Live from the Pathway Studios in Johnston proper. You are live from the path. And you're listening to Live For The Path coming from the Pathway Studios here in Johnston proper. And here's here's the thing that I want you to think about in your homes or in the cars as you listen to the show. I'm feeling a little. And I want you to think about that. I want you to think about another man. What's your definition of?

Something that feels like it's not a burp because it's not hardcore. It's like a half committed. Anyway, I just want you to think about that, especially if you're some of our newly acquired foreign listeners. Those of you in Vietnam, Bangladesh, I I just I need you to know what you're getting into. Our newly unacquired listeners. You for your time in life on the path. Yeah. Ben ain't feeling right. Hey. How do you know you're noncommitted if you already bailed from the program? Alright. Here's actually, that's the thing you need to be prepared for is just that type of situation. That's the tenor of the show. You're very welcome. And

that's all we got. Hey. Hey. Thank you, guys. We've been we've been doing a better job putting out the reels and the short clips and stuff on Instagram, and you guys be watching. So I very much I appreciate that. Thanks to you guys also who are, like, interacting with it. I know I disagree with you on a few different things, but you may just be a lovely person, and so thanks for hanging in there with us. That's all I got. Okay. Yep. Yep. Alright. Here's what we got going on the program this evening. We've a gaggle, a gaggle of folks in the room, Mike. Yeah. I brought most of them. Came with me today would be Ella. Yowdy. And Finley.

Hi. And Simeon. Howdy. Word. And then Ben brought Leila Byrd. Hi. Word. So here's the reason. A couple of reasons. One, they love and follow Jesus. And it's always nice to have some different perspectives in here. I don't know if you can tell, but Ben and Dan and I look very Republican. So Yes. We're basically just older white dudes. And so like

yeah, no, it's rad. Sorry, man. I'm an independent. No. I know. I didn't say is Republican. I just said Oh, totally look at Looks Republican. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, we thought it'd be nice to have maybe just a perspective on some things maybe that they thought As they're growing and as they're starting to experience different facets of life, some things that they just weren't prepared for. Situations that you run into, social situations, or maybe even school stuff or stuff that tested your faith that you're like, I just did not think that this was gonna come up. And like, I hadn't put any thought into it. And it kind of threw me back for a minute. And even as before the show, were talking about that.

I mean, that still happens to me. I was just talking to my wife yesterday and we're like, man, I just sometimes I end up sitting in situations where I'm like, I can't wait till like an adult shows up and brings some wisdom into whatever's going on here. Like, you just feel so ill prepared for whatever has come come across. You know? So I think we're gonna talk about that a little bit. And then we had what do have? One of oh, we were talking a little bit about it was just an interesting talk about Brandon Lake won an award, like, over the weekend. I don't remember what the thing was about. K LOVE. Yeah, the K LOVE Awards. And so Christian, especially the contemporary Christian music industry has been taking a lot of hits here lately. A lot of it having to do with maybe some Christian artists that are representing a brand less of a lifestyle, less of a commitment to Jesus and more to the fact that Christians will buy Christian music. There's not many things that you can't put the word Jesus on. People aren't like, Yeah, I'll take that. Do know what I'm saying? And so Christian

music has a risk to being that. There's also a balance that says even your worship leader is a flawed person. Your pastor is a flawed human. And so we would be asking for perfection, but some of it is basically just shining on, representing in a way that they're postured to follow Jesus, and really they're just wanting to sell you music. And Christian music, I mean, you've heard enough of it lately. If you get a synthesizer and someone that is willing to close their eyes in a darkly, you know, not well lit warehouse with a choir, we're in. We're like, how much is this album? This feels like the Holy Spirit to us. You know I'm saying? We're ready to shell out some cash. And so, like, what I just want we're gonna have a quick conversation about

maybe maybe not the nuance of some of that stuff or anybody in particular, but it's it's a it's a modern problem. Right? Within the last fifty, seventy five years or so, like, there were not generally career worship leaders. You know, like people would lead a song at a church or so or they were musically talented people in the body of Christ and they would do what god built them to do but very rarely are they like selling tickets or merchandise or, like, having personal wealth associated with it. And so, like, there's a risk there that wasn't there before, and so it's just something to be, you know, keeping an eye out for. Also, we got some deer live from the past. And anything else? No. No. But I will catch actually, was just thinking about those reels. So before we get into the heavy topics, I I did something that maybe is worth a clarification on one of them that got some action is we were talking about the influence of Christianity on society holistically. And part of the conversation was to say that America

was was certainly heavily influenced by Christians and Christian ideas and core morals, but is not a Christian nation. And that generated a few different trains of discussion. And I suppose just just to say it straight in case this is a point of confusion for you, if Jesus is not the king, then it's not a Christian nation. And so and secondly, it's not even a as far as I can tell, I'm I'm open to being wrong about this, but it's not a biblical concept that there is even a Christian nation. And so the reason it matters to me is that like we spill a lot of words on stuff like that. And like I just don't know why we give a crap. Like if

you're trying to say, hey we've strayed from whatever we think our ideals are, like your nostalgia ain't gonna play with the folks who caused it to stray, homie. Like you're just griping. You're just an old man on a stool about that. And I would I would further say that like because it's not even a New Testament concept that there is such a thing as a Christian nation, I I would I would actually spend zero amount of time talking or thinking about it, and more just looking at the cards that are around us. Like, look at the situation we're in, where our society's at. Be people of Jesus in all of those things, whether it's political things, whether it's you're engaging with your neighbor, all that kind of stuff. And then like, I just I don't see any Ws in here at all in this battle. And I've seen a lot of

of people talking and wait frankly wasting, I think, lot of effort on it. Maybe it's a modern thought now that you mentioned whether it's a biblical principle or not. But when I think about it, like, we're always like, Hey, as someone who follows Christ, you should work to get yourself as a position of authority in your job or in local government or whatever. And like, so could influence change. And, like, the truth is that's how the world solves problems. That is not actually a prescriptive method. I'm not saying that it's bad. But, like, in general, like most of the New Testament,

like most of God's movement was done in oppression, and that was across the board true. There was every once in a while, there was a guy who had, like, an authoritative position or that gal at the Joppa, you know what I'm saying, who was, a successful business lady or whatever, or the guy that gave Jesus the tomb. You know? And so, like, it's not to say that there's not any level of success within the world's confines that's that's bad. But in general, like, we we're like, hey. We should be in the upper echelons of government. I I mean, we could be. I guess I I don't I don't know. You know what I'm saying? Paul's not like, hey, get elected to the Roman council. We'll really affect change up there. We have always affected more change by dying. Yeah. Actually, I think the key rub with it,

and maybe we can just drop this here. I just it it it was it came up a lot, and so I just wanna talk about it. I think the key rub with it is in some ways it attempts to borrow the power of the government to otherwise influence something that is purely at the discretion of the power of the spirit. And so if we go, like, is it perfectly fine to be a Christian who does government service? Yeah, absolutely. Go to town, I love it. But like, if you're banking on the idea that say if we can just convince people that we were once and should now be a Christian nation, then the power of that nation may otherwise be able to do the influential stuff that we expect to be done. I that like, you should have zero eggs in that basket. All your eggs should be in the spirit. Spirit's power, spirit working through people, and and all the ways in which you individually gain influence into the world. But the minute you commit it to that structure, like, that's that's the part. It seems advantageous. It seems like, hey. I bet we could get more if you could just pass the law that modifies the behavior this way. And I it just doesn't work that way, and it it seeds the power of the holy spirit to the borrow the power of the government. And I that I I just misaligned even if well intended. Leila, how much do you care about the government? Couldn't care less. Classic.

Finley, is this coming up a lot? You getting a lot of government conversations? Not really. No. I don't think so. I mean, I have a few family members that love some Fox News, but that's about it. Yeah. Yeah. That happens. That's it. Brings them out of the woodwork. I don't mind the Fox News. I also actually, I I my dad chastised me one time because I sent him some article that I saw off what is like a like a pretty liberal news source. And he's like I can't believe you read that crap. And I'm like I read all the crap. Like because the reality is people have a bend to the world. Just like your chet cheap PT does, knows what you wanna hear and so it gives you that. And sometimes the types of thing, you're not getting a fair shake by often in middle ground things. There's things that like affirm a position you believe and there's things that challenge and they tend to be covered by the extremes. And so like I actually feel like I'm not actually well served by neutral news organizations. I I read a very wide sloth of things just knowing that, like, someone wants me to believe a thing, and that's part of how I digest it. But yeah. Mhmm. Okay. You listen to life from the path. Let's let's let's what are the things what are the things in your young lives where you're running so Mike had said, like, you're running into situations that you're like,

hey, I didn't even thought about this, either from a faith perspective or something. Places where you're like, man, I I don't feel I I feel not quite prepared, but not because nobody prepared you, it's just like, you know, you just didn't know, and you're like, boy, it would feel different if there was, I'm used to someone else kinda handling situations like this, or just things that surprised you that have been challenged you in your faith that you never had to think about before? Anything kind of in those pipes. Yeah. So I have something. I think that one thing that really I was not expecting was like the amount amount of people who, like, say they're Christians and who say it all the time, but, like, they don't show it at all. Yeah. Like, I would have no idea whatsoever

that this person is a Christian. And then I see him at church the next day, and I'm like, weren't you just like smoking weed in the bathroom the other day? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm saying? Dude, I don't even go to your church when he found me out. That feels really specific. Don't know if they're talking to you Jake. But yeah. Yeah yeah yeah okay. And so you would say like just growing up that wasn't a dissonance necessarily and then like you just start noticing and that that is surprising. Yeah. Yeah. No because I I grew up mostly homeschooled for most of my life so like the people who I was around were people that my parents liked and who were good Jesus people. Right? And

then all of a sudden, I go to public school and then there's just all these people who are like, oh, yeah. Jesus rocks on Sunday. Most of the time. It's like people who use, like, the title Christian rather than, like, being actual Jesus followers, I feel feel like. Yeah for sure. Like I definitely I'm very scared to say like yeah I'm a Christian around people because I'm like people have ideas of what that means rather than what it actually is or what that really means. Oh like I just say I follow Jesus rather than saying I am Christian because I struggle with, like Like the the Christian might have a a negative connotation to it because of the duality. Yes. Those are Dan's hits. I remember Dan. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. Those such things. I've kinda swung back the other way, though. I'm using the word Christian again because I think, wait a minute. That's our term. You know? It's like, I'm not gonna let you steal that from us. Dan wants it back. I want it back.

I'm reclaiming Christian. But I'm I like if you have to look back over old sermon looks. I I the word Christian never even appears. It's just I just always have Christ follower. Mhmm. Because it's more descriptive. Yeah. Ella, do you feel like like you've run into the same thing or that you're like maybe like or maybe even questioned yourself. You're like, maybe I don't quite understand how to be a Christian because it seems like I'm trying to do the things or I feel shame about the things and these folks seem to be just fine with it. I have actually never questioned it because I've grown up my entire life with many good

influences and many people that I oh, sword. You're like examples. Examples. Yeah. Was like a Inspiration? We'll go with that. Inspiration basically like someone someone you look up to. Idolizing. Someone that like gave me an example of what Jesus looks like and I've seen many versions of that but I've always found, I've always met people who are like oh yeah I'm a Christian and I'm like well then what was that? And they're like, well God forgives.

