Live from the Pathway Studios in Johnston proper, you are Live from the Path. And you're listening to Live from the Path. My name is Ben Foost. Hey, man. My name is not Ben. My name could be. You know, we got all kinds of problems. Hey. Boy, that sounds like junk. You guys catch that? Okay. I'm glad nobody else heard it. All right. Hey, you're listening to Live from the Path. My name is Ben Foost. It is a hopping Monday here in the studio. Uh-oh. Oh, Zach Alkins is upside down. There you go. All right. Hey, it's good to see you guys. We got a, I don't know, we got a heck of a show. It's hard to improve upon the guests that we had last week. Jesse Anderson and Jordan Anderson popped in, and that was pretty exciting. And they didn't, yeah, that was a lot of fun.

I missed it. I'm not a good guest. Well, you're definitely no, you're no Jesse and Jordan Anderson. That's for certain. That's true. But I, you know, so I listened to the show, right? So I hounded Ben so I could hear this show, because I really wanted to be here, and I couldn't make it, and so I listened back to the podcast. It was about an hour long. Wait, wait, wait. I think you chose, like, spaghetti or something, rather than, when you say I couldn't make it, you're kind of frictionless. Well, I was going out of town, and I thought it would be best to spend time with my wife. Oh, but you didn't. You went and did something else. No, I didn't. I believe you called me from some sort of Bible study. Well, I was, my Bible, normal Bible studies on Mondays. Oh. Just because we eat there doesn't mean that it's a terrible Bible study. Oh, no. So you didn't skip that to spend time with your family, but you didn't make it into live in the bath. My family and I went to the Bible study. We Bible study as a family. I'm on Mike's side.

Yeah. Seriously. So, anyway, about five minutes into this podcast, so Amanda, Ben's wife, happened to sit in for the week, you know, in my place. And Ben goes, well, Mike couldn't make it, blah, blah, blah. Here's my lovely wife, Amanda. And the Andersons say, well, she's a lot easier to look at than Mike anyway. Unbelievable. You know, I turned my back for five minutes. All of a sudden, I'm some kind of ugly goblin just because I can't make it in. I kicked her in the chin up at the table. Man. I mean, I reverse, I'm with them on that one. Just because it's the truth doesn't mean it has to be, you know, said. Zach is cheering back and forth. I was with you. We'll call you, sir, calling you Romney. Yeah. Sorry. Romney. All right. I already crossed the line. The whistling, sorry, Chad. The whistling was on the video. That was from Andy and Kelly. They were opening for John Waller at a show in Indianola.

And those same folks are putting on the Newsboys show that's coming up in March. And we'll be broadcasting live from that. So that'll be exciting. Hopefully we can get Andy and Kelly in here because he is one heck of a whistler. Yeah. Coming up on the show tonight. So I know we've got a lot of little things that we could hit. I want to talk a little bit about just a discussion we were having before the show fired up is about what is a Sabbath? What does it mean to Sabbath? Why did God set it up? And what are we supposed to be doing there? I'm talked out. What do I do if my job stinks? Or why does my job stink? I think Mike might have something. Yeah, maybe. He's got some stuff. I thought that was on me. And the question for you is, is there such things too much good biblical advice? I'm going to say the answer is yes, and I'll tell you why. And it's not so much. Yeah, no. That's what I'm saying. I'm going to say yes. There is such thing as too much biblical advice coming from other folks.

And I'll tell you why. Also, we're going to do some Dear Life from the Path and talk about a pastor's bed in. Dan, have you read about this? I have not. Okay, so I'll give these to you. This is from CNN. It said, a pastor encouraging his congregation to have sex. It may sound unlikely, but it's what one prominent Texas pastor is doing this weekend with a 24-hour rooftop bed in with his wife. I think I do that regularly, but I don't call it anything. Not on a rooftop? I was going to say, you do encourage that. I do encourage that. All too often. And it's working. Have you seen the nursery? That's true. Hey, we're about to have our third kid in six weeks. See? Something like that. You've had three kids in six weeks? Thank you. The Lord. Sweet Moses, man. The Lord will do what he wants to do at the Howe Castle. We mean be fruitful.

Abundance. So anyway, here's the deal. To encourage members of his congregation and others to take part in what he calls a sexperiment, Dallas Pastor Eddie Young and his wife, Lisa, began staging a bed in on Friday morning, laying in a bed on the roof of their Texas church for 24 hours. They say they want to illustrate that sex begins in heaven. Here's his quote. It's time to put the bed back in church and God back in the bed because God is the one that thought sex up, says Eddie Young, senior pastor of fellowship church. That's great. And his wife's okay with this. She's there. Okay, come on. Let's go up on the roof. Okay, so here we go. While in bed, the Youngs plan to have bedside interviews via Skype with various pastors and friends to discuss tantalizing truths about sex as God intended, according to their website. God says that we are to make love within the beauty and the covenant of marriage, says the pastor. And on Skype, while they're involved. Let's see. Okay, all right. So I'll finish up. Here we go. This is another quote from him. When you have the freedom and the joy and a mutually satisfying sexual relationship, when you see it from God's perspective, I think the lights come on and you discover your destiny as husband and wife. No curtains will be needed for this weekend's bed-in. The Youngs say it's just to make a statement. Mike, agree on premise? I mean, he's right.

I mean, he's right. He's biblically correct. His actions, I don't know, necessarily back up or betray biblical truth. It just seems like a stunt. But, I mean, biblically, he's right. I mean, God loves sex. He made it for our enjoyment. It was a blessing for us under a marital union. You know, if you're shying away from that as a married couple, then, yeah, you know, you need to give back to Jesus on that. He gave you a blessing. Take it and run. I don't know if having a bed-in on the church is necessary. Dan, as a pastor, what are your thoughts on this shepherd of his church in his particular choice? It's obviously a gimmick. We're talking about it in Iowa, you know, so it's, I guess it's worked that way. I don't, we talk about it, too. You know, like I said, we encourage it. We tell people, go, you know, participate if you're married. That's how God intended it. But life is so much bigger than that. It's, I mean, marriage is so much bigger than that. But it's one small piece of it, I don't know if that helps create a healthy picture that God intended. I don't think he meant it to be an exhibition thing, like, hey, everybody get up on the roof and, you know, let's celebrate it. I think it just happens. You know, even in Scripture, it happened a lot, but they didn't like, all right, everybody, come on, sex day.

I mean, it's just part of life and part of marriage, and you do it. No, no. It creeps me out. I'm not sure what he's getting at. You know, I agree with, like, the last sentence that you, one of the last sentences that you read about, you know, what he described it to be. But, you know, are you trying to teach the children or the teenagers not to have sex? Are you teaching married people to have holy sex? I mean, I don't really get what angle he's. I'm not, yeah, I don't know, to me, it's the same, it's of the same vein as the protesting side. Like, I just, I don't understand, like, some guy's going to hear the story and go, you know what? I should be having sex with my wife. I hadn't thought of that one. Yeah. Or a guy who, you know, well, but obviously he's willing to get up on the roof in a bed with his wife. Yes. So, I mean, this completely changes everything. That's what I don't know. Who's his audience? Or is it talking to the nonbelievers? See, we're cool. We have sex. Or it's like, well, of course we do. Look, there's children in the nursery. I mean, you know, it's happening. Yeah, we already have proof of that.

We don't, we don't, we don't have proof. I don't know. It, it, it, it's weird. It's just creepy. It's just weird, man. It's weird. It's a stunt to get publicity and, you know, it's, it's about the, it's, it's about the same anytime you try to, and any try to, anytime you try to conceptualize something that God has provided in, like, a media attention grabbing way, it never turns out well. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Like, it always turns out cheesy. Like, you're cheapening the gospel for your specific purpose. It's like, if your big thing is that you think married couples who are married, uh, under, under, and, and, and love Jesus should be having more sex, great. Hold a seminar. Don't hold a bed in on top of the, on top of the, you know, write a book. See people buy the book. Why didn't they do, you know, hey, God says we should eat. We're going to have buffet on the roof. Yeah. You know, everybody's just, it's, it's, it's kind of a grandstanding thing. It's, it's what he's doing. It's, it's, uh, it's just, it's just odd. It's not like it's, I don't know.

It's not like it's terrible or it's just weird. It's a weird move. There's better ways. Why don't you worry more about people's relationship with Jesus than necessarily what's going on in their bedroom? And then if they want further counseling on that issue, it's an open topic. It's seriously not as stuffed shirt and terrible as everyone makes it out to be. But I don't know if you lead with that, you lead with Jesus and then let, uh, you know, let the, the, the sex and the, and the good marriage and the great kids and the blessings and the, and the strife and the tithe and whatever, all those other stuff that come after Jesus, let them come after Jesus. Just let Jesus come first. Well, Dan, I'm sure you agree, you know, as a pastor that, you know, you've got to also think before you, you do something of that nature, you've got to think of like the kind of repercussions or what, what, how's this going to play out to whether it be the media or the, what would happen if, if Dan would have said, actually, I disagree with you as a pastor. That'd have been really weird that you set it up as Dan, you have to agree with what I've just said. And then Dan would go, I do not, you know, actually, I don't agree with that one bit. You're out of here. Well, if you think about it, think of all the, some of the more, um, persistent, um, sin issues that exist. Uh, people seem to be okay getting together sexually. You don't say it seems to be happening.

It seems to be going on in the church, outside of the church, people seem to not need all that much guidance. It's doing it in a, you know, falling under everything else. Like, I think if you are a person that is following Christ in a healthy way, uh, and you're seeking to love your spouse in the way that, that God has told you to love your spouse. I think that thing just kind of works itself out. Yeah. It's not like you're holding back, you know? Well, that's what I, it confuses me because it seems like the message more so is to teach people what biblical sex or, you know, marriage is to God. Uh, so it seems like more of a message to unmarried people. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, like when you should be in the bed and when you shouldn't type of thing. Uh, yeah. And if you're married, it should be all the time. Anytime you got some free time, kids are sleeping or whatever. I don't know. There's plenty of time to do it. Just do it biblical. I mean, seriously. Uh, and so, and it was the last, uh, one of the other quotes that was in there from him. Uh, I, this seems bad.

