in the morning, and he says, I burnt my face. Yeah. And he said, why did you burn your face? I stuck my face in the oven. Got it. I turned it on, I stuck my face in. And you say, hey, man, you gotta knock that off. And the next day he calls you at 9.30. Hey, I've burnt my face again. I stuck it in the oven. And it happens for, like, three weeks. The question is, is it ever alright to go, look, dude, I thank you for thinking of me to tell your woes, but, like, stop calling me. But I burnt my face in the oven.

I know. I know. And you don't seem to want problem… You don't seem to want help with this face-burning problem. You just want to report it. That's right. You just want to tell a guy that you did it, and you want my sympathy. But I don't sympathize with you. You keep sticking your face in the oven. And so, don't call me. I want you to not… The question is, is it okay three weeks in to go, look, dude, I'm not going to pick up this phone again unless it's a morning of which you did not stick your face in the oven. And that will show me that you're actually trying to make progress in your life. Past that, you're really burning up time here, and I'm really going to focus on something else. Is it alright to tell that guy you're not picking it up unless it's a morning he didn't stick his face in the oven?

I think the answer is yes. I think it's fair. Yeah. Because it doesn't happen in a vacuum either. Right? It's not like you had all this free time, and now you're using it from 9.30 to 9.45 talking about the face-burning. Now that time is actually being robbed from somebody else. Yeah. Where you could have been doing something good and intentional with somebody else, right? Well, yeah. I guess that's the thing, is that if a guy calls and laments, oh, my face hurts so bad. Yeah, I know. You stuck your face in the oven. You should stop that. Yeah, yeah. I really do.

I really should. I really should. Yeah. Where are you going now? I'm going to fire up the oven. Oh. Yeah, I just want to make sure it's good enough for tomorrow. And so, like, okay, so now that's a ridiculous example, but, like, is that the same guy? I mean, I've had this. People are like, oh, you know, my life is just in shambles. I said, I know. It was like that the last time we talked. Did you take any of the steps we discussed? Possibilities? No, I didn't really do that. I'm like, well, then it's likely that your life's going to remain the same. And, like, the fifth time that you wanted to talk about this, like, you're just soaking

up bandwidth of doing good things in the world to talk about something you refuse to do. And I think it is within human power to do it. It is within your human power to do it. Hey, man, I got to, like, you stink. You should bathe today. Like, you can do it. I swear to it. It can happen. Yeah. You're going to get bathed. There's many of them that have licked this right to the right. Get a cloth. Get a cloth. Lick your elbow. Figure it out. Like, this can spit on your hand. This can be done.

So, like, I just, nothing changes without you doing something about it. And, like, I just don't, this is where I think we run the risk of looking at the gospel wrong. It is an active gospel. Like, God does expect that he gave you the ability to do something. And so, like, your reaction, you were created for good works. And so, that's how the gospel expresses itself, which means God expects that there is a good, a notion of good in the world and that you were to react to it. And, like, no one else's responsibility to carry you along. This isn't a hyper-personalized, capitalistic thought. This is a gospel thought that says, here's the reality. What are you going to do? What do you want to live in here? And the guy who goes, I want to continue to stick my face in the oven. I want to lament that my relationships are broken. I want to lament the fact that I can't find a job. I want to lament the fact that, like, I'm in constant temptation because I put myself in bad places because I refuse to actually go find a job and I refuse to repent and try to fix any of my relationships.

Oh, boy, why is my life not changing? You know exactly why. Yeah. And so, that's not harsh. That is the reality. And every person, it's incumbent upon them to have to actually live their life as opposed to just commentate on it. And I'm not, it is not our responsibility as Christians or humans in general to have to be a sounding board and dedicate an endless amount of time and resources to someone who just simply goes, I refuse. I know you refuse. Yeah. And here's the deal. The one moment, I mean, if he's a minute from sticking his face in the oven, or he calls me two minutes before and he says, I really want to stick my face in the oven, but I haven't done it yet. I'm like, I'm on the phone for as long as you need, bro. Yeah. I'm in.