I'm like, well he does do that but what but you're you're flaunting a title that you don't actually own. It's like saying I have this purse and you stole it from someone else and it's you. Jesus is like a stolen purse. I love it. False questions are like a No, stolen I've seen a couple things about that and that's been rough but another thing that has been rough is what I feel like is bringing Jesus into the conversation. Like when people have asked me for advice or when people are hurting and they're telling me and I want to say, well, have you prayed about it? Or I just say, can I pray for you? And I always get a weird look. I get a narrowing of eyes and they go, I mean, I guess. And I was like, well, where why is this weird am I weird? What's happening? And I'm

I I don't know how to bring it in in a way and I've I feel embarrassed about it sometimes because I want to bring it into the conversation but then I've lost friends because of it. I've lost friends because I've said, well, I can pray for you and they're like, would you do that? Yeah. I'm like, because I love you and I want to help you and I want to love you in the way that I know that I can and it's it has taken a knockdown in my faith before because I've felt like I can't I don't want to say anything because I don't want to be judged and I don't want people to get the wrong idea of me. Yeah. Yeah. I could I I I mean, honestly, that's a that's a a continued struggle. I don't know that like I think we always try to set a line that goes, if I'm keeping Jesus out of a conversation he belongs in, that's a shame on me. Right? But if I'm throwing Jesus in as a token in a conversation so you know who I am, that's no good either. So it feels like a weird line when especially when someone you know that they don't hold God in high esteem, they're not His Lord and Savior. But like the right answer to their problem is, is like that it's a God level problem. Jesus should be involved in this whole thing because there's all kinds of broken here and I only know one way do things get restored. And without going into that big speech, like sometimes I'll just go, listen, I know this isn't your vibe, man, but I'm telling you, like, I'm a pray on this for you. And so I'll pray on it with you if you want to. But if you say no, then I'm just gonna pray on it on your behalf. And like, basically they get the chance to go, you do you buddy. You know what I'm saying? And then I don't pray. Like I'll pray for the thing that I told them I was gonna pray about and then I'm just gonna pray that Jesus come after them,

like on the sly, you know? Yeah. I've had coffee with a couple people and I've asked them like, well, has your life been like? And don't want them to spill every trauma they've ever had to me. Just want to know like how did you get here? And I've had coffee with a lot of people who have had bad church experiences. And they were like, I was a Christian, but I don't want to be one anymore because based on the example I was given, it's not something I want to participate in. And I was like, what example were you given? It's not a good example of a Christian. It doesn't feel rightful.

You know, that that be my encouragement, though. Like, you're gonna have those disappointments. You're gonna have those moments where people are gonna let you down. And and and don't let that shake your faith. You know, like it did that person. You know, that's my encouragement because you're you're gonna see all these people who who say they're Christians and aren't acting like it, and at some point, I've known people who just like, well, why should I try either? And I and I think that's a good encouragement for believers to keep following. You know, there's people that you can't control them. You can't help what they do, but you can keep an eye on your own faith. Mhmm. Did you did you think it would be easier? Do you know what I'm saying? To like present like if we say this is good news, right? Mhmm. And then you're like, what? It doesn't feel like anyone's taking this as good news, right? They're they feels like they're taking it in as a judgment against them for not believing it, right? So like is the the question is is like is there something that we should learn from that? Either

the way that we're presenting it or maybe we can't control what their experience has been up to that point but we can control how we approach people. So both things in tandem. We six, seven, dang it. Can we we look at it maybe how we approach people a little bit differently or is there something like in general that like that says,

you know, we we still need to broach this subject because it's literally the most important thing in the world. How can we do it in a way that they can hear it? Yeah. I do think it's like because I, like, for me, I didn't grow up going to church. And so, like, when I ended up with a Jesus community, I ended up with a Jesus community. And so then it was all a sudden going, oh, I my friends are not at all. Yeah. And so, like, having to figure that out also of, like, how to not push it on them or make it seem like because I've had many conversations with one specific friend that they're like, I don't like people praying for me because I feel like they're just trying to change me. And that's even something like in Iowa City, my bible study that we had, like we talked about it a lot of like how do you pray for somebody and bring it up without making it seem like that's the only important thing about them. Yeah. Like, how do you have that conversation that, like, you're only going to be friends with them because then they do like Jesus? And, like, just trying to figure out that that's not like, you want it for them, not for yourself about them. Yeah. And that's that's the thing they're gonna misunderstand about you. Right? Like they're gonna like, I've I've been accused of this before. It's like you literally only have coffee so you can tell people about Jesus. And I'm like, accurate. That is accurate.

It's that's not the whole picture, but that is accurate. Right? Because at the end of the day, I'd really have to not like you. You know, I'd have to think very low of you and not care anything about you to tell you I I always pick a dumb example here, but it's always like, if I knew that if if there there's a very simple instructions for you to walk across the street and they're gonna give you $500. Like, what kind of jerk wouldn't tell you that? Where I'd go, hey, man. There's a free $500 across the street. All you gotta do is walk across there, say squirrel hat, and then they're gonna hand it over. And and they're like I'm sorry. Squirrel hat? It was a like I said, I got started on the example, I didn't have it already tuned up. Squirrel was my first word. That's what I'm saying. So but but, like, the gospel is the same thing to me apart from being so silly. It's like I know this thing that completely changed my life. And if like, you cannot possibly think that I am not going to try to tell you about it. And so but what they think is is like, you think I'm a bad person. All you wanna do is judge me. And like, all you wanna do is change me. And the truth of the matter is, actually, I want Jesus to change you. I'd prefer to have nothing to do with it. I would like to watch Jesus work in you and around you and show you the difference. So maybe actually for the more pointed part of the conversation, this is where it gets a little bit in Holy Spirit stuff, that sometimes God is moving in someone's life and sometimes He is not right then and there. God is always active in drawing people to Him, but there's parts of the Bible that will bear this out, that He will

push you away so you can see it. And so sometimes what feels like our best efforts to go, Hey, listen to this thing about Jesus. Or, He wants this for you. Or, He died for our sins. Like they don't have an ear to hear it. They just flat out don't have it. And like sometimes they're in a space where God is not working in their heart. And that takes a little bit of discernment on our part to go, I don't know. Like, and you can you can you usually tell? Don't you think when someone is kinda like like like bringing something up or like they're starting to wanna have a certain conversation with you and your your eyebrows perk up and you're like, oh, I feel like we're talking about Jesus stuff and you started it. I'm totally in on this. You know? Or like like sometimes you try to bring it up and they just have these dead eyes. They're like, move on. We're not we're not gonna spend a whole lot of time on this. Yeah. Gotta kinda read the room a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. I've had that happen before. And I've said like I've said, can I pray for you? And they go, I don't want your pity. I was like, this is not pity. No. I'm not trying to pity you. I just I want I have a lord that can help. Yeah. I have I have an entity. I have I have help and they're like, well, don't want it and I'm like, so if you got shot with a bullet and you got offered medical service and you were just like, I don't need it. I can do this on my own. You're raw dogging it out here. You're not gonna be able to get very far. A 100%. Like this is once again, I think Dan's right. This is where you start to read the room a little bit and you go,

sometimes when people push back against something that I've said about Jesus, they're like, I don't I don't want Jesus' help or I don't want your God involved or whatever. I'm like, okay. Let's just level the decks here. How things going under your watch, friend? It sounds like you just got done for the last twenty minutes singing me this song on how terrible things are and this is all bad and you and you feel like you're alone and you're depressed and no one's your friend. And I'm telling you that there's a different option and you're not even you're not even interested in trying it. So who's the fool now? You don't doctor Nagrandi, you gotta Don't say don't say that. Don't don't do that. Okay. I've definitely done that. But once again, only if I can tell when God's moving in their life. Right? Like some people they need a little help and a little push. And even if it's especially folks that are so pinned in on their own logic that you will go, listen, based your logic, you're the problem. Everything you said has been created by you. And so, like, you have no way to fix it. You have no way to redeem it. You have no way to bring hope into it. And then I offer up the option of a God who loves you and would like to take on these burdens on your behalf? And you're like, no. That seems hard to take in as an equation. You explain to me how that doesn't work. So how do you think you'd go about starting a conversation like that? Because I know I have a really hard time with starting conflicts and such. Yeah. And how would you go about starting a conversation like that, like confronting someone about something? It's I always find it easier like, first of all, if they're already following Jesus, this is a given. This conversation's just gonna happen because we've agreed to the same things. When

it comes to people who don't or are not currently interested, like I really do think it's a movement of the Holy Spirit on how that timing works out. And just like in Acts when they're like, Look, don't worry about the words you're gonna say. The Holy Spirit will provide you what to say. Mostly I think it's about having some discernment and humility before God that says, God, I'm open to having these conversations. I will say the thing that you are putting me position to say, but you know I don't want to. You know that I'm worried that our friendship is gonna break because of this. You know that I think they're gonna think less of me because of it. And you can see all my broken. Now, if I'm still the guy, I am not going to Moses out of this thing. I'm gonna go. And so I think if we can start with a posture of humility that goes, God, whatever you're asking me to do or whatever relationship that you've put me in to be able to have that discernment to say the thing, give me the strength to say it. But like just firing out of nowhere, Now it's just it doesn't it's never worked like that for me. Dan, you ever have you ever had someone be like, hey, go talk to this guy and and tell him about Jesus and you're like, ah, man. Yeah. Yeah. And and I'll I'll go, but but it's

met with great resistance generally. You know? They have to know you're not just there to sell something to them. You know? Let me just sell Jesus to you. You feel like a door to door salesman almost. Exactly. Exactly. It's like they gotta get to know you a little bit and be able to trust you and know that what you're saying is is genuinely for them and and not just on, I need another notch in my belt. I need I need I need another one. I could say, yeah, I did that. Yeah. Because you can smell that too. You can. Yeah. Yeah. We we had a gal recently. Actually, she just passed away recently, but came to one of our little outreach things we do. We feed seniors in the area, and and she would come. And then she started coming to church, and then she started asking questions.

Became a Christian, she was baptized in September '24, so that's kind of the timing. And she just died. But I did not know is that she'd a lesbian for like decades. Yeah. And lived lived her I mean, just lived a very different lifestyle. And she had completely turned her life into a different she's a different person now. I met her in the hospital a few weeks ago, and we had this in-depth Bible study that she was introducing. You know, I was just going up to say, hey, how you doing? And she's like, oh, I've been reading this, reading that. It's just kinda cool Yeah. To see she was ready. You know? I I wasn't like, I'm gonna find me a lesbian and see if I can't, you know, that that's, you know, that's just kinda ridiculous. Yeah.

But but God was working in her heart, God opened doors here, and it all came together, and she's in heaven right now. And I'll get to see her again someday, which is kinda cool. Yeah. You know? I think that really just, it boils it down to that like, God is a good God and he loves the person you're worried. The person that you're hurt. Like he's given you a heart for that person and like that's never a bad thing. But I think where we get into trouble sometimes is and I mean I can attest to being guilty of this. We just get impatient. We're like how much suffering are they gonna have to go through before they turn to you Father? And like sometimes I will worry that like I know you're good, God, but like people can still tell you to pound sand. What do you do about that? Like they still have opportunity to tell you no and I know you won't make them, you know? But on the other hand, the Holy Spirit is very compelling. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Like there's a there's a Paul in Damascus that turned everything about his life around, Right? There's people in the hospital that like saw their life completely different and said, I know what I was trying to do, but I believed a lie. And worked off of it for years, and like, I wish I wouldn't have done that, but here's here I am. Here's what I'm going to do now. You know what saying? And so like, I think at the end of the day, when we start talking about how to talk to people, it has way more to do with our posture towards God and our humility and our ability to, you know, have discernment for the work he's doing around us than it is about creating our own opportunities.