He says the pastor believes that sex is the super glue in a Christian marriage. Now here's the deal with super glue. Super glue can hold things together that don't belong together. Can it not? Like if you just said it's, it's the, um, it's the missing piece of the puzzle. Cause the puzzle implied a puzzle goes together. Uh, and if you were missing it, it can't come together. It's not a complete puzzle. Yeah. Okay. I get that part, but the super glue seems like a dangerous analogy. Cause I mean, you could super glue a shoe to a refrigerator and it would stay there and it does not belong. What a beautiful marriage. I would rather say that the, that like the Holy spirit is the super glue that keeps together or, or commitment or trust or, you know, right. A Christ centered marriage or exactly. You know, as long as you're having sex is a gift that the center of our, of our, our, our relationship has, has given us. That's, I don't know. I'm just trying to figure out how marriage counseling goes over here. We're having some struggles. We'll have sex. You're good. 20 bucks.

I think, think of it. Like how the guy, the guy is selling it is basically think of a parade coming by. Right. And the normal parade you like to see is Jesus twirling the baton and leading everybody through the streets. It's, and instead here's, here's the sex float coming right in front and Jesus is in back like throwing Tootsie Rolls at people like, well, I guess if you could talk about me for a little bit, that'd be great. The real show's up there. But, uh, you know. That's the super glue. That's the super glue. I guess I'm just, uh, you know, the savior. I guess, uh, we'll just leave it be. I don't know. I don't know about this thing. I mean, I understand his, his spirit. I mean, I can say we talk about it too and we're open about it and, and, but we just try not, I try not to make it real sensational, you know, um, well, you know, that's what it is. Here's the thing is some people are just prudish about those things. They think that because, you know, sex is bad when it's outside of side of marriage. That means sex is bad is when it's in marriage and that is not the case at all. And you need to be able to distinguish between the two talking about sex, having sex, having an open relationship.

Uh, uh, you know, when it comes to talking with your spouse about sex, these are not bad things. These are not bad things under the guise of a biblical marriage because there's intimacy to be had there. And the intimacy is a gift that God has given you and you're wasting it. If you're not doing these things, you know, but, uh, you know, a lot of people with a more conservative background, you even start to bring up sex. They're like, Oh, great. We're going to talk about sex again. You know, and they don't want to talk about it because it makes them uncomfortable. And if it makes you uncomfortable in, in the, uh, the guise of your marriage, you know, maybe you need to reevaluate why you're at, why you're having such a hard time. Cause maybe there's parts of your marriage that God has given you as a blessing that you're missing out on because you're too busy trying to cover, cover yourself up. You know what I'm saying? I think, you know, it's, it is an awkward topic. Not a whole lot of people like to have frank, open conversations about it, but I'm fairly certain that, uh, if God almighty knows everything that I've ever done is chosen, forgiven me anyway, then I can at least start with a basis of honesty with my own spouse. You know, it doesn't mean you have to get together as a small group and, and trade bedroom secrets or whatever, you know, but you could certainly have an open relationship with your wife or your husband about what you have going on in that bedroom. And I quit acting like it's the worst thing ever. You know, it's a blessing encountered is that it's not like you hide your kids when company comes over.

Oh, the Lord has not blessed us. I don't know where this kid came from. Seriously. We've always hidden our kids. We have Tommy. He's 27. You've never met him. He lives by the vacuum. And that's kind of one of those elementary things. I remember being like, you know, in fifth grade and think they have kids. I know what they did. You still do that, Dan. Dan goes, I have kids. I know what I am. Things are rough. All right. Well, I'm trying to check whether this has happened. Is this going on? We should have, we should have Skyped him in. We probably could have. What a mistake. What's going on right now? He does, you don't, he does have a book. Sexperiment. Seven Days to Lasting Intimacy with Your Spouse.

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. This doesn't sound ultra cheesy now. Yeah, now we know. I've changed my slight descent to a boo, sir. A straight boo. The Youngs encourage readers to have sex with their spouse every day for a week. I'm for it. By doing this, the authors believe married couples will gain a greater sense of purpose for their lives together. I'm not sure that's the automatic outcome after seven days. Or just be tired. You again? You know, I'm really tired of that guy. He's been in here six times already. He's sleeping on the couch this week. I just want to watch John Bachman. Leave me be. Yeah, I'm going to, I suppose if you're trying to find a way to have to, to have to come together and have a healthy conversation about what makes sense for their marriage, forcing seven days of straight sex will do it. Okay, now let me ask you this. Let's say, let's say that was something that he had just set up for his congregation. Like, it was just meant for his congregation and then the media took it, ran with it. Do you see it any different?

Like, if it was just a… He keeps his bed off the roof and he spends time within the context of his congregation making, like, advocating for, to people, to not take God out of something where God created. You know what I'm saying? Like, because I think sometimes it depends on the tone of your church, but there are people who are still in the sex is dirty category, you know, and like, we do it every once in a while because we're supposed to have kids, but beyond that, it's a… Do you think anybody's really there? I think there are some people that are there, but it's a small amount. Like, it's a… I think it's probably whole congregations in very twisted portions of the country. But I would think for the most part, people are… What? Make us disgusted. I won't go to that church. I do. We're part of the country. Especially in Georgia. I think there are sections where… Declining state. Where, like, it was… People were raised that way, and, like, it is taken on a tone which is not appropriate, like, which is not God-consistent when it comes to God is the creator of sex. But within the context of his own church, I don't think this is near as bad.

But when you put a bed on the roof of the church and you interview with CNN, I think you are… You are now… Things start to look foolish. Right? Because everyone else sitting on the outside is going, well, yeah, someone has to tell the dumb Christians to have sex. Right. I mean, seriously. What kind of God do they have? Sure. Everyone wanted to do is, but I've been holding back. I've got to figure it out. And so what do they look like? They say, well, I can't have any part of that. I already know how to… I'm already excited for this deal. If you've got to tell them to do it, these don't sound like people I want to hang around with. Right. People that had no idea this was coming, seriously? Yeah. So, I mean, I think that's where the problem becomes. You do it within the context of the church. I don't think it's near big of a deal.

Yeah. I don't know. A stunt. It is. It's a stunt. I'm against it. All right. I'd probably attend, though. I'd probably hang out in the audience. Would you go check it out? Boo, sir. With like a fake mustache on and a wig. I know what you guys do. Can't fool me. Anyway, that's what's going on in Texas. Boy, that guy looks… His wife's wearing a leopard print shirt. Yeah, you don't see… They look really happy. I got to give you that. You don't see any pastors having a roof in in the middle of winter in Iowa, do you? Only in Texas these things happen. That's the question. Like, how much do you believe in it? Would you do it in the middle of winter in Iowa?

Because, I mean, either God's on his phone or isn't he? That's a challenge. Do you believe in your marriage? Come on. Only when it's 80 degrees outside. How long are they going to be out there? 24 hours. 24 hours. Are they going to have people bring him food and stuff? There's a kid on the phone of Christianity Today covering his bum with his hands. Because there's an editorial about them asking people to reconsider spanking. Or would they want them to reinstitute it? No, the other way around. Christianity Today is advocating for… That it's not necessary. Oh, come on. But we talked about this a little last week. Christianity Today… We don't even have to rehash it. But it's just funny because the picture they have of this kid covering his bum… It's a funny picture. Bumsicle. So, as if he's going to do anything. He's in tighty-whities with a little… You know, I've tried that move before when I was getting spanking.

It doesn't work. It's not super… Especially with the spoon. Now your hand hurts. I mean, as soon as you get the spoon to the knuckles, then you move the hand, and then they got you just where they want you. You should have just taken it like a hand. Then your hand wouldn't hurt. Yeah, at least then your hands would be fully focused. Anyway, hey, you're listening to Life from the Path. Thanks for being with us here tonight. Hey, lots of fun stuff coming up on Life from the Path. Next week, Adam Cates is going to be back in the studio. Oh, wow. So he was in… We had him a few months back, and he was just… Had finished up his album, and they were working on the cover work and stuff and getting it printed. So he's got his album. It's out and ready to go. And he's going to be back in the studio. He's playing a gig over at, I think, Wellspring on next Monday, and then he's going to be in the show on Monday night. Oh, that's cool. Kind of sharing some more stuff from his CD, and we'll kind of direct you to more information

about him and where to pick up his album. He's an excellent singer-songwriter, and his songs have been very well played and enjoyed on the Life from the Path YouTube channel. So that's Adam Cates coming up. And the following week, on the 30th, Jeff Arendale is back in the studio. And he also has just finished up his CD. He did some recording in Nashville, and him and a couple of the dudes are going to come in and kind of lay down some of that stuff so we can check it out and see what's coming up on his new album. I'm excited to hear this. He's released some CDs with the band, and we've had his band in here before. But this is his first solo project and was done in Nashville with some studio musicians. It sounds like it's going to be a pretty cool deal. Did he send you a preview snippet? He said he was going to. So I actually expect to see something relatively soon. Now, and Saved on Sunday will be in this show with them in March? No, they were going to. We were going to have them in March, and they're actually going to be in tour, so they're not going to make it in. I'm very actually excited. I went and saw their… Actually, Ben was there. We went out with the ladies and saw their acoustic album release party. And I tell you what, I was really impressed.

I think it's going to sound like a… Where was that at? It was at the Eagle Vision Church over on the south side, just off the interstate. And it sounds like it's going to be a very cool album. I'm actually really excited. I hope they get it up on iTunes or up on Amazon here, maybe before they get the hard copies out, because I'm very interested to have it as my own. But it was a very good… It was a cool concert. Double J was there. And so Double J was throwing some beats down over the top of some Saved on Sunday tunes. And Syndrome of Fire was there. And old buddy Tim Denner was there. And I talked to him for a little bit. It was a very cool evening. Piercing the Dark… Not Piercing the Dark. Dark Horse. Dark Horse. Was there. And man, they have a… I mean, this dude is a smoking first lead guitar player. I mean, he is fantastic. Especially on an acoustic guitar. You know, that's where it shows your flaws.

You know, that if you don't know how to play… Oh, I know. You know, that's all I play. My flaws are laid bare. But I mean, he's got the fingers of a crazy man. And so it was very, very cool. Very cool. All right. So I think I found the clip that we were talking about earlier, Mike. Let's see. Let's see if everyone can enjoy this. Let's check this out. The early ones. Mike's at home with his family. He's going to go out of town, so he decided to stay home and spend a little time with his family. So my lovely bride is joining us in the studio today. Hello. Hello. A little easier to look at than Mike. Yeah, no kidding. Seriously. Every time I look over, it's like a mirror. A little easier to look at than Mike. I mean, we could…

I mean… That wasn't even subtle. That was just a direct shot. That was just a direct shot. That was right out there, wasn't it? Like, hey, I miss Mike. Or, hey, Mike's pretty cool. Or your wife is… Or, you know… Yeah. Or your wife is lovely. Or not, hey, Mike is ugly like a goblin. I mean, honestly. I've got my problems, but the Lord has blessed me. So, hey, no, but agree. Mike, there's two things to take from that. The first one is, the Andersons remember you. Oh, that's true. That's actually a solid point. And then they did not mourn your ex. They remember you as an ugly man, which is cool. You know, I guess to be remembered is to be remembered. At least he didn't… At least, you know, as long as they know that I love Jesus, I don't care. I can be an ugly man.