We'll keep you out of that oven. That's right. We'll help you do good things. Help you do good things. But this constant, I want my life to change, but I refuse to do anything to change it. Like, there is just a pattern where, like, once you're ready, I'm ready. But, like, in fact, I'm ready now, but you tell me when you're ready and then we'll go. Yeah, right. Don't call me one more day and be like, I got a couple job applications out, or I got an interview on Thursday. You call me from your job on the first day and say, hey, guess what? I'm working at Kmart. Yeah. And I'll go, it's awesome. Yeah. Right. I don't care that you're thinking about applying.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to hear that you're thinking about applying at Kmart, or maybe you'll get a job there, or you've got seven other. I've just, you call me the day that you work at somewhere. That's what I want to hear. Yeah. I don't want any more gas bagging about anything else. Of all these grandiose promises that the slug are going to get something done. You're not. So I think that goes back to maybe an extrapolated understanding of our let your yes be a yes. Like, are you creating, are we looking for false glory? Hey, here's the thing that I know I'm supposed to do. I'm going to tell you that I'm thinking about doing it. I don't care. I don't care about that. I don't care.

Now, hey, I need prayer on this because I think I'm going to bail on it. Okay, I'm in. Yeah, certainly. I'm in. But, like, yeah, you're right. I care when you go to the job thing. Hey, I'm thinking about talking to this guy at work about Jesus. Okay, great. I can pray on that for you. Yeah. But, like, 10 months in and you're like, I'm still thinking about it. Shut up. Yeah. Shut up. Do it. I'm not even sure, actually. I should go through the New Testament.

Hey, Dan, you got your phone out still? I do. Can you search for the word think? Think? In the New Testament. How's that? Think of Philippians. Think of things that are pure. Okay, yeah, yeah. Think of things that are pure. Do this on this. This could totally bite me. I'm walking in blind. You think it's going to pan out that there's not a lot of thinking going on? Yeah. There's not a lot of time to think. We're going to repeat.

Yeah. Jesus loves me. That's true. I hypothesize that Jesus does not explicitly say he loves me, but there are quite a few places in the New Testament where that bears itself out. I mean, or John says that he does. Okay, yeah. Yeah, Philippians 4.8, Romans 12.3, among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to, but think of his sober judgment. Okay, that's not the same thing. That's not like pondering. Okay. Matthew, what do you think about the Christ whose son is he? Calling you to a decision. Yeah, there's not this pondering. Prepare your minds for action. Be sober-minded.

That's 1 Peter. Been justified. I feel good about this. This is working out. I'm moving on to Life from the Path. Fact check, thumbs up. Okay. All right. All right. Hey, if you're having problems with being a sluggard, here's what I want you to do. I want you to call us on the complaint line, 515-517-0085. I'm willing to listen to your pontification once on the message, and then past that, you call from the job. You call from after, because you need emotional support after having apologized to your mistreatment of a man or lady in your life, and where you broke relationships in Sudenev. When you, you call because you took that thing that you stole back to the thing, and you're not sure what the consequences are, and you need someone to walk through it with you.

We're in on all that stuff. Absolutely. Okay? But go do the thing. Don't think about the thing. Don't even, even the Christian version of this is like, I'm still praying on the thing. Stop praying on the thing when you know you're supposed to go do the thing. Yeah. God already spoke to the thing. He spoke to it. Go handle it. And then, dude, we're totally here for you. Or lady. Well, not totally. Go back to your spouse for certain things. Nope. Dear life from the path.

Dang it, Ben. Hugs, I meant. Dear life from the path. I've been with my wonderful husband for 15 years. I currently work from home with our small children, ages 4 and 1. I have a, quote, no shoes in the house policy. Always have. But my husband prefers to wear shoes in the house. Boy, listen to this. This guy with the stones. We have bought numerous pairs of sneakers to be used as inside shoes, but he often wears them outside to mow the grass or run to the gas station. I do my best to ignore when he leaves dusty boot prints on the floors, but every now and then I call him out on it. When I do, my request is met with rage. He later calms down and apologizes with the excuse, I just don't like being told not to wear my shoes in the house.