Do you know what I'm saying? That's why the sign guy sucks. It's why even our drive by evangelism terrible. The tract system some people have told me it works. I'm like, I don't know. Seriously. But it does. God will use all kinds of things, and where we start getting into trouble is where we arrogantly either take things off the list or put them on as if they're the best decision that was ever made. So those are really good questions. Overall, do you feel like as you've tried to do this, have you had any successes? Have you had any time where you're like, I mean, they didn't say no and give me the bird. You know? I have a friend I've had a conversation with before about it and, like, we've had

stuff come up again, like, where he's brought something up. And so then, like, I go, oh, like, maybe I've texted you about this probably actually. But, like, been like oh like I feel like I read into it too much of like oh they brought they said this one thing so like is this a success like are we moving somewhere or are we not type of thing and then you step in further and then they back away and you're like, oh shoot. We I messed weren't quite there yet. Right yeah. Like I brought up a bible study and they freaked out and I was like, oh never mind. Never went there. It was like it was even to the point of like you don't have they were like, to the one at your church? And I was like, no. Like, not at my church. Like, you just you and me. Like, that's it. Like, cup of coffee. Let's go. Yeah. And they were like, yeah, sure. Sounds good. And then I like brought it back around like Easter or something and was like, hey, just so you know, like, that's still an option. Yeah. Like, I'm not forcing you. I'm not doing. But, like, this is still an option. And it was like,

yeah. I'll think about it when I have time. Yeah. And you're like, ew. Weirdo. Never mind. And I'm gonna talk to you about tithing too. Right. But yeah, like I don't like it felt like many of the conversations, was like, oh, this is going somewhere. And like Yeah. Oh, this happened. This conversation was great. This was great. And then it's just like, oh. Yeah. I have a similar story. Like the other day at work, I was there and I was talking to this guy and this guy is like, I wouldn't say like when I met him, I wouldn't have said he was like not like, I wouldn't have said he was against God, right? I would have been like, well, he's not firm in his faith, sure, but he's not like horrible. Anyway,

but then I, and like I mentioned something about Jesus or praying or something and he was like oh yeah that's cool and then next week I was telling my mom and she was like you should talk to him like more in-depth about it and I was like you're right I should. I get there and I mentioned like one thing and he was like I tried to sell my soul to the devil yesterday and I was like oh, like didn't know what to How did you do that? Was literally like, what? Okay, first of all, the failed attempt at selling the soul I find hilarious. I know. I was like, I'm so confused and my coworker's there and she kind of looks at me and she's like, I don't know. I really don't know what to say to that and I was like, oh, what happened? And he was just like, me and my friend just decided we wanted to do it and then it just didn't work and I was like, what do mean it didn't work? And he was like, I just wasn't feeling it. And I was like, interesting. Yeah. And I was like, I don't know what to say. I feel like Satan's like, why would I pay for something I already got? I got zero reason to give money for this. If you're gonna impulse do something, go get a tattoo. You're gonna sell your soul to the devil, go get I don't know. I think a guy did that once and then he got on a motorcycle and it caught on fire. That's a comic, never mind. And

I was so excited to share it with this guy because I was like, he seemed pretty open. You could tell he wasn't from like the best and then he just went on and on about like and like way down the hill I would have been like there's no way. There was such a way. It was so bad. And he was like Teen Challenge is a cult. I was there. He was like they're just a bunch of Christian maniacs and I was like alright, I don't think I can, you know, I can try to like bring up good parts, not good parts, like what following Jesus is like but everything I said, like even if it was just like, do you need prayers on that? He's like, do you think I need prayers on that? I was like, yes, I do actually, 100% and this guy's over here just like oh it was so bad, it was so bad, so bad. Bailey? I forgot what I was gonna say so damn it. Yeah so overall like maybe I can just give you a couple

of general principles that I believe have held in my life, which is when the Holy God passes by somebody, I think you're gonna know that. Right? So like don't feel like you're on the hook for trying to discern guesses or movements of the wind. I would be very open to when people like want to talk about God with you. If they initiate a conversation about Jesus with you, I just call that an instant, Okay, God's moving in their life. Let's have this conversation. Right? So like there's pretty much no guess in that. Or sometimes like when they start to recognize their own sin,

that is not something that generally comes to people who don't have the Holy Spirit within them or working around them. Generally your own sin you just call either a personality trait or everyone else's problem. That's generally the way that we will view sin without Jesus. But like when your own sin starts to sit on you and you feel like it is causing you trouble, I would say that's generally conviction of sin is the Holy Spirit's area. Yeah. And so usually when they're like, hey my life's a mess, I've been doing this, I'm making this thing or whatever, that feels like a great time to jump in. I don't think you need to be like, let me pray on that. Maybe he'll say the word Jehoshaphat and I'll be like, totally. That's it. That's the one I'm jumping in. I'm not saying that the Holy Spirit can't work in stuff like that, but like overall it like because what ends up happening is is you're like, I'm missing all God's opportunities. You know, like maybe I'm not I'm not close enough with him and so he's discounted me and are having these conversations. And then now you're out of the game, following around some weird puzzle system. And I don't think God loves us in this way. It just doesn't sound right to me. And there was another situation where it's kind of the same thing where people say they're a Christian. Girl was like,

she said something about going to church or something. I was like, Oh, that's cool. Where do you go to church? Stuff like that. She told me, she was like, Yeah, go with my family every week. I'm like, That's awesome. Talking about being super involved with her youth group. I was like, this is great. And then the next day, the next time I worked with her, she was like, dude, I was so drunk at prom last night and I was like, nice. Then she was like, oh man, it was so bad. And she showed me videos and she was cursing at people and it was so bad. She's like, Dude, I basically broke up with my boyfriend. I was so drunk and I was like,

Great. And then she's like, Dude, I'm so excited for church on Sunday. And I was like, What? And I was like, I mean, I'm glad, but you know, it's just like so many things. She's like, yeah, we smoked weed, we did drugs, I'm like, oh great. Boy, what is she, just like a comic trifecta? Literally, and she's over here, she's like a very, like you would consider her super popular. She goes to Southeast Polk, she's very popular. And whatever, she's like, Dude, I can, she's like, I think I'm on a pretty good roll. I can count on my fingers the amount of times I've drank. And I was like, Me too. Like, I don't feel like that's, I mean maybe, this girl's like 16, like newly 16 and I was like wow that's something. So like this is the hard part is allowing people to claim the redemption that God provided for them while they are yet imperfect and while they are maturing in their faith. Like if your example of following Jesus was claim the name of Christ, show up at church on Sunday, and then in between times you can basically do whatever you want as long as you know that God is God. And that's all. That's all you've been shown and that's all you've been discipled into.

I was more harsh on this when I was younger. And so maybe I feel like that's changed in me some, but I feel like I didn't leave a lot of space for people to mature and to understand what God's actually calling them to. But like on the other hand, a cursory reading of even one of the books of the Bible goes, Yeah. Right. None of that is gonna work. And so like it's not just a bunch of dried up rule following Christians that are like, Hey man, you need to get your drinking under control. And like we actually serve,

we're sacrificial people when it comes to people around us, which means your aim is not to make much of yourself. And so those character traits just tell me that whatever God is doing in your life, it's not happened yet. You have not been humbled in a way that makes you realize that God is God and you are you. And so I'm not saying that it's not a done conversation. Where I think earlier in my life I would have been like, they're not even Christian. They're completely terrible. They're not even and I would have been really final

about my assessment. And there's people out there that are broken in so many ways and they couldn't see a light at the end of the tunnel with a set of binoculars and a flashlight pointing at them, and God will redeem that too. And so like all of that is still on the table. So I think the harder part for us is because we're not mature yet either. We have our own stuff. Ours is just not quite as red letter as far as we're concerned. Know what I'm saying? Like I'm just as disobedient as most people. I've just had it in a controlled way so it doesn't blow up my life. Yeah I feel like it's the same thing of like you I mean we've had the conversation multiple times of like if the Holy Spirit is not there, the change is not gonna happen. And like if the Holy Spirit shows up, there is no way that you are not going to change. I mean you even talked about that with like the new Bible study, like Elijah's study that we're doing. Like the amount of texts that you're like, the Holy Spirit's gonna show up and you're gonna change. Like, there is no way that you are gonna have something, like if they are not wanting to move away from the sin, then the Holy Spirit's not there with them. Like, there's no way that they're just gonna be like, yeah. Like, he is going to be too strong, you cannot get in his way.

Yeah. I think that that's where I've recognized most movement, where it doesn't feel like that I produced anything. Didn't say the whiz bang thing. I didn't have the best argument. People just show up and they're like, Tell me more. And I'm like, What? I thought this was gonna end like the rest of them. You know what I'm saying? Where they're like, Go away. Dan, would you say most of that's pretty accurate? Absolutely. Yeah. And sometimes you get discouraged as a believer thinking, man, I'm trying to do my job here. I'm trying to do my, you know, make disciples. I'm trying to spread the good news and nobody cares. And it's like, well, God's working on people's hearts and they're in different places and

his timing is perfect and you're not gonna change that. Yeah. You know, you're gonna suddenly argue them to Jesus or something or but they hit that moment when because they know you're a person of faith, they'll come to you with the questions. Yeah. And that's the beautiful thing is is when they come to you and like you're like, I trust you with these answers, and you kinda struggle and work it out together. Like, you don't might not know the answer right away. It's like, well, let's study this together. You know, let's let's open the Bible. Let's let's let's figure this out. And that's kinda cool. That's really cool. So so based on all of that, you guys, Simeon, we'll start with you. How do you measure success in the thing that you believe God has you doing then?

Hard. Oh, boy. That is a tough question to answer, honestly. But I think measuring success in what you said In what God has you doing. Because God didn't create everybody to be a pastor of 10,000 people. Right? God didn't create everybody to be the all star worship musician.