I'm cool with that. I think you care a little bit. Yeah, maybe a little bit. Actually, I do care a little bit. It kind of stung, to be honest with you. Unnecessary. Be like somebody super famous, like George Clooney, getting up on TV and goes, I thank you for this award. And I'm going to tell you one thing. Mike Foost looks like the behind of a rabbit animal. Oh, thank you. I mean, there's no need for it. So, hey, you're listening to Life in the Path. That does remind me, we had a really cool time with Jess and Jordan Anderson last week. And I would recommend you go check out the YouTube channel. We've posted a couple songs. These are songs that are not available elsewhere, actually. They have the brand-new CD out, the Not What I Thought is available. But the two songs that they performed for us are not on that CD. They're actually newer than that. So check those out. But they're both very, very good. One is about kind of the story of how they met, which was an interesting story. And you can check the song out there. And the other one is called You Go Before Us.

And it was something that Jordan had written. And I really like it. It was cool. Yeah, and it reminds me, and I said this a little bit on the show, but it reminds me of the imagery of just, like, walking every day, thinking about God walking before you, walking with you, as opposed to, you know, calling on him every once in a while, like he drops down, you know, sends rain and fire every once in a while, and then moves on. But, like, actually having the thought of being led by God, who has his presence in your life every day, it's, I don't know, I really dig on that song. And actually, I'll probably play it for you later on the show, just so you have a chance to hear it when you can talk about it a little bit more. But check that out. That's on the YouTube channel. It's on YouTube.com backslash Live on the Path. And the entire show is available on Blip TV. That's Live on the Path, dot Blip, dot TV. We have made $7 from that Blip TV channel. No kidding. Are we having a pizza party? I'm not going to cash it in until we can afford a whole pizza. But, yes, yeah, we're going to do it. That's a little season.

I'm going to spend $3. You're going to add money to it? What happened to you? What? Why does everyone say that? I shaved my head. Sorry. Because it makes you look totally different. That's why people react that way. What happened? I mean, I'm the same person. That's a poor way to say it. People keep looking at me like, you look like a wrestler. I'm like, why can't I just be me? Actually, that's not what I was thinking, but I do agree. Everyone at my work calls me the big show, and it's driving me nuts. The big show? Yes. Everyone calls me the big show as I walk in. You look like a tender man that would sell cotton candy, but people would think doesn't sell cotton candy. Or the bell ringer. What is it? The Hunchback of Notre Dame. Thank you.

Quasimodo? Is that the one you're talking about? Okay, that seems a little harsh. You're right. He had hair. I got to sit like this. But with cotton candy, though. But with cotton. He had cotton candy. As long as he has cotton candy, that just throws a whole new spectrum. You look kind of like a wounded soul. Like something deep happened to you that you thought, we better lose the hair, but then keep the beard. Nothing, actually. What happened? Need a change. I'm seeing Shrek. You just need the horn things. I need Shrek. Oh. I guess. I've got a buddy named Shrek. That's why I was like, are you talking about Shrek? Is that his legitimate name? Yeah, his name's Mark Shrek.

Boy, that's not cool. It's not spelled the same, but we call him Shrek. Oh, yeah. That'd be the easiest thing to do. Please give me any comments on what I can do to change myself so that I'm presentable enough. Well, put your hair back on. I'll work on that. Did you lose a bet, or was it just for fun? I just got… I get that. 3 o'clock in the morning, I decided to shave my head. That's usually when I shave my head. Yeah. Well, that's when I start going to bed. Is it what? Did we get that on the internet? I don't think so. I think it was all on me, which is a good thing. Great. No, I just have been talking about it for a while and decided that I wanted to shave my head. I was getting long, curly hair, and it's not exactly the most presentable look, so I decided to just completely shave it. You're kind of into extremes, aren't you? Yeah, it's like a black, white, yes, no. Yeah, I'm either going to have hair down to here or completely shaved with a razor.

Well, that's cool. I like it. And I think it would be really good. Do you really? Yeah. You don't have to lie to him. I think it says something. Yeah. I think it does say something. Turning a new leaf. He could either be Solomon or Kojak. You just pick one. You know, lollipop. Solomon or Kojak. Don't cancel me. I'm impressed that you know Kojak. What do you mean? That was like a long, long, long time ago. I'm a man of the culture. I watched a lot of Nick at Night when I was young. Don't be good at this. That means you're out. I mean, that was even young for me. Like, I was a little kid when I was on. I don't go, Jack.

All right. All right. Hey, Lumi's pants on the pants says go to church instead. Pants is kind of fierce. You want to turn over a new leaf? Don't shave your head. Go to church. I think that's our new slogan. Don't shave. We need to put up an ad for that. Don't shave your head. Go to church instead. Go to church instead. Pants, I will talk to you on Friday. I agree. Not cool. All right. So, here's the deal. I think there's such a thing as having too much biblical advice come in. And I'm saying from outside parties. All right. I'm not talking about you've read the Bible too much. But here's… You really need to back off on the Bible. Here's where I think the problem is.

I think we have too much stuff coming in. And we don't ever take the time to, A, apply it or, B, evaluate whether we're applying it correctly. These are the things that bother me about things like the daily bread. I'm going to come out as a guy that is wary of certain daily devotionals that jump around. And they're pretty fluffy anyway. They're usually kind of like, yeah, the grass is green. Isn't it great? Isn't it great to have grass? Jesus loves grass. Jesus made grass. You should grow too. Here's a verse. But here's the problem. It changes daily. There is so much content available. So many preachers on the internet. So many blogs to listen to. So many daily devotionals. Bible reading plans. But here's the thing. I think you can take it in and you can say, that's the word of the Lord. I'd like to do that. And what did you do the next day is you went on to something completely different and focused on that. And what I think is it's creating a culture of Christians. Where we're doing the things that would otherwise feel like we're following Christ.

But I'm hesitant to think that we're making a lot of positive changes except for making sure that we take in a lot of recommendations. It's the guy that goes around and says, what can I do to better my life? And he's willing to hear it from anybody. And he'll ask all the time because he's really open. And he takes it and he really wants to do it. But he asks a different set of people every day. It's all coming from the same Bible. But there's just a lot of color. And I guess what I'm saying is I feel like we should be taking things in bigger chunks. So I take something in. And if it's something that really I need to work on, that it's something where I can feel like the Holy Spirit is saying, Ben, this is you. I don't move on from that thing tomorrow. Maybe I hold on to that one for weeks. You know what I'm saying? Because I just feel like there's just too much variety of things coming in where it's tough to stay in the process of evaluating. If you've read 20 different devotionals over 20 days, that means that's 20 different things you should be keeping an eye on as to whether you've improved yourself or not. You know what I'm saying? Can you really do that? And then at that point, are you not becoming a little bit of a box checker? And never anywhere in there did you actually take a chunk of Scripture and actually read it and try to digest it. Like, here's a chunk of Scripture. Here's God's message for me. There's all these little tiny pieces from all over the place. It was just thrown at you. Thrown at you, yeah, randomly.

And about the same 45 verses that are popular from all the different devotions. Tomorrow, a new one thrown at you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And half of them are saying, oh, man, we're going to be like eagles soaring like wings. Like, didn't I read that on the other one? You know, it's like, how about the one where, hey, sometimes bad stuff happens. Here's how you get over it. And you don't get that one in the devotions usually. It doesn't show up. That's not happy. Now, wait a minute. You're characterizing all devotionals like that. That's not necessarily the truth. I mean, it could just be a devotional that has a Bible verse for the day. And then you're learning Scripture. Yeah, but even then, like, all, it's kind of the thought that where people are creating their own sermons, right? Like, you're finding a guy. Oh, how dare people create their own learning of the Lord? That's for professionals. Follow me here. There's a difference between reading your Bible and then trying to create your own sermon. For example, like, doing your own Bible study is also totally cool on a specific topic. But I think we're doing it in too small a chunks too often. Because what you'll do is, like, I have trouble with feeling hope. And so, like, you get a bunch of different hope verses from a bunch of different places.

Pink Bible. Got it. As opposed to reading things in context, right? Like, when Paul wrote Timothy, right? There's a whole breadth of stuff in Timothy. But when people want to fight, they tend to pick out two verses and then fight about it. As opposed to, like, you know, these are instructions. Do I understand what this whole letter to Timothy was? Do I understand what this whole letter to the people in the Ephesian church was about? You know, am I understanding why, you know, when John's gospel is directed toward Greek listeners? Like, do I understand what the context of that is? And am I taking it all in under that guise? As opposed to, let me search for hope. Right. Where's the verse that tells me my life's going to get better? Yeah. That's, yeah. Well, that was the big deal with that prayer of Jabez. Remember that thing came out? Expand my territory. I don't know, five, ten years ago. I don't know. Yeah. But, I mean, like, motivational, yeah, maybe you're right. Maybe motivational Christian books like that, especially devotional books, like, I don't

know, like, do you think most people do devotionals because they're trying to figure out some way to get to, you know, put a concrete base on their faith? Like, they feel if they do a devotional every day that they're really doing it? Or, I mean, what do you think the point of a devotional, like, if you, do you not believe, like, if you're devotional, if your daily Bible reading is in free form and just as the Spirit leads you, then it's not good? No, no, no. And don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying that devotionals are bad. Like, any time that you're pointing people to God's Word and you're thinking about it and chewing on it and using it to move out in your life, I think that's awesome. But I think what the concern is is that if you take it in and you take it in such little chunks and if it's something that is actually, you know, something that's in your life that you need to change or that you need to be working on, like, I'm afraid that the way these things are set up is that you just move on because that's the next day, right? The next day says, like, on Tuesday, December 8th, I'm supposed to read this one. And so that's what I read on December. And that one totally hit me and it's got tons of stuff to do with me. But then the next page says Wednesday, December 9th. And once it hits Wednesday, December 9th, I'm supposed to read that one. And so I guess it's just kind of a warning to make sure that we are not – it's always a going through the motions thing. But people do it for the right reasons, right? They're doing it because, you know, I want to be in God's Word. I want to be checking stuff out and hearing what I'm – something that I may be missing

and see how God is going to speak with me today. Because you could do the same with the Bible. You could just pick it up and start picking up random things, which also I'm not saying is a bad thing. But when something hits you and you can feel God pointing at you and saying this is for you, don't just move past it because your schedule is to read another 10 chapters tomorrow. You know what I'm saying? Like, stay where you're at. And again, I think people that write the devotions are doing it with a solid heart. I think people that read them and use them are doing it with a solid heart. But what I'm saying, I guess I'm warning against make sure you're not just checking the box. Like, if you see something that applies to you, hang out. Hang out for a while. That's one of the difficulties in preaching sermons is that the ultimate goal is that the Word of God change people. Yeah. You know? And every time it's like, how do you present in such a way that impacts people to the point that they really change and not just leave saying, oh, that was nice, and go home and forget it. And they're just waiting for next Sunday or whatever. I just, you know, kind of check in, did my thing. That's a challenge. Because maybe that's why you put a bed up on a roof, like the other guy we were talking about earlier.