I can see that. It's a 15-year-old problem that's not going away and I just don't know who is right. My husband feels his shoes are clean. I struggle to keep my home clean because my little ones are running around. His disregard seems just so disrespectful. He's overall not a disrespectful person. I'd love an unbiased expert opinion on what's what. This is nothing but a domestic dispute. People go to jail for domestic disputes. I would take the woman. Max will be able to wear his boots in the house. Yeah, no, here's the thing. He's exacerbating this problem. I can't think the two dirtiest things to do to your shoes are to wear them to the gas station and mow the grass with them. Yeah, I mean, everybody has a separate pair of shoes they tear up for mowing. They get to turn off green and nasty.

Yeah. So, well, first of all, this little, we got little ones running around. If this is a 15-year problem, either your kids aren't little or, like, you've just tacked on the kid problem to something that otherwise was not particularly good. They're four and one. Yeah, okay. So, like, you had this problem a decade before the kids came. Right. Well, I don't care about the kids. It must not have been that big of a problem because you had kids. You think she should have withheld sex? I'm just saying they got intimate somewhere in there. She got past it. Yeah. So that's what he should say. You obviously got past it. He took off his shoes.

Yeah, that'll go real well. I called the complaint line, and then I came in here. Yeah, do it for our kids. That's just ridiculous. The whole thing's ridiculous. Yeah. It's your house. Live in it. Yeah. I mean, don't be a slob, but live in it. It does feel like she's, like, there's something here that is that she's, like, way over-cranking on. Yeah. I really feel like it depends on the type of guy that your husband is, right? Like, if he wears, like, business casual, easy slip-on, slip-off shoes, and he's not out slinging concrete all day or working construction, you know, something that's going to cause him to be filthy when he comes home from work.

I don't think it's out of bounds for him to take his shoes off and behave himself. If they're easy to take off… Hold on. This is a wild, wild thing you're saying, Mike. Yes. If they're easy to take off and clean… Yes. …you should take them off. Yes. If they're hard to take off and filthy dirty, you should get to tromp through the house in them. Yes. That's exactly what I think. This seems very biased to your own life system. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's fair and right and good.

And you should feed him grapes. Yeah. I don't know about this whole bursting into rage thing when you're told to take off your shoes. She's overselling it. You think so? Yeah. I don't… I don't think he's actually being a jerk? I mean… Because it seems like if you're going to burst into rage, things need to change. I think it's a tipping point thing for him, right? Like, if your kids are young, they're four and one, you're working a job, you're trying to do your best to be a good husband, good provider, do a good job with your boss and whatever, and then you come find out you can't even wear your own shoes in your own house and you're like, what is this? I mean, I don't know.

You don't know. You feel like he should take this better. You feel like he should just take his shoes off? Yeah, take them off. Put on the aqua socks or whatever you got, your house shoes. House shoes. Yeah. The thing is, it's like, it's so irritating to have to… Like, I had this happen the other day. The dog escaped. It's a new dog and it's got no idea of boundaries or where they're supposed to go. And the jet's out the door and I'm not wearing my shoes or my… I had, like, slippers on. So I had to stop at the door, take the slippers off, put on the outside shoes. The dog's halfway to China by now. And, like, if I had just had my shoes on like I wanted, everything would have been fine. I'd have been right out the door.

So you should be able to wear your boots in your house at all times in case of fire or dog escape. Yes. The same reason you don't wear nice pants unless you have to. Because when your car breaks down or someone else's car breaks down, you don't want to be rolling in the shoulder with these dress pants on. You want to have jeans on. This seemed like a one in six million problem, Mike. Are your children one in four? No. Just wondering. They're older. Yeah. I'm just wondering who wrote the letter. I totally have a… Was it signed to Jarrah? I let shoes in the house.

We don't actually have a problem with that at our place, but… Yeah, I mean, I got wood floors. So, I mean, like, it's not carpet. And so I feel like… They sweep up. Yeah, there's no reason to over-crank on the thing. Now, my wife recently bought a rug, and she's very adamant that you don't walk on the rug with boots on. But, like, I can easily walk around the rug. It seems like a fair compromise. Yeah. I won't stand on the rug. All right. So if you're saying… If I'm supposed to take myself out of this situation, I think the deal is, it's like your wife is, as far as I'm concerned, she's in charge of the home. She says, don't walk on the carpets with your boots on.