And so let's say that you feel like God said, Hey, I want you to I have you getting involved in an after school basketball program with kids from the neighborhood, right? And so our tendency would be to go, everybody will be slain in the spirit and instantly want baptism within three weeks. And we can't measure success that way. So, like Yeah. How how do we measure success? So I honestly think what success is is doing what God tells you to do. Just as simple as that. You know what I mean? Like, if

he's telling you, like you said, to start this youth basketball thing, if you do that, that's success because God will move from your obedience. Yeah. And what what if you're there three years and no one no one accepts Christ and, like, you still get high fives and and people seem to be willing to talk to you, but then it disbands. Success? Yes. Mean, you did it. Yeah. You did what God told you to do. Yeah. Success. Like

there's plenty of biblical principle for this right? Yeah. The sower sows the seed. That's what he did. Yeah. So maybe that's the hard part is we expect that even asking people out for coffee, you have zero idea completely what's going on in people's lives and just someone willing to hear about them in their life was more love than they got in the last six months. And so it's a complete change of pace for them. And they're like, Well that's different. And so yeah, I think the hard part is not getting discouraged in the things that God has asked you to do even if the fruit that comes out of it is actually not yours to see. This

will come up in Elijah. Elijah goes up to King Ahab and says this thing. It ain't gonna rain or dew for like three years. And then he sticks Elijah out in the mountains for eighteen months. He doesn't even see the reaction to it. He comes in, says the thing, and he cuts the trail. You know? And so like sometimes that gets to be us too where we don't even get to see all the work or the phrase. I've had people come up to me years down the road and be like, Remember when you said blah blah blah blah blah? I'm like, No. I had no idea I said something like that. It's cool. I think it sounds right. I'd probably theologically almost disagree with it twenty years down the road. But at the time, yeah, it probably made sense to me. I think we're talking about measuring success in the thing that God is asking you to do. So ultimately the question starts boiling down to, if you start following the trail back it goes, how do we measure success in the thing that God told us to do? Oh wait, we first have to know what God told us to do. How do we hear God's voice? How do we know what He's asking us to do? Oh, well we probably have to know God pretty well to be able to hear His voice and understand the way that He would act and the way His character works. Oh, so that means we need to read His Bible and spend time in prayer. And like all those things contribute to if that's what you want, if you want to be part of

introducing people to Jesus, you're not going to do it by being quippy or smarter than people or even being friendly or even loving people well. That's kind of the hard one. You're like, I just love everybody. Well, if you never got around to actually telling them the thing that would change their life because you were too worried about them loving you. If you love them, then you're like, This is on the table all the time. If God asked me to sacrifice a friendship of mine actually He has done this. He has asked me to sacrifice a relationship by saying a thing Actually out of love to someone that took it very poorly. And it was one of those things that I had prayed on and I'm like, We're gonna have to do it. And I did. And it did. It cost me exactly what I thought it was gonna cost me. Except for that bill hasn't come due yet. Right? That's a time based measurement that I'm making. And so I'm like, It cost me that friendship today. What it's going to gain as far as I can understand in the hope of Jesus and the promises that God has made is it will gain an eternal

family member for me forever. And they will walk with Jesus because of it. I said, If that's what's gonna happen, I'm in. Apostle Paul, just the Bible in general. Mean it says, We don't know. There's some who plant, there's some who water, there's some who are there for the harvest, right? And you're talking to someone, you have no idea if you're doing any of those three. Maybe you're planting a seed that five years later, someone's gonna water a little bit, and all of a sudden, five years after that, they'll be like or forty years after that, they'll be at this church and start asking questions because of somebody else years ago, you know, planted seeds and watered it. You just don't know what part of the process you're at. You just be faithful. You share the word. You just share what you can. And God does the rest. He works on the hearts and he puts the pieces in motion. I always look at it as a big chessboard. He's moving the pieces around. All I know is I'm a little pawned and I'll just go where he tells me and do what he wants and say what he wants and let him worry about the results. And you know, I feel like one,

I completely agree with Simeon about like the obedience thing. Feel like that's really important. But then also I think sometimes I really struggle to be like immediately obedient with that. Like I struggle with that in my life right now. I honestly dislike being obedient sometimes. I'm like, what the heck? Why? Like I Real. Like I just do. And like honestly, I think I have a problem with authority and that's really something I need to work on. But anyway, but like I was reading Ezekiel today and it was like there were multiple things about like God telling someone to do something and it was like instant, you know, like just like no doubt, no hesitation, just do it. And I'm like, or like, you know, like when Abraham is like sacrifices

Isaac, I'm like, if I had a son and God was just like, hey, go murder your son. I'd be like, what? Like I just, I want and I've been praying about this a lot. Like I want to learn to have that like immediate obedience, you know? And like I don't want to question it. I don't want to like hesitate it. Like I feel like I'm more so actually to question myself. Like you know, is this coming from God or is this just me? And like I think that all the time, like even like something where I'm like, I should talk to that person. I'm like, no, I shouldn't. That's just me. But then I actually probably should, you know, because maybe it was from God. And even if it was from like, even if I thought it was from me, maybe it was still a good thing I should have done, you know? And it's like, yeah. Yeah. Like

ultimately I would say I'm with you 100%. And so even the the thing that I'm going to say is a reflection that I am still continually disobedient and I have an authority problem. So same zis, Layla. But like overall, generally when that stuff comes up to me, I have a love problem. Like I have a love problem with God. Because like there's a chair in my house and I've never once doubted that that chair was gonna hold me. Not one time. Right? And it's

yet to fail me. And I sit with extreme confidence on that chair because the first time I sat on the chair, it held me. And the second time I sat on the chair, it held me. And what it did is it helped build my faith in the chair. And so I never look at that chair and doubt that it's gonna do the thing that I expect it to do. And so usually that is actually how our faith grows, is God invites us into something and we trusted him. Even when we are sketchy about it, we are like, I don't know. I feel like this has got me out on the wind a little. And then He was faithful in it. And you like, Oh, okay, maybe I can trust this. Or maybe when everybody else was doing like the thing at work that would put them ahead and make them a big deal in the manager's eyes and you refused. You're like, I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna do the integrity thing and I'm not going to be on break longer than I should or steal from the register or take seven sodas when they said we get one free soda a shift or whatever, right? And so you are like, I don't see how this is going to get me ahead because it seems like all you have to do is be friends with the manager and you have a way better shot instead of being, I'm going to clean this stuff and live honestly. The other route seems like it would get me way further but that's not what I'm going to do. And like you trusted God in the way that he said to live and then you'll watch him get fired one by one. And you watch the manager get moved because they were corrupt and they bring in a new manager who actually notice what looks like Layla is the only one that is cleaning this joint. Do you know what I am saying? Like it is trusting God in the way that not only He does the big things or like inviting us into witnessing to people or talking about His goodness in general, but also in how we do the everyday things that go, Look, I know what the temptation is going to be that the world says this is how you are going to gain. And God is like, We play the long game and I promise you this is where all of it comes from. So it tends to be a love problem. I don't trust Him that I'm watching everyone else succeed.

And then I'm sitting here squaloring or not making any gains or even stuff around me is kind of falling apart. I'm like, God, I feel like I was obedient to you and this place is still on fire. This seems unfair. And I just feel god's like, son, we've been through this enough. I mean, I've watched this go on since I created this world. Just calm down. You know? I feel like it's again well, it's once again like a timely thing. Like, we have a different timeline than he does. Yeah. And it's, like, over and over again, he's just like, yeah. I told you to wait. You're still waiting. Like, no matter what. Like, yeah. You're still waiting. And we're just like, wait. But you you said you said short. But it's like, no. His short is or, like, just different timelines completely. And, like, I definitely am going, like, oh, it's been months. Like, that should have been long enough. Right? Yeah. Months is a long time. Wait. No. It's not. Turns out months is not a long time. You want ten years? Oh, okay. Yes. I will. Abraham, you're gonna have a child in twenty five years. Yeah. And maybe you're eagerly anticipating when the show might end, you think. You think, wow. I didn't think it wouldn't go on this long. Well, you've been listening to Live From Path, streaming on the YouTubes on the lifestyle, then you can catch us on podcasts on Spotify, and I listen to it on Apple Podcasts. All the places. All the places. And so there's all kinds of places you can access Live From The Past. Also, Live From The Past got an album out. It's only got one song on it, but it's got the kicker Prophet's Cry. I'm pretty sure we're into the show with that if I know how to operate this stuff. And so

you should dig on that. It's a pretty sweet tune about the book Amos. I find it pretty quick minute and a half, two minutes worth of song to at least start your day with when you get in the car. So go check that out on Amazon or Spotify. Look up Prophets Cry by Life From The Path. Do we need to do an acapella version of it for everybody? Prophets cry. Is that the only part you know? Yep. I've listened to this song once. Okay. We did have one other topic and we'll just hit it right fast and then we'll get to some advice but it had to do with I listen to a lot of worship music in general just because I'm a worship pastor guy.

Was a like, Brandon Lake's been on the scene for a while. He's the he's the big deal at the moment. And overall, it's hard for me to discern the difference between the image that people project and who they truly are. I find most of that is found over coffees or bible studies with somebody or just being somebody's friend. You can kinda see what they're up to. But as far as I can tell, Brandon Lake seems pretty earnest in the thing that he's doing. But he's been taking a lot of flack here lately because he keeps doing collabs with non Christian artists. Right? He did one with Jelly Roll. Was collabs not a cool thing for me to say?

At your age, no. What? Okay. Well, it's just like it's just early like earlier when you said real. I just I'm with it. I'm a youth pastor. I'm with it? He's hip. He's hip. Yeah. Wap. I don't know. Okay. Simeon, what's a better word for collab? I I would Collaboration. I don't know what's Collaboration. Use the full government name. Collaboration. Okay. Together. Don't worry. Lake's been doing collaborations with he did one with Jelly Roll,

who's a secular artist, he did a he did a collaboration with Joe Jonas? Nick Jonas. Nick Nick One One of the Jonas. Very excited. So either way, what he's inviting them to is to collaboration with him on they're not worship songs. Right? Like there's a kind of distinct difference between worship songs which tend to be vertical. Like the words are about relationship between us and God. And then there's horizontal songs, which is most of Christian music these days, which has to do with what it's like to be us,

with a God existing. And so it's more that. It's more of a vertical song. Or I'm sorry, horizontal songs. But like he's been inviting who are predominantly secular artists to do collaborations with them. And of course, it never fails. The internet will show up and be like, Oh, Brandon Lake's getting involved. I don't even know if he is Christian. He's hanging around with all these people and he says all these things and whatever. And so the reason we bring it up is because he just had a quick quip from he won an award at the K Level Awards here a couple days back. And I just happened to see one of the things that he said and he goes, You guys find yourselves

in really bright rooms. If we're the light of the world, then we're like even in this room, we're sitting in a very bright room. And if the question is is if every room you're in is really bright, you might wanna consider getting in some darker spaces so that your light is noticeable and is out in front of the world. And can actually maybe do some work instead of just celebrating the fact that it's pretty light in here. He did it in a fairly humble way, but it was a pretty stinging indictment of basically us just hiding around as a bunch of Christian artists or Christians in general, and we're like, We're just really happy that we're saved. And we're not super interested in getting involved with a bunch of broken mess because I don't want to get it on me.

And the reason we bring it up is because like the Christian worship community and some of the contemporary Christian music stuff over the last even two, three years have been getting hit pretty hard with people who are posturing in a way as if they were living this Jesus lifestyle, either by putting out vertical tunes or horizontal tunes, just about their relationship with Christ or what it feels like to be a Christian. And it turns out that it was a sham. They just wanted to sell tunes to people. And frankly if you're a decent musician at all, it's pretty easy to dominate in a Christian world. We usually get music about ten years behind everybody. And so our music is not generally cutting edge. Whatever was cool ten years ago has now made its way to the Christian sphere and now we're using it. Now we are like, Oh, this stuff is so good.