Make something stick out, you know? And like, you know, this is different and special. That guy's not going to be able to preach anything for 10 years without someone thinking of him and his wife sitting in a bed on top of a roof. Yeah, I agree. It reminds me of Job 38.1, where it says, the Lord spoke to Job out of the storm. He said, who is that that obscures my plans with words without knowledge? I don't know how that really applies, but I really love that verse. I'd like to see a devotion book through the book of Job. You know what? I bet it's Sel. You know, who was I talking to? Like, there's some parts of Christianity that go through, and like, they think the entire book of Job is like a big metaphor, or a big analogy. Some people say that, yeah. Like, it didn't really happen. Whatever. I don't see how it couldn't happen. I think it happened. Are you a metaphor man? No, no. Jesus refers to it. I mean, it's the same thing, the Adam and Eve stuff. I mean, Jesus refers to them as real people that happen in real time. So, I mean, the only way, you know, Job and Adam and Eve are not real people is if Jesus

was a liar. Well, that's what I'm saying. That's the premise. Jonah and the big fish. Yeah. Same thing. Oh, that was an analogy. I was just talking to my wife about that the other day. Like, I was talking about how fickle, you know, just people are, me in general, you know, whatever. But just how fickle people are. And I thought, isn't it great to serve a God who is exactly who he says he is, who loves exactly how he says he loves, he does, you know, if you read all of Jesus' words, especially in, you know, just right through the New Testament, read it. But every time Jesus speaks, you can take everything he says at, the cool part is, at face value and when you're reading it by yourself, he might say something different to you with the exact same words. You know what I'm saying? Like, and it's funny how the Bible has the ability to do that because we were talking about how, you know, you generally interpret the Bible as literally or figuratively and I'm like, I'm literal until God tells me not to be. You got to look at the context. Right? I mean, I'm fairly literal on most of my, you know, interpretation of the Bible and then, you know, if I happen to be, you know, reading a verse and for some reason that verse tends

to fit exactly something in my life that it doesn't, that it wasn't speaking to, I consider that the Holy Spirit going, yeah, that's what I meant to say to you, you know, grab onto it. It's figurative, you know, do it. And so, I don't know, I see, I see it as both ways and I see it very, you know, very easy to, I, you know, whatever God says he can do, he can do. I think that's pretty, that's laid out pretty straightforward. So what do you guys think about, because I know Mike, you just did it, but about reading the Bible or getting, whether it be your devotion, like to your cell phone or to some sort of electronic device. I'm thumbs up on it. You are, because see, my wife and I have, not really debate, but just like kind of a opposite sides of the coin on it, because my wife does not like, you know, she's got a Kindle, I've got an iPad, you know, phone, whatever, and, and you can get Bible on anything. Yeah, I think that's cool. But, but she, she like, and it's for good reason why she feels that way, but she wants to actually just hold her Bible and actually have the real pages. And, and I, I see the value in that. I think that's awesome, but I don't see anything wrong with, you know, getting the Bible in other forms. Now, the only thing that I can see about it though, is actually I have a Bible app on my phone and I was actually just scrolling through the other day of all the devotions. There's so many different types of devotions that you can get. And some of them were only like five days long. We're just about a small topic.

Some of them were, so you could really narrow down what was going on in your life. You could find something about it, but I could see where it gets lost in the clutter. You got to be careful of not like, okay, Facebook, oh, text message from my brother. Oh yeah. My devotion. And then next thing you know, you're just, and I think that's kind of what you're getting at is you don't want to just cram it in and yeah. Check a box and say done when it's like, hold on. Did you really study the Bible this week? Or did you just check some devotions and delete it and then check your Facebook? The living word inspired by the God of the universe has a message for you. Check. Right. Yeah. Done with that. I'll get right on it. That's why you don't read the Bible once and say, oh, I've read that. It was good. You know, I'm all set. What? Why is everybody looking at me? I don't know. You're inspiring. Troy didn't really say anything, and so I just figured it was your turn to talk. Well, you know, I was kind of hit with this a little bit because I realized we've been

doing psalms in our LTG, so like, you know, we're trying to get through a certain amount of scripture in a given week, and boy, these psalms are just drudgery. Like, it's not the same type of reading, and you have to be in a different kind of mindset to be getting something out of the psalms. I can read through them and I can get through them, and I actually, I kind of like poetry. Like, I'm not a… But it can be tough to get it out. Yeah, to like see it from the same spot, and so one of the things that I usually hate, like I've always hated, is writing in books. Like, I don't like writing in my books, but I realized that I get way more out of it when I do it. I get way more out of it when I'm underlining things and putting stars on stuff, and I look back and I think, oh, it's full of somebody else's crapola with their lines and junk in it, but I look back, and I was even looking back on my psalm reading day, and I can see where my mind was at. I was looking in Psalm, let's see where we're at. It was Psalm 101. I underlined, I will walk with integrity of heart within my house. I will know nothing of evil. And then I was again in Psalm 103. So, I mean, I can see what's reflecting is I have, within my underlying passages, looking at it back now, when I'm reading those, I'm concerned about making sure that I'm leading my family and my life with integrity and the people that I'm shepherding with integrity and recognizing the compassion of God in the same way that I would have compassion on my kids.

This hit me, it was late last week. I was praying, not even with, because she was sleeping. I went to my oldest daughter's bed. I was kind of walking. I was getting ready to go to bed. I went in there, and I just kind of prayed, standing next to her. And I was looking at her, and I don't really get a lot of those tender dad type of moments. But I thought, oh, man, I would, I was just praying, and I thought I would do anything for this, anything. She's so sweet, and I'm so proud of her. And right at that minute, I got this picture of God saying, Ben, that's how I think of you. That's God saying, that is how I think of you. I know what you think in your head, and you think of, you can pick anything out of the 30 years that you've been alive, and you think, there's no way he continues to retain that type of thought. Did he hear, did he see what you thought? Did he hear what you said? Did he see what you did? And sometimes, I will allow myself, obviously, the compassion for my kids, and then not allow God the same compassion. Yeah. And as if he can't sit in the seat of justice, in the seat of compassion. And it was weird. I thought that, and then three days later, I'm reading, and there it is. There it is.

As a father shows compassion to his children, so the Lord shows compassion to those who fear him. And I thought, I get it. I'm with you. He's saying, get over whatever it is that you're holding on to, and just keep rocking for me. I'm asking you to know that that's where I'm coming from, and now I want you to continue to live the same way. And that's just because I underline a few things. I can look back, and that's my reminder from God to me. It didn't take a guy to send it to me, or put together a pamphlet. That's just me. And again, there's nothing wrong with any of that stuff. I don't want to give you the impression that I don't like things like that. I just don't know why you're so against devotional. I just think it's people that read the Bible. I don't think he's against devotional. I would like to read the Bible more. That's a terrible idea. To go along with writing in your Bible, I understand if you don't like writing in books, keep a journal. It's so good to have next to your Bible. I write in my Bible, and it's so cool because I gave my Bible that I had since I was a kid that my parents bought for me when I was probably 12 or 13, my junior high, high school Bible. I got that, and I wrote in it for years, and I gave that away.

I gave it to another kid, Brandon Shoemaker, actually. I gave it to him a couple years ago, and I hope that the stuff that I wrote… Is he famous? Like, are you name-dropping Brandon Shoemaker? I don't know who that is. No, it's Lori Haleso's oldest son. Oh, okay, okay. But I gave him my Bible, and hopefully the stuff that I wrote down in there, the stuff that I underlined maybe helps him in some way because I got my dad's Bible, and my dad was a big writer in the Bible. I mean, he has stuff in every single chapter of every single book, and it's cool to look at it and think, you know, well, what was he thinking, and how can that help me? And it's weird. It's like you left little nuggets in there just like, hey, this is from God, but check this out too. And, you know, this is all from God. This is all great, but look at this one too. I've highlighted the greatest hits of the Lord. Huh? You know, God said some stuff here, but check this out. And what I'm saying is every single thing in there is good. Actually, the chat's jumping on board with your journaling, and actually, I really wish I did more of it, actually, especially a prayer journal. I really would like to… You know, because the thing is, like, I pray, and I ask for things, and then, like, I don't

pay attention to what the Lord's done. I don't know if that's just my personality, or I'm not paying attention, but God has probably answered yes, no, or maybe every prayer I've ever asked Him, and I just ask for it. I'm like, well, God's got it now. I'm going to keep rocking on, you know? See, I have trouble with the journaling, because although it's not necessarily a, you know, where, Ben, you said, you know, okay, December 9th, now it's the next day, and you move on, like, with the devotional. That obviously doesn't happen with a journal, because it's just whatever you want to write, but I never go back and reference anything. And I think that maybe you're saying that, Mike, like, I don't really go back and, like, revisit my journal. You know, so it's like, what good was, I mean, maybe if it helped me form the thought at the moment, then that was good, because I wrote it out, but if I don't ever revisit it, then it just, it's a lost thought, and I wasted time writing. You know, and some of that might be just your personality and your relationship with God. Like, I know that, you know, there's a lot of times my wife keeps one, you know, and she'll look back, and she can tell you the specific date that she asked God for an answer to something, and then she will tell you the specific date that it happened. And that kills me, because… So is it because she just remembered, or because she actually would go back and… Yeah, she looked it up. She goes, you know, I was just interested in what I've been praying for, and then… See, that's awesome. She starts to flip through the page, she's like, God answered that one, God answered that

one. See, I wish I just had the discipline to actually sit down and do that. Yeah. Yeah. I've tried multiple times, yeah. Yeah, I do it every once in a while, just because, I mean, it does help me writing stuff down, form thoughts, and then, you know, this is what I'm kind of thinking, is that right? And I can look back, well, I was an idiot. What was I thinking that for? That's stupid. I obviously know more now than I did then, and all that good stuff, but I think… How long ago did you write this? Well, I'm saying, like, I journaled when I was, like, 10. I journaled when I was, like… Oh, right. Okay. Looking back and, like, well, God, what does this mean? And now I'm just, like, really? I asked myself that question. But now you know how far God has taken you. Right, exactly. And that's a cool thing to look back on. And that's another thing I underlined in Psalm 105. It's part of the first verse. It says,

Oh, give thanks to the Lord. Call upon his name. Make known his deeds among the peoples. How can I share the deeds? How can I articulate what God has done in my life if I'm not acknowledging it and remembering it? You could buy a catchy shirt at the Christian bookstore. You could. God has used this guy. Actually, that would be kind of neat. If you could just write in it, like, God has blessed me today, and then I could write in hostess cakes. Some people don't get hostess cakes. I can… You can attribute anything. That's true. I'm just saying, part of the celebration here in Psalm 105 is he's saying, Make known his deeds among the peoples, not privately celebrate amongst yourselves. Lord, you are good. It's saying, like, I can't help but tell people and share with the world God's deeds. Yeah, you just see a guy that's not used to doing this right, and he's all nervous. He's about ready to open the door. He opens the door, but he's like, the Lord does great things. And he shuts the door and he's like, I've done it, Lord. I've done it. I've done it. The weight is off my shoulders.