You take your boots off. That's my actual opinion. I don't know why it's that big of a deal. I think, well, actually, I think this situation is right for two people who are both overreacting to go the opposite direction. Like, here's the thing. If he's otherwise a good husband, he's a good husband, he's a good follower, or a good father, are you… Do you want to blow up the thing on these boots? Here's the thing. I think if he were wearing, like, actually filthying up the room, she would have mentioned it. He's constantly tracking mud through, all right? Like, he's not doing that. She's probably… It's like… I think she's a clean freak. I think she's way over cranking on it.

And he knew that when he married her. Uh, maybe. Maybe he didn't. Oh, you think she flipped a switch and became a clean… No. They were good Christian folks. He never stepped inside her place. He's a death punk. I'm going to tell you two… I'm going to tell you one thing that will… It will destroy a good man, is death by a thousand cuts. Like, you've got a guy that is pretty all right. He does his best. You love him. You know he's a good man. He's doing his best. But, like, you can cut him to death with every small, tiny thing and make him feel like a complete failure.

And in your mind, you're not calling him that. In your mind, you're like, I love him. He's great. I'm helping to improve him in a thousand ways. That's right. But there's a thousand things he does wrong that are just so bad. He uses my pretty hand towels when he's supposed to be using the dirty ones we don't keep out on the stove. And, like, this dude, like, take a thousand of those and he's like, man, I just… I fail at everything. Like, even if he's trying to, right? I'm not saying that you're being a jerk. I'm saying that he will go, boy, it just feels like everything I do is some type of failure. I didn't put the laundry where it goes. I bought the wrong hot dogs. You know, like, everything I do is just the worst. Yeah. Right?

If you want to destroy a good man, just kill him with a thousand cuts like that. Yeah. And I think, and maybe this is a surprise, but, like, men are often emotionally frail. Yeah. Like, we especially… Except the three of us. Yeah. We're sturdy. Oaks in here. Hey, wait. There's four guys in the room. Sorry. Yeah. I don't think he was not including… You were silent over there. He was not including you. That's really funny.

I'm actually very… Outside, my wife, she's the only one. Everyone else can make a pound sand. You can suck a pear. Boy, my wife says I didn't do something right. I'm like, man, I am the worst. Well, yeah, because, like, so, like, there's tremendous power in a man who wants to serve a woman. It matters to him when he's not doing it well. Yeah. And so, like, men are more braggadocious in general, but, like, they are frail. And, like, you can… What seems like women can be a little bit harsher to each other and they don't take it so personally. But, like, not every guy, but, like, there's a lot of guys where, like, it just cuts them. It feels like they don't want to feel like they're failing. And the small things will add up.

And ladies, you're very powerful with your words. Either build up or destroy. Very powerful. Here's how you fix this, though, I think. I think if you don't say anything, give him four months. You don't say anything. We already mentioned he sounds like he's a pretty good guy. He already knows. He will on his own. He'll do it a few times just because he can. He'll walk through the house with the shoes on. But after about a week, he'll be like, man, she really doesn't want me doing this. Yeah, I probably just don't. Agreed. And without you nagging on him, he'll be like, I love my wife. Yeah. Yeah, that's true.

You, Dan's highlighted a second characteristic of most men, is there is a notion of stubbornness and not wanting to feel like they're being controlled. Yeah. And so you combine a frail man who doesn't like to feel like he's being, who wants to assert himself as ruling his own life, but who also very, very much so wants the approval of his wife. And you have a difficult person to deal with. Yeah. No doubt about that. So, but sometimes you just got to let him work it out and, and he'll go to the right path on his own and he'll feel much stronger because it felt like he chose it. I chose to stop wearing these boots. I didn't get told to do it. Yep. I chose to, but then I chose to because I love my wife. See, this guy, what a tender hearted. He's a good guy.

I love this guy. Now in the ladies' defense, they're like, great, I have to run some kind of political gamut against this frail, you know, twig of a dude. And like, here's the thing. It's like, you're not wrong. Yes. Yes. You might have to do that. But I, I think you're saying, uh, you know, if I'm saying the same thing when you say, do I look fat in the dress? So like we're, everyone's doing this. Everyone's saying, Hey, I'm difficult. I want you to butter me up for a while. Uh, I want you to, uh, help me be a better person. And, uh, you got to deal with my emotional frailties. Yes. That's, that's what you married.