Anyway, the reason I bring it up is sometimes it's hard to tell. It's because this is a new problem. Right? Like had when pastors of local churches before the internet and widespread media was around, you got to test their fruit. Like you saw them living day to day. The decisions that they made, the way they raised their kids, the language that they used when they weren't performing or preaching or whatever. Like you had an opportunity to get to know them and find out the fruit that's coming out of them to validate whether they can be trusted for you to be vulnerable and understand who God is because of that man or

that gal. And so modern Christian worship does not have the same ability. You are basically taking people's word that they follow Jesus. And if they use the words of Jesus, people have done worse things with the words of They have taken things that God meant for good and they used it for harm. Or most likely they used it for self gain. Like they wanted to be popular. At the end of the day, Jesus is a polarizing figure. And so if you are willing to go out and preach a sermon with Jesus' name in it, even over Matthew five, half the crowd is gonna love you. They'll be like, Yes, speak it. This is the truth. And you're gonna get all the praise and glory and you're gonna keep it if that's what you wanna do. Or you're gonna polarize the other half of the crowd that don't wanna and think you're crazy. But the ones that are in, they're super in. They're like, Yes, speak the Lord's words. This is awesome. And people have taken God's word and used that for their own glory quite a bit over history. We have wars as

a result of it. And we have people that have done the worst things with God's attention and have taken the glory for themselves. And so the question is, as we look at some modern worship and maybe some of the stuff that Brandon Lake is saying is one, do we have any opportunity to vet these folks? Do you know what I'm saying? Do we just trust them as they are? If they are speaking God's words, Paul will say, Look, if they are not for us, they are against us. If they are not against us, they are for us. So right? If they are speaking God's words and it holds to biblical truth, I can still worship it even coming from a phony. You know? I've been rebuked by people who don't love Jesus, and the Holy Spirit went, That's true about you. They didn't use biblical language, and they didn't come at it from a heart of Christ, but everything they just said should convict you. So it can do work. So the question is, one, how do we do that in a modern era where we can't actually vet the fruit of most of these folks? And two, is Brandon Lake right? Do you feel like there is risk that we just sit around Lake and basically sit in very bright rooms? What do you think, Simeon? I

actually kind of like what he's doing. I think that the main thing he's doing is he's reaching an audience that usually doesn't hear Jesus or know Jesus through these other artists. Because these people, they're still gonna listen to what's his name? The juicy dude. I forgot his name. One of the Jonas's?

Jelly Roll. Jelly Roll. Yeah. The juicy dude. They're listen to the Jonas's still. And the thing is, like, he's reaching an audience that doesn't usually hear about Jesus. You know what I mean? Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. I I I think they're figuring out who Lake is and go, hey, maybe I'll listen to some of his songs and then you get gospel. Yeah. Exactly. So so the question is, like, some people would accuse this of being a watered down filtered gospel. They're like you're making it more palatable

for people, but you've not put every bit of the truth of Jesus in there. You haven't talked about conviction of sin in there or how you shouldn't have done that. It's like a children's bible. Yes. You don't put the whole thing in there. It's like, this is enough to get the when they get older, they'll go, oh, I need more. Exactly. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. I think that's very much the truth. Finlay? And, like, I feel like also, again, like, he is it's not just his song, it's with somebody else and so, like, if they're not fully agreeing with that, then they're not gonna put that out. And so, like, it being less of a thing and then he's not scared to pull his punches anywhere else. So, like Mhmm. It's not like he's I don't think that that makes it any worse by him doing it with somebody else because like, if they're not fully as much into it as he is, then like, they're not gonna let him do that. Yeah. Be as strong, like, willed with it. And then so you still have all of his to back him up. And then he also is not scared of pole punches. Like, aft that song those songs have come out and now he's doing the speech and he's like, yeah. No. Like, he's not scared of punches. Why I'm doing what I'm doing. Yeah. Yeah. Leila, do you feel like how much how much are these worship people on the hook? Because like, usually the condemnation for stuff like Brandon Lake is doing is like you're

are bringing the weight. It usually has to do with conviction of sin. You know what I'm saying? But like you are bringing the weight of the Gospel. It's like God does want to redeem these things within you. But we have to agree that they need redeemed. Right? Like we are not even agreeing on what sin is, and you are not going to bring it up because it makes it really awkward for people listening to your song and you like, This is going be very divisive. And so they accuse modern worship or modern Christian artists of being like, Look, you are only saying that God loves you, God wants best for you, and He wants to save you and get rid of your depression and anxiety. But you didn't mention any of the ways that God is going do that, which is He is going to come after some sin in your life to get that weight off you. Do you feel like that is a fair thing to accuse them of? I mean,

in some I mean, in most cases, probably. Because, like, I don't know. I feel like I don't know. I don't know I want to say here. Like, it's not their job. Like, I don't think it's their job to do it. Like, I mean, yes, they were given this platform and all of these things, but, like, you're not in line behind them. You're in line behind Jesus.

And it's not their I don't think that's the job. Like, yes, because also, like, if you give them any point of it, like, they are still speaking the truth even though they're not giving you all of it. They're still speaking truth and they're getting your foot in the door. Like, I think that that can bring points of, like, things again, it's like planting seeds. It's not their job to do all of it. Yeah. I think that's a good point. How much truth can you put in one song anyway? You know what saying? What are you just gonna sing Deuteronomy? You know I'm saying? Like, what do you expect out of people? We don't even do this for sermons. Or if you meet somebody that's like, Man, I've just been real

down on myself lately and I've been kind of depressed and anxious. And I'm like, Well how are you sinning? What's your sins? You know what I'm saying? I'm not gonna say it like that. What's going on with your life? You know? And so like, to to to your guys' point, I I think there is a risk that people will water down what they tell people to be popular. This is the iffy part, right? Like if

you're not listening to somebody who is preaching and teaching over and over and over again, if they're skipping the juicier parts, the parts that cause division and hard ness, especially in our culture, if they are skipping that because they don't want to have you dislike them, then yeah, they are not trustworthy with the Gospel. Right? But like not every conversation is, Have you read Romans one? You know what I'm saying? Like all the hot button topics, let's just get those nailed out first. I think people get to mature into that. I think God works that out in them. And like you're not responsible for searching the Holy Spirit searches hearts. The Holy Spirit pulls sin out. And they have to lay it down. You can't take it from them. And so you do have to tell them what God says about it. You do have to be honest about God's opinion on things and how He says a world is designed to work. But as far extracting that sin out of them, that is the Holy Spirit's job to convict and it is the Holy Spirit's job to send it up for redemption. And it is Jesus' blood that pays for it. And so like I think there is

a holding it in balance that comes firing out with the biggest possible bat we own. But if you try to sell the bat as if you're never going to use it, you're a coward. And you don't love people the way that Jesus loves them. Because He said it. He said that has to go. He said that thing is harming you. You know what I'm saying? And so like, I mean, yeah, what do we expect these people to put out one worship song that covers the whole Bible? It's the worst song ever. You know? Well, yeah, that's the same thing too. It's, like, it's a song like, they're given a platform. Yes. And, like, they are reaching many people, but they're not sitting down having a cup of coffee with you. So, like, I don't again, it's, like, because it's not their job. Like, they're not the ones, like, following up with you. Yeah. It's, like, that's not their point. Like, if it was somebody, like, yeah, they're only showing the love or they're only showing, like, they're heal gonna your depression this way or He's gonna do this and he's gonna do that and they're only being, like, the fluffy parts of it or whatever. Yeah. Like,

that's okay again because it's not their job. If it was, like, somebody, like a mentor, a pastor that was only doing that and they're following up and they're not following up with like, hey, this is how you, like, preparing you to, like, understand that the Holy Spirit's gonna come in and, like, it's not all gonna be like rainbows and butterflies. It's going to be rough. It's going to be hard. Yeah. If your pastor is not preparing you for that or your mentor or whoever is not preparing you for that, that's an issue. But, like, I don't think that, like, it's Brandon Lake's job to tell everybody that. Dan, you feel the same? Yeah. Yeah. I I mean, like, I I I go on both sides. I almost I don't know. Yep. It happens to the Republicans, Dan.

Can you do it this way? I kinda find myself on both sides a little bit of like, if you're a Christian artist, you better be living a Christian life. Whether you're a teacher, a preacher, a singer, or whatever, if you're in public. You're not gonna be perfect, but live a life of integrity. Because you're gonna have to answer for that. The Bible says you're have to answer for that. The same time, God will use an absolute pagan to bring the gospel to people through music.

I did series for Christmas this last year, and I just, I don't know, do the same thing every year. Like, I gotta do something different. So I just picked up Christmas songs that we all grew up with, are 200 years old, that everybody's heard. They play them on every department store

over the loudspeakers and everything. And I got into the roots of these things, like half of these were like, well the priest went to the town drunk and said, Hey, you're a good poet, can you write some music? Yeah, Silent Night. I mean, you know, all these songs that we think of like, Oh, these deep people are praying and writing this song. Lot of them were like complete pagans. And then they said that it was sung for the first time by the church choir in that one little town, and then it became popular and blah blah blah. And here, we grew up with it and Wow, it's a big Yeah, song of our it's such a holy tune. Yeah, yeah, I know. I mean, I was shocked by some of these. And God has used it, and some of them are actually highly doctrinal. I can't remember which one I was looking like, Dude, how did you even know this stuff? Like he didn't he was not a Christian. Yeah. But he's just like, I guess I'll read some stuff about this and

come up with a tune. And there we go. So God can use someone who is not intending to share the gospel to share the gospel. I can instantly hear some drunk dude warbling silent night in the middle of a snowy road. Isn't that actually the story of, like, how it happened? Thought that was actually I can't I remember his it was like a priest talk to a guy guy who and maybe there was I I don't remember the details for sure. I have to look up again. But it was it was surprising to to me. Yeah. It was definitely a non Christian. Okay. You've been listening to Live From The Path. We covered lot of ground today. Basically, let me think how we can sum this up. The worship thing, just be be discerning. Like, I

do like to know where my music comes from. I will check up on people every once in a while. And like if I find out that, like, they are either avoiding hard questions or they are preaching the false gospel, I'll stop listening to it. I'm not saying that that is holy that's just me that I feel like I really want to know that I'm willing to accept products coming out of a flawed, broken Christian who's doing their best to show the world about a perfect Jesus. I'm totally in for that.

But folks that are actively trying to fool me And presenting as spiritual leaders. Yeah. I'm not in for that. And so like especially when I find someone that keeps kicking out tunes that I really like, I want to know more about them. Because they are taking up space in my heart. And I do a lot better

with songs when I need to be reminded about true things. My Bible verses are exactly where they are in the Bible, not so great. Tunes, that's where God keeps me. And so I get a lot of good things reminded about who God is through song. And so it's important to me on where it comes from. So I will go check out some people. But just be discerning on where you're getting your stuff at. Just because it's popular and just because it's catchy doesn't necessarily mean it needs to take up more room in your heart than God's actual words. So just be careful a little bit there. I feel like I just want it raw. Like I just want it straight, you know? I don't want all the the fancy, all the stuff, all the when they're singing it on stage, there's a bunch of steam and mist everywhere and I'm like, oh, stop it. You feel like they're trying to evoke something out of Yes. Yeah. Makes me so mad. Don't push me. I don't like preaching like that either. Mhmm. Like, every once in a while, sometimes the god will be moving in a in a guy, and he will give an empowered, like passionate, like full of emotion sermon. And, like, that I've seen that do its work. But like, when I feel like you're trying to sucker me into feeling bad about it like, if I ain't convicted about my sin, ain't nothing you say ain't gonna do it. God will get me driving to work three days from now, and I'll be like, oh, no. Mhmm. Okay. That's me. And I the guy's, like, crying or something and be like, we gotta repent of our sin. And I'm just sitting there like, I don't know what you're talking about. I feel awesome. And then, like, three days later, I'm like, oh, no. That was me. You know? Yeah. Ella?