I'm at the top of a mountain, and he starts saying, You know that Psalms is a roller coaster. I read that, J.Biz. I read that, J.Biz. He's right on. He's right on. I remember Tuesday. I was like, yes, sir. Yeah. I haven't seen it too much. The Psalms is a… It's a roller coaster. I think you can find… There's… You know, a lot of the books of the Bible, I like to read straight through. The Psalms, I don't know that is one of those books for me. I think the Psalms is very topical, and I think I would use it as such. See, I love the roller coaster of Psalms. Yeah. I do, because it's… You can relate to it. We're human. I mean, we have roller coasters ourselves. We're all on an emotional roller coaster. It's cool to see this Psalm, he wrote this, and, you know, God, we thank you for this,

and you're so amazing, and this, and this, and this, and you lay my enemies at my feet. The next one, you know, you treat me like I'm lower than the beasts of the field and all this different stuff, and it's just like, I can relate to that, and then I can see where you're at that spiritual high, and then going right back into, like, a valley and everything like that. I like it. Isn't that the devotional thing that Ben's just talking about, though? Like, aren't you just skipping from one thing to the next? Like, yeah, no, no, not great. Yeah, you know, you're just moving right on. Like, wouldn't… Well, don't we do that as people in general? Isn't that part of the human condition? I mean, we do go on roller coasters ourselves. I don't know, within, like, a five-minute time period? It don't take that long to read the psalm. Fine, and read… You know, if you're not comfortable with it, read a psalm all day. Read a psalm every two weeks. Troy, it was more of a discussion topic. That's why I'm saying… I hate the way you read the Bible. Right, no, that's what I'm saying, is imposing that as a situation. I mean, you've got to take your Bible reading the way that it's going to help you the most. Not just you, Mike Foose.

And yours is to burn through it. No. With psalms, I have read it entirely… That'll be fast. I've read it entirely through in two and a half hours, and I've gone through, and I've read a psalm over and over and over again. You've read the entire psalms in two and a half hours? Yeah. I submit you're a liar, sir. That's fine. That is a huge book. You know, the funny thing about a psalm… It was in the prayer room, so I was able to sit down and just power read. When you actually sit and read the thing, it's totally different than, like, all the little devotion books and all that stuff, because it's messy. It's messy, too. Like I was saying, new Christians earlier, I mean, there's just, like, smite my enemies, you know, dear God, kill everybody. Why don't you kill them down for me? I'm slimed to, oh, praise God. I mean, it is all, like, it's all over the place, and there's some stuff that are kind of hard to read. Do you find it's easier just to kind of buzz through it and just kind of buzz, I mean, get from beginning to end? With psalms, I have to do just a few per day, or otherwise I'll buzz through and not know

a thing I read. Too many of them. That's me. I can spend, like, eight years on Psalm 119 alone. Actually, I just, you mentioned that last time you were in, and I spent some time this week reading Psalm 119 repeatedly, and I'm very glad that I did. This will be the first time I've actually gotten it. Would there be a psalm that you were not glad that you read repeatedly? Oh, the rest of them. Every single one of them. That 118. Well, Psalm 119 is gigantic. I really hate that one. It's like, it is. It's a Gilgamesh. That is the biggest book in the Bible. Yeah, it's our biggest chapter in the Bible. I don't know what Troy was doing methamphetamines, reading the songs one day, and seemed to be rocking past them. And actually, Ben told me that I should read them out loud, and so I started doing that. And so, actually, it was very helpful that I was out of town, so I wasn't, I was not at my own house. I was at a hotel reading out loud, which is way less disconcerting than sitting in your own house reading aloud. I don't know if there's something weird about it.

Are you putting on a circus on this chat, or are you serious about this deal? This has been since the beginning. This is the church. Well, you don't make any sense. You're not making any sense at all. It's just the way it is. Mike, when you go home tonight, we don't need groups all over the place doing their own thing. We just talked about this, Dan, about how you spiritually feed people who are on different paths of life, and you're trying to drag them back to the beast of the herd? What? That's exactly what he's doing. It's taking one piece of scripture, and every age group, every person chewing on it, digesting it, meditating on it, analyzing it, praying God, what do you have for me in this, rather than, rather than, I want to do Ephesians over here, and Romans over here, and I'll be long. But why would you shackle someone from doing above and beyond? It's not shackle. It is. It's freeing them to understand the scripture, rather than doing 14 different things at once, and not getting any of it. No, no, what you're saying is, is like, okay, you did three verses in Ephesians this week. Let's get those three verses down. And then you wanted to do, you're spending time studying outside of that, and you're saying, no, no, we don't do that.

Yeah. Yeah, that's good. As groups, as official ministries of the church, that's what we do. Not anybody else can do anything they want. Well, isn't that very, isn't that very, very tetrarchical for you to say, yeah, the official ministry of the church, it's the whole flywheel thing, we're all going the same direction, and then when you interject some other things in there, we're already, already going the same direction. How does that change the direction? That's like a guy driving, and one guy took a soda, and one guy did not. Exactly. They're still driving in the same direction. That's not division. Yeah, what if the other dude is like, man, I wish I had a soda? Well, then he should stop with you. Then one guy has to go to the bathroom, and the other one does it. Man, I will not look at any man who has a soda. Man, I'm really trying not to drink soda. I wish you would not have brought a soda with us. Division. Under the official head of the church? This is what happens when we don't have a small group leader, is everything starts falling apart and crumbling, and then the whole church is going different directions, and they're all a mess. Yeah, everybody's reading the entire Bible.

What a mistake. I know. What is wrong with you guys? You don't get it. What is there? What am I missing? I don't get it. Explain it to me. I don't understand how you could be against other people studying parts of the Bible. I'm what? I'm miscoloring it? Go ahead. Yeah, that's like saying, okay, family, we're having roast beef for dinner, and the rogue child says, no, I only want macaroni and cheese, and so you go off and make macaroni and cheese for them, and you're like, that's not even close to the same example. Oh, it's exactly the same. No, because what we're saying is the kid says, I'm having roast beef. Oh, by the way, I also brought some macaroni and cheese. Wait, that's the same example. They're reading the same thing, and they're like, I just brought some extra stuff because I'd eat more than everybody else, so I figured I would go ahead and study that. So that's what you're saying. That's a problem. But as long as you're not pulling the rest of the family away from the roast beef. Why would you automatically assume that's what they're doing?

You guys are still in Ephesians? We're in Revelations. You're stupid. Who does that? It's a bigger reason behind it, which I can obviously not articulate at the moment. Well, you're the guy to articulate these things. When would be the time to articulate that? You're the leadership man. I've got to prepare for this. I've got to remember why we do things. I know why we do things and go with it. Chad has another solid point. The LTGs are, nobody is in the same place. Exactly. You have all the freedom in the world there. Go with it. Fly. But the church-sanctioned ministry should never do anything differently than what you're doing in your small group. You know that don't sound good, Dan. No, come on. It's not a control thing. The goal is Sunday school. And it's been hard to get all this because it takes a lot of work. Sunday school, small groups, you know, I mean, everything doing the same scripture so that

the family can sit down at their table and say, hey, this is what we're talking about. This. Hey, we're in Romans 3 this week and we're trying to get this thing. And you can actually have a conversation about it rather than little Johnny was in Luke 2 and Susie's in Philippians 1. And, well, in Big Church, we had, you know, Revelation 4. And you're all doing different things. You can actually have a conversation about the same thing. I completely agree with Dan. But he's great. I understand what I'm saying. I completely, 100% agree with Dan. Something happens in the sermon. He was creating a roniest example. Which is a fairly fluffy example. The sermon can only do so much. You've got 20, 25 minutes to do, you know, a little funny joke and a little, what do you call it, juggling act and then throw some scripture in. And the idea is to pique your interest so that then you get together in your small group and you say, okay, I didn't get this. What did that mean? And you dig a little deeper, especially when we have mixed groups of people who aren't further along. I mean, if you're just a bunch of mature Christians walking around, you're not going to invite newer Christians in your group and do whatever you want.

But this is so that the people who are older are going to help those that are younger because they usually have a question from the week before. I mean, it's all processed through. It's been so long since I've thought about this because no one, you know, we just, everybody just complies. And then there's rogue groups that say, no, we can do our own thing. That sounds wrong, but still. There really is legitimate reasons for this. Hold on a second. I'm going to ask you to try not to be a puppy on this thing because, like, he's created an erroneous example. No one would disagree that the church should be in the same spot in your Sunday school, in your Sunday church, and in your small group questions. That wasn't the premise of the discussion. All he's done is rehashed what everyone agrees with and made it sound like someone disagreed with that. What's the premise of that? The question would be is if you have people that are within the church and in addition to the thing that the church is studying, they're also doing extra Bible study. I don't think he was saying no to that. Doing something different. As a small group, you must have different people or meet at a different time. I mean, what, are you going to send a guy from the church to go to the door and say you didn't spend your full hour talking about Ephesians? No, no.