Your marriage is that definitely. Yeah. Get used to it. Secular says, your quotes, wonderful husband may not be a disrespectful person overall, but in this case, he is being self-centered with a four-year-old and a one-year-old crawling around and playing on the floor. He should be more considerate because there's no telling what he's tracking in from the run to the gas station. That four-year-old eats out of the toilet. I guarantee it. Yeah. And the last time I went to the gas station, I checked both the bottom of my shoes. There ain't no heroin needles or whatever you're worried about dirt. Maybe. I mean, kid can put down a little dirt. Won't kill him none. Uh, I assume that the dusty footprints are something you were.

He's in charge of cleaning up. Perhaps that's a chore he should assume if he's changing his shoes is too big of an inconvenience for him. He may be a prince in other areas of your marriage, but in this one, he is acting like a rebellious teenager. I like that. I said, hey man, don't kill a good man with a thousand cuts. And Secular's like, oh, cut him. Cut him. He's worthless. Cut him deep. Get yourself some toenail clippers and jab him every once in a while. Post script. I wonder if keeping a supply of disposable shoe covers by the door. This is Mr. Rogers. Yeah. For him to slip on might mitigate the problem.

Who knows? Oh man. Yeah. Yeah. You might as well set him up at the unit clinic. Like, put these shoe covers on. Ooh. Hey, put on your booties, Phil. Now, here's the thing. I've been quite a few businesses where they're like, look, you can't come in here without wearing the booty covers. And I'm like, I'll stay outside. I'm not putting those things on. I almost fall down every time I put them on. Like I just, yeah, I hate them. I used to have to wear them at the hospital when you'd go into like the OR rooms, you know, and have to do work in the clean rooms.

And like, I would certainly do it for that because that's a legit reason. But then like the other guys would do it and then they'd go out and have a smoke like across because you can't smoke on hospital grounds. So you got to leave and then go across the cross the block and then walk all the way back. So now your, your clean booties are all torn up from walking on the sidewalk and your white bunny suit smells like smoke. And then you're back in there working. And it's just, it's just the, the appearance of actually following the rules. We're not actually accomplishing anything. Yeah. And I used to have to wear those working in the clean rooms at 3M and every time there's like a line in the room that you have to get dressed in, it was a tape line. If you stepped over that tape line, you had to take off the booties and change them. Oh man. It's like the, we got the clean dirt on this side. We can't mix them.

This is approved dirt. I remember, and this had to have been a decade ago, but like, um, there were complaints at the office about people, um, hanging, there was one closet where people would hang up their coats and there were people were saying, well, like, uh, the smokers keep hanging their coats up in here and then I hang up my coat and now my coat smells like smoke. And so they set up, uh, some cupboards and there was a smoking side and an on smoking side in the same cupboard. There was no divider or anything. There was just, they got their own side. I'm like, what is going on around here? Someone's, someone's pulling, pulling my leg here. All right. Hey, you're listening to live from the path. We really do appreciate you hanging out with us on the show. Uh, a few different things. Hey, if you got, um, feedback for us, good, bad, uh, and even if you want to call in or text us your indifference, we're good with that.

Five one five five one seven zero zero eight five. That's five one five five one seven zero zero eight five. That's the, uh, live from the path. Bob Eisenhower complaint line. We would love to hear from you, your thoughts and comments on the show. Also, uh, if you have not done so yet, if you wouldn't mind leaving us a review on your favorite podcasting app where you're picking up the program, we'd love to do that unless you, Amazon does not give you the ability to leave a review. And so go listen to it somewhere else and leave a review. And then you can go back to Amazon if that's what you want to do. But, uh, again, that's helpful for us. Um, it's possible that it creates some level of visibility so other people can see the show and, uh, our hubris extends into this and says, Hey, we want more people to listen. And so if you want to be part of that friend, uh, you can go like and review the show and that'd be super fantastic. Uh, and I think that's about all we got. You can check out past shows on the website, live from the path, uh, dot org.

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