Sorry. This like what you what Laila was talking about with, like, like all the theatrics is reminding me of a conversation we had recently about in the study, the group study that we do on Elijah with the video like it was a real like moody like it set the mood. Was It like look at this canvas. She is not scared of emotions. Like a breaking voice at all. And like I remember talking about this and like we agreed that like in more recent generations we're just like don't sell me something. Don't try and play because I can see what you're trying to do. I want the theatrics. Just give me the cold hard concrete. I don't want you to put a bow on it and put confetti on it and go, look, it's pretty. I just I just want the thing. Yeah. Just give me the thing. Don't give me the smoke machines. Don't give me the confetti. Just give it straight. I think we talked about this when Dawson was in here, but do you guys feel like you're hyper aware when people are trying to sell you something? Yes. Yes. And I also think that it's even more because of social media. Like, everything is fake. Yeah. Everything is fake. And, like, everything is a highlight reel that you're just, like, you're very like, I think everybody is very skeptical of, like, okay, what's actually real in this? Like, if you're putting all of these, like, big yeah, the smoke machine. If you're doing all these theatrics with it, then what is actually real about any of that? Yeah. Like,

especially, like, people that don't know Jesus. Like, then they're sitting here going, okay. So is any of this real? Because none of that is. So then, like, the stuff that you're talking about, is that real or are you just putting that on as well? Like, you know what I mean? Yeah. Maybe maybe we've been fooled into thinking that no one can tell that we're wearing a toupee. You know I'm saying? We're so used I'm sorry. I mean, think about it. Like, we're so used to like our worship or our even like our VBS programs or like our church sermon series where like this weirdo shows up in a roller coaster or it's like church at the movies and we're like doing Marvel themed villainy. Like we're so used to it that we don't realize that everybody knows we got a rug on. You know? And they're looking at it from the outside going, what the heck? That's stupid. Yeah. Stupid. I have a separate point but are you saying that Christians are not like a toupee but more like that hair transplant? Yes. We think it's

slick. We don't use glue. Think it's really cremation of the head. Yes. We're like, this is such a great representation and like everyone else is standing back 10 feet going, dude, wearing a rug, man. That's not his real hair. He's moving the whole thing. You know what I'm saying? The blew. I saw it go. We gotta do better than that. They put $200,000 into that LED screen. I don't care. Dang. I feel like like it's kind of a separate problem that we have is over analyzing. Like, we think everything trying to fool us even when something's legit. Yeah. Like that's so I feel like some people are skeptical about coming to Christianity because everything and like following Jesus and everything that we have is always like a show with lights and fun things and things to attract you like come on in we'll be fun in here but really we're just like you're a liar and it's like no it's actually great in here we just do that for fun. Yeah it's like I feel like people are scared that like we're turning Christianity

into like entertainment. Yeah. And it's like because you want them to like the same thing of like, that church doesn't have the good coffee so I'm not gonna do it or oh, I don't like that church's worship so I'm gonna stop going. Like we are trying to please them to stay rather than speaking truth and, like, having that convict for them to come back. Yeah. We're like I mean, literally thirty, forty years ago, that was the thing that drew them in. And, like, they're like, free childcare? Sweet. Don't have to worry about breakfast in the morning. Sweet. And then God did whatever work he did during that time period. But this generation shows up and goes, why are you even offering donuts? Is your place not good enough that I shouldn't come for the sermon of worship anyway? You have to bribe me in here with donuts? You're just very skeptical of the whole thing. Mhmm. I think too many people have seen, like, the ads on Instagram or Snapchat that's like, you can get paid to walk. And it's like, look at this app. Like, if you just say hi to five random people three times a day, you're going to get $60 out of it. And like, that just feel it's so fake. Everybody can tell it's fake because at some point they're going ask for your credit card. You can't give that. Yeah. Yeah, think I it's definitely worse in this generation because we have so many things being like pointed at us of like here look at this, here look at this. Like entertainment is everywhere like everything

Feels like the Las Vegas. Like everything is trying to get our attention that is just like what in what is any of like, is any of it worth it? But but you're still on Instagram. I'm not. I'm also not. You know what? I can't say that. But I don't wanna be. I'm not saying okay. This

this is a different conversation. If we're gonna get into the evilness of Instagram No. No. But There is but but there is I'm sorry. Instagram. But, like, just in general, like, our generation, like, everything is getting pulled like, because so many things are new with social media, with TV, with anything. Like, everything is getting trying to steal our Yeah. And and so, like, my from my perspective, I would go, if you know you're being played like a fiddle, why do you keep showing up to the show? See, it's it's the same thing's been going on forever. Like, in my generation, we would buy cereal, breakfast cereal, and on the back of it was if you just get six box tops and send it in with $2.99, you know, you're gonna get this fantastic whatever. And then, like, eight months later, you get this plastic thing that fell apart Okay. Immediately.

Based on Dan's example, I withdraw my rebuke. I was part of this cereal box problem. I would buy King Vitamin, maybe because there was a ring in there. Absolutely. But at some point, you're like, this is you just like you get to the point where you're like, this is all dumb. It's like, I'll still do the cereal, I'm throwing that thing. I'm not even playing I'm not gonna don't care about the ring no more. Yeah. Yeah. I'm buying this cereal for the For the vitamins. For the cereal. Part of a balanced meal. Thanks. Instagram is the new king vitamin. And I on the Instagram thing, I think it's so easy for us to do it because it's easy. You know? It's not a hard thing for us to do. It's so easy. It doesn't take brainpower. You just you scroll. You just scroll. You like something. You scroll. Yeah. Well, also, like, our generation is so scared of missing something. Like, we all have FOMO. It's chronic FOMO that it's like, if you are not on it, like, the amount of things my sister has shown me when I'm not on social media and she's sitting here going, oh, did you see this? I'm like, no, don't have it. And so, like, my conversation ends because they're like, oh, well, you don't know. You're not Yeah. You're not part of this. Right. You don't know anything about it. So, like, I can't rant to you about it or I can't freak out and be excited about this thing because you don't even have this much information about it. So then, like Which is a new problem. Right? About Like it, but I got nothing. Because you're so recorded and so and like anybody can create content.

So it turns out that, like, you have the opportunity to miss out on everything where, like, Dan and I's generations were like, this I mean, I didn't expect to know what anyone was doing if I did not run into them today. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'd have no expectation that I knew anybody went to a concert, had mashed potatoes for dinner, or got a dog. Unless they called me on the landline or I ran into them somewhere, I wouldn't even be like, I can't believe you didn't tell me this. I would be like, oh, you got a dog. Great. You know, like, I didn't expect to know any of those things. But, like, you've grown up expecting to know way more than you actually have the capacity to handle or to do anything about. Like, even if you interacted with your Instagram stories with 300 people, you can't hold 300 people's lives like that. You have like, there's just way too much stuff going on, you know? So instead of getting information as it happened or as it floated to the top or what was important is the stuff you got when you met them at the store or something, now you just get all of it all the time and you are like, I shouldn't know this much about everybody. It's ridiculous. And then you come to feel like it's owed to you. And then if you missed it, now you're you're the odd person out. You don't know you don't know what happened to to Brian the other day, dude. He put it on his story, and you're like, okay. What happened to him? Oh, he was riding his skateboard, you're like, that was it? That was worth me knowing him out? I was like, I don't even care. It feels like like it's a giant game of, like, where's Waldo? Like, you're you're constantly looking for, like, what am I gonna find here? What am I gonna find here? Oh. And even when you get there, you're like, okay. Why? And you just keep digging and you keep digging. Like if I saw on someone's story, I don't know, if they were in a relationship and they it was a breakup song, then I'm like, what happened? And like, we just we just keep

Blue just keep digging and digging and digging and we that's why I feel like we also have such a big problem with gossiping. Like we just keep digging and we just keep going and we just keep trying to find it because we we have a need to want to know everything. Like, we we want to know this but at the same time, we also are lazy. It's If you don't find it, you're gonna keep refreshing until you find something. Yeah. Man. Like, re downloaded Snapchat for one day, and I was like, there's no stories popping up. Yeah. Because nobody has something to say. Because you're not following anybody or you're not on a private story that, like, people care to put you on. Yeah. So, like, yeah. And you haven't been on insta or you haven't been on Snapchat for four months. So, yeah, don't you have anything happening because nobody wants to talk to you because you've been talking to them. Sometimes I feel bad about that if I delete Snapchat or I delete social media, and somebody's like, do you see what I posted? I'm like, no. Deleted I deleted Instagram. And they're like, you always do that. And I'm like, I'm so sorry. Yeah. Goes back to people who think they're like, oh, you judging me now because I'm still on it? Yeah. That's that's happened before. Like, I've gotten off specific

online, like, stuff. I've gotten off of Instagram. I've gotten off of Snapchat before. And everybody's like, here she goes again. She's doing her fast or whatever. And I'm like, I'm not trying to intentionally miss out on your stuff. I just know it's taking over my life. And when I tell them that, they're like, so you think that it's gonna take over mine? I'm like, I never said that. Why did I say that? I think I'm understanding why it's such a struggle. It's a simpler equation in my mind, but it's unfair. It's because there's a lot more involved in it. But I mean, at the end of the day, it's not that you can't realize what

the damage it's doing, like the troubles it's causing you. It's not like it's lost on you, but you're like, what I have to trade is a bunch of people questioning whether I'm even their friends now. You know what I'm saying? But it's actually the same problem that we present with when we are trying to talk to somebody about Jesus. They instantly feel judged and they are like, You want me to be more like you. I'm like, I'm not saying that, but I'm telling you this is the root that has brought me joy and peace and so I'm going stick with it. But they don't take it in that way. And you can't control how people take it in. And as far as Snapchat or Instagram goes or something, you are basically like, I mean it's not like I'm agreeing to not follow Jesus because of this. I'm just agreeing to be on a social media platform so everyone's not mad at me all the time. I can make that trade. And then it turns out that trade is actually to your deficit. You figure it out in six months. You're like, you're out of here. Everyone gives you enough crap that you're like, alright, I'll get back on a little bit. And then you're back in. See, this is what I mean. Like, when I say that we just have to keep picking. Like, if I tell someone that I'm off of Instagram, they're like, well, why? And they keep digging. And eventually, like with the smoke and mirrors, everybody's trying to play you. So maybe you're like, well, are they thinking I should do that? Like, are they thinking they're better than me? Like, am I less than? Like, that's how a lot of my conversations have gone when I explain I'm off Snapchat. Why? It's giving me

unrealistic ideas about what life could be like when this is a highlight reel and not an actual what happens in their everyday lives. And they're like, Oh, so you think I should do that? I'm like, You can. I suggest you do if you are getting too crowded in your own head because I know that happens to me, but they assume that I'm trying to be the bigger person. I'm trying to be better. Which is frowned upon. Which is frowned upon. Yeah. You wanna be the better. Nobody everybody hates the guy that thinks they're better than everybody, which is sometimes rifle. Yeah. You don't you don't want somebody coming in here being like, oh, yeah. You use that kind of headphones. Well, I stopped using headphones like the the purpose of that. Okay. But that's the first example I thought of. I'm sorry. Not fair. Like, it just gets so judgmental and I've struggled with getting off social media because I don't want to go through the whole conversation again of why'd you get off or do you think you're better? What are you going to do now? And I'm just like I'm going to sit. I'm going to sit here in the quiet and I'm going to not think about are they going to judge me for the real I've liked? Are they going to look back at what I've done? Are they going to look at my profile picture? Are they going to judge Like all of that mess comes from social media and you get so pressured to be on it always because you always want to like you always have to know what's going on. Okay. So, I have a question and then we're going to wrap up this conversation, do some advice but is it it does it feel like in your estimation, the only other option is to be lonely because no one's going to join you in this.