I'm saying little Johnny comes to church and little Johnny's trying to figure out Jesus and they're looking for a small group. And we say, here's where our small groups are. Find the one that's closer to you. Find the one you like. Like, we want to be able to know that they're all doing the same thing and they're all processing stuff together as opposed to, well, you know, they're doing this and they're doing that. Which, again, is a false premise because that's not what anybody's talking about doing. Everyone is doing the same thing. That's not what we're talking about on the chat. That's exactly what they're talking about on the chat. But doing above and beyond? Yeah. Yeah. So you still have a small group and you've got two nights you're talking about. He's been saying that's completely understandable as long as the small groups. It's biblical to have a different day. Well, you do whatever you want. I'm just saying as the small group, if a small group do the small group thing, you can have 15 other bodies. Which we said we would. Which I think is the premise of the chat. They said they would. Oh, okay. We're continuing to do the small group.

But what you're saying. This was a quiet conversation. I'm just saying I find your position to be outrageous and it was worth talking about. So you're not going to be leading the small group ministry. We see that much. What? It sounds like not. If the extent for this, for it to be under the church sanctioned small group item that you have to meet on a different night because it's not okay to talk about stuff beyond the thing that the sermon talked about. That is exactly what you're saying. That's exactly what you're saying. I'm saying on the night that you have small group and you're in the pamphlet that says, hey, we're a small group at Pathway Church. Do the small group thing. Which I think what the chat said was going to happen. Okay, cool. But you're saying no more. Oh, no, I'll do 15 things. Well, I don't care how much more you do. Well, that was the discussion. Meet every single night. That's great. No, no. I'm saying same night.

The first century church met every morning and every night. Okay. Okay. Let's break it down. I smoke it twice a day. How long do we have to talk about the church sermon in our small group before we can talk about something else? So can we do two things? Can we have two hours worth of small group, talk about the sermon the first hour, or when is the church police going to show up and say, you're not doing enough topic discussion from Sunday? You can no longer be a legitimate small group at our church. What? So you're saying you're going to do small group? Uh-huh. And after small group, you're going to do another thing? Yeah. Well, that's cool. Whatever. Not after. Did you say after? You're just going to cut it off. Just not in place of. You're still doing small group. Yeah.

Well, who cares? Go for it. Well, that's what I'm saying. Exactly. That's why I was looking at this on both sides, and I'm like, I think this is actually I didn't understand that. I'm pretty sure they're talking about the exact same thing right now. They just have no idea that they're talking about the exact same thing. I'm having a friendly discussion on the chat about, hey, dude. Yeah, both of us are sitting here like, we don't know what's going on in the chat, but I'm pretty sure they're talking about the exact same thing. I'll put it this way. Anyway, you did not articulate yourself well enough in the chat that you were coming off as a man that says, I don't want you doing any additional Bible study outside of the thing that the church is doing. That's how it came off in the chat. Yeah, who told you what Bible verses to read? That's exactly what it sounded like. Yes. I never thought that I was in such spiritual disagreement with Dan in my life. Are you serious? What is he talking about? If I catch you reading something outside of where the church is sitting here. Troy Engeldinger is going to come to your house and break down your door. Are you in Galatians?

If you're going to do Galatians, it'll be on your own. Give me all your Bibles. I'm only going to give you the verses for this week. All your Bibles. Hand them in. You will get a verse pamphlet. No internet Bible. Oh, man. Dan, if you need someone to do that, I can. I'm in. All right, you're in. You're good. We're going to start with Mike. Check the cell phones. I was going to say, do you have Acts in here? Because I'm pretty sure we're on Galatians. Thank you. Yeah, that's right. That was awesome. I'm sorry. You're listening to Life in the Path. We're almost sitting outside looking in like, really? It used to be Pathway Church. We're just going to start sitting on opposite sides of the table. Me and Dan are over here, you guys.

Now, just wait. We'll have 12 campuses all doing the same text. Sunday school doing the same text. Small, 30. 300 small groups. We're even more than 30. I was going to say that. Oh, the whole city of Des Moines and all the suburbs talking about Ephesians 1, verses 1 through 7. And the south side of New Philippians. And we'll say, out of here. And then it's like Turf 4. You're now Baptist. I just wanted to read a little more. I want to know Jesus. You know the Jesus we tell you about. In the order we tell you about. We'll talk about that Jesus until next week. It's always on Wednesday. Because Grey's Anatomy is on Thursday. At 7 p.m. All right. You're listening to Live from the Path. Hey, I'm going to give you a shot at checking out one of the songs that we saw last week on Live from the Path with Jess and Jordan Anderson. This is You Go Before Us. And we'll be right back with you on Live from the Path.

Marching on before. Before I change. That was Jess and Jordan Anderson on Live from the Path. Thanks for hanging out with us. Make sure you check them out. If you go to Jess and Anderson. Then you can check them out. Yeah, you can check them out. Email the office. You can go to jessanderson.com. Tuesdays. You can get their Not What I Thought CD is out. Lots of really good tunes on there. And also, she has another CD. It's called Fundamentally Broken. Also available on that website. And it's excellent. It's a little bit more funky. It's got some, I don't know, it's just different. But both of them are very, very good. And I would recommend picking both of them up. You can get them on digital download on either iTunes or Amazon.com. I did the digital download on Not What I Thought and was very happy with it. The whole album? Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. You know, and I got the need to read the Reckoning for five bucks digital download. Dang, I paid full price. Yeah. I don't know. I'm like, I'm just now venturing into the digital download. I like CDs, but I've been pretty happy with it. See, I'm the exact opposite. I love the digital download, but I want to get more CDs. Why? Because I'm sick and tired of just making CDs. Old school. I hear what you're saying. I enjoy having the hard copy CD. I only have like 10. Here we go. That's fine. So, release the seven tips for talking with your neighbors about Jesus. Well, that's ought to be solid. All right. How to avoid an actual relationship with your neighbors and use these seven catchy ways to get it done. Hold on. Hold on. Here we go.

Number one. Find a road that leads to Jesus. In the course of conversation, be thinking of how Jesus intersects with the discussion because Jesus intersects and touches everything in our culture. Yeah. Sports, music, art, politics. Look for bridges to introduce Jesus into the conversation. It should be just as casually or passionately as you talk about everything else. Let's try it out. We'll do a conversation. Okay. For example, Ben, you be the Jesus man. I will be the guy that used to go to dance church. To the small group curfew. Hey, man, what's happening? Nothing much, man. How's your family doing? Doing great. Just cutting the grass. Your grass looks good. Thank you. I work on it diligently. All right. See you. I'll see you later.

Fail. You know, I have a shepherd that leads me to greener grass. That went straight for a dead end pretty quick. Morgan. Morgan. I don't know. Okay. Well, okay. Yeah. That sounded seamless. Hold on. Put it in the context of the rest. Here's number two. Don't be weird and awkward. All right. Here we go. So now I'd like to talk with you about Jesus. If all of a sudden you put on your Jesus hat and you are talking to them like a project and not a friend, then you're entering awkward territory. Now there will be times it becomes awkward because talking about Jesus and sin can be that way, but don't let it be because you are socially weird. I think that's a solid number two. I think number one negates number two. I think that's very true. If you don't recognize you are socially weird.

Yeah. You think you're socially cool if you're socially weird. I know a guy just like that. Yeah. Like me. I kind of laugh like a… All right. Here we go. Number three. Be winsome. Including in that word is the word win. Be winning. Be winning friends in the conversation by being engaging, friendly, and kind. I really like seeing these in practice. I've tried these straight up, just like they're describing, and it does not go well. Number four. Counter stereotypes and characters of Christians. Many urban secular folks have a… Put your bed on top of the church. Hold on. Hold on. Many urban secular folks have a particular character of a Christian, which is not very flattering. Judgmental, harsh. The morality police.

Although many don't personally have any Christian friends. Be gracious and talk with them. Serve them and love them. Okay. All right. I don't know why… Why are you judging me? Although, if you're not the morality police, I mean, you do have to be careful on the other side of that. Can we tell them what to read? Where you say, hey man, you want a Pabst? I'll take 15, because I'm not one of them. I'm not one of those Christians. That's the blue ribbon, right? Let me remove my shirt and roll in your lawn. Yes, hugging is cool, Big Ron. Hugging is totally cool. That's the best way to get people… Don't come from the left. Here we go. Number five. Host an open house. When my wife and I moved into a new apartment building, we hosted an open house for the whole building and went over the top with really good food and wine. Dozens of our neighbors came out.

It was the foundation for future gospel-centered conversations. I think that's good. Get him drunk, introduce him to Jesus. Yeah. Just not too much wine. Do you want to know a really good spirit? It's not that… Wow. That's socially awkward. That is so socially awkward. You think that spirit's good? I can tell you a better one. Yeah, that doesn't… I'm not… I'm not very good at this. It's set apart from these. Did you know Jesus turned water into wine? There's a certain reason that the Lord calls leaders to help with the congregation and then other people to do individual type atmospheres. Do you know what I'm saying? I'm not good one-on-one. I'm not good one-on-one. I'm only good one-on-three. I can lead 200 people, but two. No, no.

No questions. No questions. I don't do questions. That's the end of the sermon. Thank you. Go talk about that in your small group. But nothing more. What's your name? That's not in the text. Number six. Be honest about your struggles and failings. We all fall short. We all struggle and fail. The credit has to be given to Jesus in your life. Hey, man. I tried to talk to you about Jesus last week, and I told him, man. Can we start over? Ask me that long question again. I got a doozy. You know that long question we were talking about? Yeah, I was trying to talk to you about Jesus. That was a fail on my part. Jesus talked about trimming the hedges and throwing some into the fire. That could be you. It could be you.

Your grass is really green. Oh, I got to send Daniela to Texas her birthday right now. Right at this time? Is she in Eastern? No, she's in Kentucky, whatever that is. Is that East? That's the East. Oh, hold on. We'll just pause the whole show. Go ahead, Troy. I just thought the whole show really needs to end right now. Sorry about that. Yeah, no. This is compelling. Seven. Seven. Actions also communicate. Serve your neighbors. Serve your neighborhood. Look for opportunities without being an attention getter. Your neighbors are watching you, and just as James said, faith without words is dead. You know, you think that list was compiled to shut down the more aggressive Christian folks who try to evangelize through outrageously stunt-filled ways? Read the number seven one again. What was number seven?