No. Layla says, no. I mean Just no? Like yo. Yeah. Layla. I don't know. I like, purse Does anything that Ella just said ring true to you? No. No. Okay. Oh. You don't have Instagram. You don't have Snapchat. A year old. She she doesn't. You think you're better than Ella? No. She but she doesn't have Instagram. She doesn't have Snapchat. You're homeschooled. Which is not being judgmental. Does make a We talked about Simeon talked about earlier how the community that you are placed in is because it is a community your parents decided which is going to be probably a good community unless your parents aren't great but I mean like she doesn't okay I'm sorry I'm sorry take it back. Roll it back. Run it back. Run it back. Just like it just

yeah. I get it. Like everything you're saying makes sense to me. So like I I think the question is was what I'm trying to round out in my head is is are do you feel you're in an impossible situation? Because obviously, I'm not a big Instagram Snapchat guy. So I go, well, it sounds like you just need less friends then. These people are high maintenance and hard to get along with. Like we should dump some of these people. But like if if it's literally everybody except for Layla. You know what I'm saying? If if. I didn't mean that. No, no, no. Not in a bad way. I'm basically saying that like if you get off social media and you have 15 friends that are like, Well, Ella thinks she's better than us and she's not on the social media no more. And so we're just gonna leave her out because we communicate through Snapchat and Instagram and we don't text people because that's stupid. And so you're just out. Basically, you don't join them where they're at, then you're basically not friends anymore. I think that there are people more like, I think that sorry. I think that there are people that are, like, realizing

how much social media has a hold on, like, our generation so much though that they are backing up. And so, like, I do think that you're going to find somebody that, like, even if they're not off of all of it, they're off of something. Yeah. Or they're like, they at least, like, are putting, like, they're having, they're like, Yeah, I gave my friend a password and so like I have time limits on it and I don't know how to get like I don't know how to skip it. Yeah. Like my friend has the password so I can't get into it. I can spend thirty minutes on it and that's it. Yeah. Type of thing. It's like a self protection. Yes. People are starting to put like realizing how terrible it is. Even like for our own like our like attention spans, like people are realizing how terrible it is. Yeah. Like you can just like put it in two times speed so you can get through it faster because you don't have enough attention span for it. Wow. And like I hate that two times speed. It ruins your attention span just because you're like, get to the point. Right. And so like I think that people are realizing that more. Again, like, especially in our generation, we are very much, like, skeptical of everything that we're figuring that out. And so, like, whether or not you're off of it, you're backing up from a lot of it. So, like, even if you she's having people who are judging her for it, you're gonna probably find somebody that's gonna go, okay, I'm not gonna do that, but I understand why you're doing it. I can meet you where you're at. I feel like you're bound to find somebody. So so it's it's probably a maturity as folks look at because like it is a shiny thing and it is pretty. I'm also 20 and not 16. That makes a difference too. Right. And like and and and everyone else who's 16 or 17 is all communicating. So, basically, maybe if we could wrap up this conversation. One, if you're a parent or if you're of a generation that is not grown up with this, like, have a little bit of grace for the for the the struggle that they're trying to get through here. It's not as simple as they're just addicted to their phones. It is the way that their entire

friend group and community communicates mostly. And so you're not just asking them to stop spending time on their phones like from their ears. You're asking them to get rid of their community. And so now granted, it's a great conversation on whether that community is actually worth a crap or not. I think that's a fair conversation, and they might not be able to have it with their current friend group or their current maturity level. We're going to have grace and patience for people as they basically see the world for how it actually is as they mature. And so just as a parent, just be careful that you're not taking it in as I take this in as a curmudgeon. This is advice for me. I take this in as one broad swath and be like, it sounds like you have pain in the butt friends who don't care about you or the thing that you're trying to accomplish. So you should dump them and text people if it's important. This is my entire advice. It's it's pretty shallow. It's not I'm not saying it's wrong but it is shallow. It's not taking in the empathy or the heart of where it's it's coming from in the first place. Leila is trying to do better at this as well. She's not a fairly empathetic in this area. So bad at it. So bad at it. Okay. Let's get wrapping this up. Alright. You're listening to live from the path, and here we go. Here's our question.

Dear live from the path. After four months of dating, I asked my boyfriend if we could move in together to save on rent. No. No. Yeah. No. He was absolutely against the idea. Where's the ring? We have now been dating for ten months, and he recently got a letter stating that he's about to be evicted because he hasn't paid rent for three months. Now that he is about to lose his place, he says that because it's been ten months of us dating, he should move in. Okay. What? No. No. No. No. No. Everybody know. I have asked him for months to get a second job. He has a job that's based on commission only. So there are times when he doesn't get paid unless he sells something. I have the same job, but also work another one. He only recently applied to get another job, but he hasn't completed the requirements to fulfill the opening. Do you think he is I don't know what all that explanation was about. Do you think he is asking me to move in because he thinks I'll pay the bills? Also, his mom is living with him because she has memory problems. What should I do? This feels like a situation where I want to help, but I don't want to be in a ruckus in the end. I'm so You'd

be enabling him in a You think? I I think so. Because, like What's the red flags, Big Simmy? Hear me out. So first off, he said it was a no go at four months. Right? Four months. And now he's in the pits. You know? Yeah. He's going through some trouble, and he's like, yeah. You know? You got a stable second job. You know what I'm saying? Why don't you come in here and help me out a little bit? That just feels kinda crappy. You know? Yeah. I feel like he's being a little bit of a hypocrite because he's only trying to get her in now that he has what he wants. Yes. Or that he can have what he wants because right now he doesn't have it. This guy's just a red flag of, like, all sorts. Everything. Don't like him. That's it? You don't like the guy?

Okay. Let I'm I'm he's using you. Like, he he's literally just like, he was against the idea, and, obviously, like, that was a good idea to be against. Like Yeah. A thousand month move in, not a good idea. Yeah. No. Also, just because it's only been four months. Do you really know your person, your boyfriend by four months? Do you really know like, are you ready for that? You're probably not. But just now that he's in the pits and now that he's like, oh, no. Save me. I've loved you the whole time. Running her. Feels like a Disney villain. Feels like, no. Please spare me and you're like, you killed like 80 people, dude. What do you want? Killed 80 people a little bit. That took a turn. Just an example I thought of it doesn't necessarily mean now but he's he's using you. Yeah. He wants you because you have stability. The thing that he doesn't have anymore. It's

yeah. Yeah. So the question is coming from the gal. What's your advice to the gal? Do not move in with him. If he wants the stability back, then he has to work for the stability that he once had. If he knows what it felt like and he knew what it took to be making an honest living and to be fully paying for things, why not do it again? If you're struggling to find a job, that's a different thing. But if you're not trying for another job Mhmm. This is a you thing. Yeah. Yeah. Like, he again, like, it's the job market is, like, people do a lot of the times, they're like, we need work, but then there's other things that they're like,

even, like, when I think about, like, applying for grad school, the amount of things that they want, it's like, well, then how am I ever gonna get in? You know what I mean? So, like, that type of thing. But, like, if he's just not finishing these last two steps, that's a him thing, not a job market thing. Yeah. Like Yeah. Yeah. Dan He sounds like a coward a little bit. Yeah. He does. What's your what's your red flags, Dan? Alright. Number one, they need to determine if this is a long term relationship or not. If it is, they need to make some adjustments. My girlfriend and I moved in together at eleven months. Of course, we had a wedding about six hours earlier, so that was okay. And that's what they need to do. If this is gonna be something permanent, just get married, get her done.

Because now it's been ten months. Right? Yeah. Right. Yeah. So we planned our wedding in July, and we're married in August, and we had a really great wedding. So it's get her done. Get get married. And if that's not by now, by now, you're this long in and and you're like, I don't know. It's probably not the guy. Yeah. So go ahead and go different directions, and then you can get out of this. Yeah. I'm gonna agree with that. It doesn't take forever to figure out. Hey. Either I can hang out with you or I can't. You know? Yeah. Also, it feel it feels kinda selfish, doesn't it? Like, asking someone to take on you plus your mom. Like, plus another person. Wild card Exactly. Like, that's It was like an afterthought. Yeah. I got my dementia Really? Mom here here and Really? Healthcare. Have health care. But, like, it's just it's another thing to add. And, like Yeah. Sorry. No. You're good. But it's, like, just like, asking someone, here, take care of this animal for me. Oh, also,

brother's here too. I'm moving with the animal. Exactly. Like it just well, I'm not comparing his mom to an animal, but I'm just saying like asking someone to take on you plus another person with healthcare needs, with more things Yeah, is this a a house or an apartment? It's so much more responsibility. Is it the basement or is it just Yeah. Right there in the living room? And on his side of that too, saying, Yes, and I have my mother, if he's only working at commissions point

of job, like, he probably doesn't have the money to send his mom to a, like, long term care facility or something. Yeah. But least get her a job at Walmart. She doesn't have to remember. Right. Just just say, here you go. Here's your card. Yeah. Like, I don't know. I just mean, like, I do understand where he's coming from with that point of it. Like yes my mother is living with me. Yeah. But like in the fact of like then also take me too. Like sounds like you gotta get another job to be helping your mother out first. Yeah. O overall and and maybe this is just a a response to the ladies. Look, you're gonna find a man who's gonna bring a little bit of mess with him. That's all men are that are gonna be that. But a man that shows up and said, I'm gonna make a promise to be with you through a lifetime despite our messes. Right? This is the man you're after. Right? Do not give men things for free

that should come on the other end of a promise. That includes your home. That includes yourself. That includes your affections, your intentions, your future plans. Until this man And your mom. And your mom. Oh, boy. Woah. Until this man is committed to you that says, I am not out looking for better opportunities. I am not just trying this out. When the man says, I want to spend my life with you. Right now we are poor. We are gonna share the bills. I'm gonna get a second job. This commission job is too chaotic

to support our family. And so I'm going to get a job that pays less, but that is guaranteed. Let's adjust our budget to make it. And and but no matter what, I will continue to work for both you and the household that we are building together. Anything short of that, you're out. I'm not just saying should you not let him move in. I'm saying you should break up with him. This is not the caliber of man that we're after. I hate saying this. Because if you want this to succeed at all, it has to have Jesus in the middle of it. But you can take even the Jesus part out of it if you want to and be like, Listen, we don't

allow men to show up with no adding to your life and doing nothing but taking. And then we go, Oh, we'll just wait till he matures. That is not the men we date at all. That is a recipe for heartbreak and disaster. And you will hold on way longer than he will. He will leave at the at the best possible opportunity for him because he is a selfish coward. And so, like, the answers just break up with him. I'm also just saying McDonald's pays $15 an hour. $17 an hour. If you can't go drop McDonald's, I don't know what to tell you at that point. I'm sorry. Yeah. Give me a night job. Yep. You don't have to sell fries by the pound. You just sell whoever wants it. They'll give you a seven pound. They used to sell fries in buckets. Yeah. Hades. I'm telling you. Best days ever. Everything was everything was 90¢. They were still using beef to make it, so they'd sell you a whole bucket of them. Cardiologists love that. Alright. Segular says, you have known this man for only ten months. That is moving in with you would also involve his mother who has a memory problems creates an additional complication besides the fact that his income is so irregular, he can't afford to pay his rent. What if his mother's problems worsen? Who will care for her while he's working? Will he be able to find a job for which he is qualified to supplement his income? You are generous and caring, but if you do what he is asking, your relationship will become increasingly complicated, and a ruckus would be the least of your worries. He needs to solve his own problems without involving you. If he gets a stable

job, like solid nine to five, and then say you work from home and his mom is just home, what are you supposed to do at that point? Like, What if I mean, what if Kathleen burns the pizza? And you're like, it's okay, Kathleen. Go sit down. And she's like, I forgot it was in there. You're like, how am I supposed to take care of you? I don't know what to do. You send her to a home. Wow. She's literally Those are exactly where where your parents are going. Now now the flip flip side here that we we're being kinda rough on this guy. He did say no

four months in, and he is caring for his mom, and he could have sent her to a home. It sounds like he couldn't send her to a home. He doesn't make any money. Well, that's what they have government stuff for that. I mean, I'm seriously. I mean, that's True. Yeah. The whatever that is. Medicaid, whatever it is would would take care of it. It's out of desperation he's making a poor choice is what I'd say. So I don't know if he's a real jerk, but he's gotten weak because he's desperate. Yeah. I guess I saw his four month no move in was this isn't convenient for me right now. That could be. Like, I don't know if I'm gonna you know, this will be I don't know if I'm gonna move in. I'm also seeing it that way. Like, he's serving himself instead of serving others. I did paint him in the worst possible light, though. That's a 100% true. He was an a moral upright gentleman saying, oh, no. No, ma'am. I cannot This is improper. See, this this is what I mean. We keep digging, and we keep looking at things, we keep analyzing. Nice job, Dan. Okay. Last one. Dear from the past. We

have some dear friends with whom we socialize a lot. However, it seems it seems that every time we invite them to do something, they invite others whom we know to join in. Our latest invitation is to visit us at our lake house for several days. They would like to bring their adult son and his girlfriend. While we like their son a lot, we don't know the girlfriend. We don't wanna hurt their feelings or our friendship, but we are getting tired of our invitations being extended to others. How do we respond to them to stop this? I feel like I can't answer this because I have a bias pain. There is nothing I hate more than when you invite someone specific. Like, if you're trying to tell them something personal and they're like, oh, you don't you don't care that Bob's here too. Right? You're like, no. Yeah. I guess not. It's fine. Like, I just, I hate when people do that because you could be, they don't know what you're going to tell em like if if that's the case like. Yeah. Could be telling them something super private and super personal and they're the only person that you trust with that and they're like, Todd came too. Why is Todd here? I invited you. I think I do this. I think I think it matters. Sorry. Go ahead. No. You go ahead. You were talking first. Like, I think the circumstance matters. Like, again, are they mean, I it sounds like they're not. But, like, are they saying ahead of time, like, hey, by the way, can so and so come to? Yeah. Like, that doesn't seem like the case. And then also circumstance matters of, are you going to a baseball game? And, like, they bought their own ticket? Or, like, yeah, you're going to their house, like, this this adult son and a girlfriend you don't know is gonna come live in, like, live

in your house for, like, week in drink all the milk. Well, I just mean, like, you don't, like, you don't know them. That is weird to have them just show up at your house. Yeah. Like, that's different than just being like, yeah, we're gonna go hang out at my son's baseball game. And, like, they're just gonna sit in the, like, bleachers and not pay any attention. Like, who cares? But, like, yeah, it's different because it's, like, they're at your house. Yeah. Like a community type activity. Yes. Usually, it's okay to have a community there. Yeah. Yeah. And I do think that this has a really simple solution of literally just having a conversation with them. I don't feel like this is a friendship ending ordeal. Like, I feel like if you do what? It shouldn't be anyway. Yeah. I think if you just have a conversation with them and just bring it up and be like, hey. Don't you think you're already starting out with someone unreasonable who keeps inviting

ex people anyway. If this was, like, a multiple time ordeal, then it is likely time to have a like, if they're extending it to the lake house. I don't know. Maybe your lake house is, like, super, like, I don't know, emotional attachment property. Like, there are some there are just boundaries that sometimes you just cannot cross. That's hard to explain. You can come back to my emotional attachment property. I don't know. Maybe the fire hydrant is my best friend. You know. And then he brings along his other fire hydrant friend. Okay. I'm gonna give you an example of where I think that I've screwed this up. Alright. And and then we'll we'll we'll see where you're at. So like I have done this with with inviting

someone to like have coffee with me. And then I run into somebody else or I start having a conversation with someone else just before the coffee shows up. I'm like, I don't know, that other person's pretty cool. Why don't we all go? And what I didn't do is tell anybody or maybe they had front loaded that we were going to talk about some stuff that maybe wasn't going to be public knowledge for everybody. And I just thought, hey, this should be fine. And so maybe I could see how people could do this with the best of intentions and have misunderstood what was the

purpose. Do you know what I'm saying? Like sometimes you invite people just because you're going to the baseball game and you're like, but more the merry. You're paying your own ticket and you're buying your own hot dog. I don't a Come sit by us, you know? But if it's like, hey, do we wanna have like a a a double date with two couples and someone's like, hey, I'm bringing my my my buddy Ralph. You're like, okay. That's a fifth wheel right there. I mean, seriously, who's gonna sit by Ralph? What's Ralph gonna do with the movie? Like, is he gonna sit in by me and now I don't sit by my wife? This is weird. You know? Oh my gosh. Like, could it's just it's there's a little bit of a selfishness to it, I guess. And I'm not saying selfish in, like, a real bad way, but you didn't spend any time thinking a little bit past yourself to go, I don't know. Maybe I shouldn't have invited those folks. You know what I'm saying? It sounded like a good idea. This person, you don't know what they're going through. They're having a real tough time. They could stand to be around good people like us, but good people like us need to have a conversation too, you know, and not maybe always be on the hook for helping someone else out, you know? Yeah, I feel like there's a there's a good time for that. There's going to be a good time for that but if you don't ask the person like, we'll go with your coffee example. If you don't ask the person and they were gonna tell some private Yeah. Stuff then you're like, well, I don't I don't necessarily feel comfortable with them there. But again, it's different with the boundary thing. If that person is also a super close friend, Yeah. Maybe but it's still important to ask the person and be like, hey, is this okay? Like, can they join us today? You're like, I mean, I don't know. Like, it's just a question. It's just simple question like, is it okay? No. Let it out. Of the bag that like, oh, we were going to talk about something important and you're like, oh, what was it? You're like, I, we were going to do this tomorrow. I'm trying to gear myself up for this conversation we need to have. You know I'm saying? So, now you've kind of ruined the whole thing. I could see how it could be awkward and now, we're in a bit of a pickle. It's but but the worst outcome though, honestly, is just awkwardness And so either you swim in it or you get through it. And so, like, you'd be like, hey. Listen. I actually had some stuff I wanted to be talking about. Could could we find another time where maybe we can just meet up or something? You know what I'm saying? Like, offer up an alternative and you know, to find a a way to do it. But it I think there is it's easy to get in this situation and it is awkward to wade out of it but if the worst outcome is just awkwardness and not a friendship breaking or the whole thing blowing up, then, you should probably just do the awkward thing. Yeah. And go like, you're not break, no. This is just a couple's weekend. You're not bringing those folks. Yeah. I was gonna say, I mean, like,

shoot. When my when my breakup? Oh, if, I mean, I feel like most people are pretty reasonable. If you're like, hey, no. Can't come. Sorry. But if they keep going like, well, why can't I join? You're like, you don't owe them that. Like, if it's the other persons, you don't owe them that. Yeah. So, you're just going to have to go, sorry, it's not the right day. Next week though. The self invite, that is awkward too. It's really wild. Yeah. At that level of the thing, we're coming to come to your house and sleep. Dude, yeah, that's a that's a like, not in the bad connotation, but that's an intimate time. You know, people are, like, sleeping at your place, eating your food. You know what I'm saying? And like, that's not an everybody activity. These are people I know. Again, with the boundaries. Boundaries. And some people you're fine with coming over and then here comes Jared and he eats all your food and he Because takes all the good people are unpredictable.

The the folks that I would invite to, like, come stay at our lake house or something, I'd be like, I know full well that they, like, sleep fully clothed, and they're not gonna get drunk. I'm sorry. You think someone's gonna show up buck naked? Dude, people are wild. We don't own a lake house. How would you know? Okay. We don't have a lake house. But, like, like, the people that you're inviting, I can't vouch for them. I don't know them. And now they're, like, at my place, and, like, I don't know that they don't drink too much at 11:30 and start yelling, or they don't get in a fight with their spouse in public places. And I'm like, oh, here we go. You know I'm saying? Like, the people I invite to my to my home, I'm like, you won't be doing any of this. That's why you're invited to the house. I don't want my peace disrupted at this place. I want to add to my community. But these two jokers, I can't vouch for these people. I don't want them here. You know I'm saying? I think that's fair to say. Okay. Final advice was so the question was, how do we respond to them to stop this? So what was our advice? How do we tell them to quit it? Just have the conversation. Just tell them, no. I'm sorry. You cannot bring your son's girlfriend who we have no idea. Maybe she sleeps fuck naked. Well, nobody wants to be uncomfortable by that. That's what I'm saying. We don't want trouble. What if they have a pet coyote? You think they're gonna bring the pet coyote? I mean, I'm telling you. A quarter of the coyote. If they go somewhere. Yeah. What if they have a mom with memory issues? Then they just leave her out in the middle. Not again. Mom.

But they come in and never leave. That's the thing. What if they just they're like, oh. Yeah. Oh, they're they're sleazes? I wasn't aware. We were gonna leave at noon and they're like, oh, we just get up at 11:30. We're not quite up and around yet. You're like, come on, man. We got the I dogs people who do that. This is the worst. No. There there are dogs and the coyote. Oh, no. Okay. It's lost. Secular says, it's best if you have that conversation as soon as possible. Otherwise, you will have people living in your house all the time. Oh. I mean, if you don't put any barriers up, then the army's gonna march right in. All the time? That's a little Why do you think they're just gonna become people who live there now? Are we is that what we're called for? Squatters? Yeah. That's what we're saying. Squatters? Squatters? I

don't know. I feel like that's a little aggressive, but This place is pretty comfy. I don't think we'll leave. My coyote fell asleep on the couch. Can't take it out now. You have been listening to Live From The Path on livefromthepath.org. We do have a legit website which I've heard doesn't get a whole lot of action. So, anyway, check us out on the podcast on the on the YouTube, the Spotify,

the Amazon Music, and Apple Podcast is always a great place. But I'd like to thank you very much for coming on the show. Everybody, thanks for coming in. It was lovely to have you, and we'll make sure that the seats are always open. So if ever feel like you wanna stop in Live From The Path, feel like you got a free ride out here. You can ride in with Old Mike. I did start the I'm I'm stalling for time. I started the background tunes. I'm not exactly sure how to get them in here. And so here's what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna say, be faithful to the means, and God will handle the ends. You've been listening to Live From The Path. So did we need to do acapella or no?