Serve your neighbors. Serve your neighborhood. Look for opportunities without being an attention getter. So, I mean, are there people out there, like, wearing the Jesus T-shirt, holding up a Jesus flag, walking around going, I'm here to serve, neighbors. You know, please allow me to do something in the name of Jesus. You know, Jesus was a servant. He washed feet. I don't do feet. Feet is a no. But I have pumpkin bars. Got these delicious red krispie treats. I will cut your dogs. Some of the people that I find that are most effective in showing a witness are, like, long-standing relationships of just acting like you give even a crap about somebody. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Like, just even showing that you care about them at all just to inquire their name or who they are or how things are going or whatever, you know. And it may not be that week that they show up and turn their life over to Jesus, but two years later, you know, you're having a conversation, you know, this time that you didn't have before. So, I don't know. That seems like the most effective. This camera is really close to me right now.

Get away. You're listening to Life in the Bath. I don't even know what to say. Yeah, all right. We're just going to get this out of the way. Here you go. This is for Danielle on her birthday. Enjoy. Happy. Happy. Here we go. Happy birthday to you. Hudson. What? Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday, dear Danielle. He's wearing that same shirt today. Oh, she's criticizing this. Yes. Happy birthday to you. There you go. Enjoy. He's got that same shirt on. Hey, if it works, you keep going with it. Those are awesome.

I got that queued up ready to go. All right. Hey, you're listening to Life in the Path. All right. Just a reminder. What's coming up next week? Adam Cates will be in the studio. I'm excited to hear from him. His CD is out and ready to roll. You can find him on Facebook. And that's Adam Cates, Adam Cates. He's going to share some of his music with us. And he's got a gig, I think, at Wellspring that same day. So check that out. Maybe try to swing out there and be a part of that. And the following week, Jeff Arendale will be in the studio. His new album is coming out. I'm going to be excited to hear from him. He's going to play a couple. And he's got some buddies coming in to help him out. I'm really excited to hear what Jeff's been up to and what that solo album is going to be like. And February is actually looking pretty cool, too. We've got tons of people, people we have not heard from. Some fresh faces here in the Pathway studios. XL, Todd Stevens, is going to be on the program.

You can find him on Facebook. And he's also on Reverb Nation. And also, Shane Van Aert is going to join us. Oh, yeah, right. He's going to make it. Okay. Thumbs up. So, anyway, lots of cool stuff coming up here on Live from the Path. And also, keep your calendars open for in March. We're going to be broadcasting for the Newsboys show and doing some interviews. That's going to be a slap-happy time. I'm pretty excited about that. That should be good stuff. I'm going to bring my own energy drink. Can I bring my shark? I will have an energy drink. You will wait. I will have a helicopter. Why? A little one. I want a big one. Dan's bringing a shark. Here, Live from the Path. Okay. This is an open letter to parents out there who bring their kids to adults-only events

because they couldn't get a babysitter, but didn't want to miss out on a fun time. Listen, folks. When you signed on for Parenthood, you gave up the privilege to party anytime you want. An invitation stating adults-only means just that. Do not expect the host to tone it down because you were too selfish to stay home with your child. I attended a 50th birthday party to which one mom brought her 5-year-old daughter. She then requested that the host sanitize the event, but he refused. That mom spent most of the time covering her child's eyes. She tried to cover the girl's ears, too, without success. What is going on? Not only was there a racy birthday cake and adult toys as gifts, but the adults weren't holding back in conversations, either. Instead of leaving, the mom stayed. Until the male stripper started performing. Oh, no. She was mad, but it was her own fault that her little daughter witnessed more than she should have. Parents should be grown-ups. That means occasionally missing out on something because they are no longer single and childless. Please don't mess up somebody's party with your selfishness. A babysitter. Oh, man. It's the 50th birthday party. I'm kind of stunned by that. Yeah, first of all, the 50-year-old should be over that.

Secondly, yeah. That's the part I found funny, that parents should be grown-ups. What about everyone else who's having a crazy, dirty, you know, 50- and 30-day party? Adult toys, male strippers. Holy cow. Rude speaking. Who sees the little child in the room and says, you know what? We'll do whatever we want, and we don't have to change anything for the likes of you. Oh, yeah. Yeah, they should be mature enough to go like, hey, there's a child here. Okay. Let's tone it down. So take all the dirty… Cancel the male strippers. Take all the dirty stuff out of it, right? Do they have a point? When you have children, do you give up the right to go to parties? And take your kids with you? Yeah. Correct. Yes, absolutely. I'm with you. Okay. As long as it's sanctioned by the church. It's starting to sound like, oh my…

Church of England. Yeah. I'm trying to think of any circumstances with… It's not their fault you had kids. I mean, to be honest with you, it's not anybody's fault that you had children. Now, if they set up an event of which it is possible that you won't attend because you can't take your kids, that's the risk they took. You know what I'm saying? On the other side of it, the party organizer can't be offended that you didn't show up because your kids couldn't come. I think that's fair, too. If you say, look, I'd rather stay home, I don't want to pay a babysitter, or… My priority is my children. Yeah, whatever. I think that's totally fine. The guy on the other side can't be upset. But generally speaking, it's not your responsibility that somebody else had kids, that you're part… I mean, we have this with the show. Our show goes from 10 to midnight. There are some people who just can't make it. We have guests that would probably come on the show that they're not going to come in that late. And I totally respect that. That's the reason we do it this late, is because of priorities with family and stuff. So, I mean, I totally get that. That doesn't bother me any. So, I don't know. What do you think, Troy?

I thought we did the show this late so I could come. Yeah, that's it. It's for you. Obviously, I'm not a parent, so I don't really know that aspect of it. Troy, you qualify every answer you've ever given. Every time that you give an answer, you always qualify it with some super obvious fact. So, let's say a woman writes in. You go, well, obviously, I'm not a woman. I'm not a woman. But… And then you go ahead. I've seen a woman. You can just skip that part and just get right to the meat and potatoes. I don't really have meat and potatoes. I agree with you guys. There's not really much to expound upon. Well, just say, that's it then. That's fine. I agree. That's it. Yeah, because really, by saying, by qualifying your answer, it tends to degrade my answer. You say, like, I don't have any experience in this area or not, but I agree with you. That means I am able to bring in people who have no experience or don't know what they're doing. That's true. So, that's a bad thing?

Being able to convince me even though I have absolutely no prior experience is a bad thing? Yeah, in effect, you've degraded my… Because it's kind of like presenting a well-reasoned argument. And then the guy that is a total dingus stands up and goes, I agree with that guy. Like, that's what he's saying. That doesn't do anything for me. That's the example. Oh, yeah. He's dead on. That guy knows what he's saying. Go, John Huntsman. Big mistake. That's awesome. Secular greed. Secular greed with Ben. Here we go. Man, dear life on the path. I retired two years ago at age 50 after working for 30 years. My wife and I are financially secure and I'm enjoying every day of my retirement. However, my wife, who is younger, won't be eligible to retire from her job for another five years. She's becoming more and more abrasive towards me. I suspect it's because she's jealous of my retirement status. She constantly accuses me of being lazy. Abby, I don't sit around all day. Life on the path, I don't sit around all day.

In addition to doing the yard work, house upkeep and repair and maintaining our cars, I do all the grocery shopping, help with the laundry, dishes, general cleanup, and take care of our pets. Despite all this, my wife still baboons by sleeping late in the morning, 9 a.m., and not going to a regular job like she does. I'm still young enough to get another job. Should I go back to work? No. You earned your retirement. You do everything else. Oh, yeah. That sounds like a happy marriage home. I earned his retirement. I don't do anything. This is the same argument on the other side when a wife is staying home. I mean, all you've done is flip the genders. Like a guy who doesn't respect what goes on when his wife and kids are at home as if she does nothing. Like it's that same mindset. So, you know. I don't know how a person at 50 years old, I'm assuming he's pretty healthy, would be content sleeping until 9. I could see for a while, you know, hey, you know, I've been working hard. He must have worked pretty hard if he's set at 50. Okay. I'll be 50 in a few years, and it's like I'm not even close to being set. Didn't it say that she can retire in five years? In five years.

So, I can't imagine someone that content with their only schedule being, hey, I tinkered around the house, and I changed the oil, and I got some groceries. I mean, I would have to work. I would have to do something or a hobby that's very time-consuming, invest something, teach, you know, in some way, mentoring. But I don't know what his business was. So, there's obviously some conflict, but I don't want to say he has to get a job to make her happy, but I'm just surprised that he's not himself thinking, I got to do something. Well, maybe he will. I mean, maybe you give him a few years. Maybe he just needs some time. Yeah. Let him play for a while, and then, I mean, man, I hope I'm not, I hope I'm 75 and still kicking it, but, you know. Yeah, so he's been retired for two years. You don't think that's long enough? That's long enough. I'd go about three months, and I'd be like, okay, you know, I'm guessing. Well, that's not too big of a guess. I'm not that far from 50. I mean, it's not like 50's old. I mean, it's pretty young for retirement. I'm sure he's 50. It says I retired two years ago at age 50 after working for 30 years. So, I assume he's 52. So, how could she be earlier, though? Because that includes, she's also, most people retire at 65. She's retiring at 52, or 50 as well? I guess.

Man, they must be independently wealthy. Yeah, he must have had a pretty good job. He's probably a pastor. I agree with Chad, though. Like, it doesn't really matter whether he does anything with his life or not. The question is, is the wife's position justified, and should he get a job just to appease her? No. No. She needs to, maybe she is jealous. Maybe she needs to adjust. Well, if they're financially secure, why don't she just retire now? Go travel. Yeah, might as well. Let's say they're not financially secure. Does she have a right to be upset with them? If they're not financially secure, he should probably go back to work. In and of so that his wife could quit working, even though he's reached retirement age? Yep. Maybe he's in the military. No, she doesn't have a right to be upset. She could be, I mean, it's the same thing, I have the same discussion with the children. Like, it's all right to look at a situation and say, here's how I feel about it, right? But, like, then you can evaluate from there whether, A, your feelings justified, and even if it is, how can I express that? You know what I'm saying?

Like, is it okay for a look at that and maybe be a bit jealous? I see it as, like, a natural reaction. That guy is not tied to a job anymore. I see being jealous, but I still don't expect him to change. Yeah. You know. But that's not an appropriate reaction. I don't feel happy about your retirement. You'd better get a job. Like, what does that do? It's like being in prison and dragging someone else in there with you. Yeah. There. You better get a Walmart greeter sign and, you know. Yeah. Yeah, like, I mean, if I was still working and my wife had retired and I still had to get up at, like, 6 in the morning, I would make a bunch of noise and wake her up and then throw it out loud before I left, say, bye, hon, and then clank the door shut or something just to roast her because I had to go to work if she didn't. I would certainly do that in a playful, good-time marriage type of way. But maybe she just wants to hang out with the guy. Maybe she's just upset. As I mean, you know, they still support her. Well, but it's the way to express it is that he goes and does something else. She's not doing the right thing.

Maybe he should be writing love letters during the day. Would that straighten it out or would she be saying, if you had time to do this, you had time to clean out the garbage disposal. That's probably the truth of it, though. He's got all this free time. He could spend on figuring out how to love on his wife since he's got nothing to do. Maybe she's more upset that he's not putting any of this time that he's got. That's a judgment on how people spend their time, though, right? Because, like, you could say the same thing about women that stay home with kids. I think it's a similar argument. I think people will, like, you have people that look at that and say, I mean, but you were home all day. You obviously didn't have to hold the kids all day. Couldn't dinner have been ready when I came in the door? Oh, man, I would never say anything like that. That's what I'm saying. Like what you're saying. What you're saying is it's okay for the lady to turn around and say that, but the guy on the other side is problematic. He needs to make it fun for her, you know, whether it's serving her in some pretty fun He sounds like he's trying, but maybe he could try a little harder. Maybe that's, maybe she's, maybe, like the food thing, maybe he could have some fun meals ready for her or little day trips, you know, on the weekends or something. Using his time to serve her makes sense, assuming that she notices and is not just so upset that he's not working, that she's going off the rails.

Depends on what her love language is. Yeah. What do you think, Troy? I was just about to say that, actually. No, I'm not a retired. No, I'm not a retired 50-year-old man. I'm not independently wealthy and I'm not a wife. No, actually, I was just about to say that. Maybe he's trying to love her on her by getting everything done during the day and she's just not noticing it for what he's doing. I would take it. Because, I mean, there was a list of things that he's doing in, I mean. According to him, I would take pictures and like totally put it in her face. According to her, he's leaving. So, both sides is according to each other. I mean, maybe he's doing this, this, this, this, this, this, and he's saying, I'm doing this, I'm making sure all the groceries are taken care of, I love you, I got this all taken care of. He could be leaving out part of the story, too. I mean, maybe she's not upset that he's a whole, maybe she's upset because he's an idiot. Or, you know, I mean, that's possible. But we can only go off of what we have. I'm just saying, like, the premise of his letter is, I can't understand how anybody can see what I'm doing wrong here. And that could be, he's actually missing the thing that he's doing wrong.

Well, it could be, and this is often the case with retirement. Usually it's when the wife is home and then the husband's suddenly home, is they spend too much time together. She's like, would you please go find something to do? Maybe he had a job where he was just gone a lot, and now he's home when she gets off work. And maybe she's just doing him not be there for, you know, just go do something. Maybe she's used to having the place, you know, kind of on her own. Yeah, that's fairly typical. Maybe she needs to explain that to him. Well, that's going to go well. I really wish you weren't here. Well, obviously, you can do it a different way than just saying, man, I really hate spending so much time with you. I mean, if you're in a relationship. All right, Dr. Smooth, hit me with it. If you're in a marriage that long, obviously, you know each other. You can explain to them, hey, you know, we're a partnership. We're one, but we kind of need our individual time at the same time. I like you a lot better when I see you less. Yeah. Good one. It's real, though. I mean, it is. It is. Yeah.

There's such a thing as spending way too much time with someone. I don't care how much you love them. There's such a thing as spending way too much time with each other. Every single person on the planet needs some time to themselves. And maybe the wife's thinking that she doesn't have enough time to herself. I use my potty time for that. I'm going to go potty. So you have five, ten minutes a day. Maybe person B needs an hour a day. Angry birds. Angry birds. Actually, don't ever put angry birds and potty time together. It makes for some mysterious thoughts when people are standing outside the door. What's going on in there? Turn the sound off. Secular says, that's not a bad idea about the retiring or about going back to work. But don't start looking until your wife has told you plainly why she has become abrasive. That would be a sweet conversation. Honey, why have you become so abrasive at me? Look at me. I'm so nice. I'm innocent. I serve you. I am to orange juices. You are to sandpaper.

Wouldn't it be interesting if all she wanted was to hang out with you? It would be a shame if you went back to work only to realize that something else was causing her change in attitude. You deserve to know what's going on because you do not appear to be lazy. Quite the contrary. Okay, it's funny that the secular took the stronger marriages, more time together angle, and the life from the path seemed to take the more time apart, remain separate angle. Just something to ponder. Okay, last one. Dear life from the path, I'm an adult woman working full time for my parents as their store manager. I do a lot of office work for my dad, who hates computer work. He has an eBay business on the side, which I manage for him. My problem is eBay shows me what dad has shopped for every time I log on. Some of the items are of a personal intimate nature. I got to start reading these, and I'm not comfortable knowing about them. I'm glad my parents have a healthy marriage, but it's way too much information for me. As a family, we don't communicate well, so I don't know how to handle this. My husband had no suggestions, so I turn to you. How do you ask your father to get a separate eBay account for his own personal things? Here's the deal. I think if you find a way to make it clear to him without telling him directly that you could see that stuff, I think he probably finds it. Pick out something else he bought, like the grass clippers, and say, Hey, how do you like those grass clippers you bought on eBay? Did you know I see all that stuff? Yeah. It's in your report. And then he's like, Oh, they saw that.

Yeah, he's going to have to figure it out right away. That's not any more awkward. That's immediate right. You didn't even talk about it. You know exactly when someone knows you bought that. All big and stuff, and then he's going to be like handing papers real fast, like, Could you put this on the internet? Please, thank you. And then he's going to leave. He's going to be all super awkward. No, no. You've got to hit that. Hit on. I live a sheltered enough life. I don't know what kind of stuff. I mean, we're like, even the other one. I mean, it's like… Now, tell me this. Would it be too… I don't know where to go with this. Somebody say something. Hurry up. Bill me out. Would it be too elaborate to, like, act like the radio has a commercial on? Like a deal.

So, like, the radio's on, and you turn it down and turn it up real fast, and there's a recording of you going, just an attention, eBay shoppers. All the eBay transactions will now be seen. Just a heads up, eBay will now be seen. Starting today. He's like, oh, well, I can't order my stuff on there anymore. Okay, I'll get it. Then he thinks everything's on the up and up. You don't have to see it anymore. Solid. And it's still the truth, because everything can be seen today. That's perfect. You said it's now can be seen. It can now be seen. You have to take out now. Now implies that it's changed. You just have to say, attention to customers, eBay items can be seen. That's what I do. The sad part about this is they're family, and they're that involved with each other financially, but they don't have a good communication. I mean, honestly, my daughter can talk to me about anything. I can talk to her about anything. I don't know how great of a communication you have to have with your father to be able to say that. Well, all you got to do is say, hey, Dad, do you know I can see everything?

I mean, she's too nervous to say that. I saw you ordering dirties from the eBay. Yeah. I understand you and Mom do this, but I don't want to see it. I just feel… Well, now, hold on a minute. I would say it would be different for me if my parents were happily married, and it is marital extras. Because things to spice up their life, I would say, hey, man, you don't want to see that, right? I kind of got the impression that's what it was. But I guess I got the impression it was a hymn items. No. Oh. So, yeah, well, yeah, I would probably just say it. Hey, man, you don't want to see that, right? I mean, good luck to you, but… I'd be like… You got to do that. Tell me, how does this work? Because, you know, I'm not doing this. What do you do with that stuff? Dad, I need some advice. How do I handle a situation in which I can see you ordering dirties on the net? Just say, hey, my husband wants me to order some blah, blah, blah, and…

Do you know what I can do with that stuff? I saw you… I see you got some. I know somebody on eBay. I'd say, healthy… Here's the deal. How does that thing work? This probably goes back to the ultimate point of the pastor with the bedding, right? Like, if I… In that situation, healthy marriage for my mom and dad, and I'm an adult child, I'd probably just say, hey, man, I can see that. I'm not doing that anymore. Keep it away from me. Right? I think I don't have a problem with that at all. If I think it's something else where he's ordering, like, vintage dirty magazines or something, like, that's more embarrassing to me. Yeah. It's kind of, like, creepy. Yeah. So, I guess that's what I thought. I thought maybe the guy was ordering stuff on his own. She said she's, like, glad they have a happy, healthy… How'd she say that? Yeah, she said, I'm glad my parents have a healthy marriage, but it's way too much information

for me. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You just tell them. Yeah, I wouldn't even hesitate. I don't beat around the bush. Just tell them. They have a communication problem. Yeah. It's like, they know each other's finances. Yeah. That's pretty personal, you know? Yeah. But, man, that's still pretty personal. Yeah, that's something I would have to prepare myself for. I mean, it's not your taxes, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, exactly. It's just like, so I noticed this was on your W-2. Hey, I noticed you were buying this stuff for your relationship with you or not. Fuck that. It's like… Nah. Secular says… I wouldn't make it funny. Try this. Send your father an email telling him that you feel some of the items he is buying online

are not things that a daughter should be seeing. Include as an attachment your letter to me. That's a good trick. No. You send him an email? Yeah, you're going to distance yourselves between them? That's a fairly arrogant response. Further? Show him what I've written. That ought to scorch that right in the old tutor. No. Make it even more awkward by distancing yourself. Yeah, I mean, then the next time you see… Now, that's weird. You don't even have to mention the sex part. Just say, you know what? Hey, did you know I see all your activity? I see everything you buy on eBay. Yeah. Just… Get a different account. Put an emphasis on… Get a personal account. Just put an emphasis on… I see everything you buy.

Just set up a personal account for it. And say, hey, here's your password. I noticed you've been using personal and business stuff together. Here's… I set you up a personal account. Use that for your personal stuff. That way you can… Just in case they ever look back on it, here's this or whatever. That's solid. Yeah. Okay, I do have one more. Okay. Dear Life in the Path, my grandma recently bought me a plane ticket to go visit her. In the airport on the way back home, the flight was overbooked and I agreed to be bumped to another flight in exchange for a free ticket to be used or given to someone else within a year. My mom says the free ticket belongs to my grandma because she paid for it. I say I should use it for myself because it's compensation for the lost time and trouble of switching flights. What do you think? I agree with her. Yeah. That's herself. She doesn't know what to do, grandma. I mean, if grandma gives me a hundred bucks and I go to the gambling place and make ten

thousand bucks… You gotta say it like such a nerdlinger, man. I couldn't think of the name of it. I go to the house of gambling. I couldn't think of the word casino. The tribe of gamblers. Please place my money in the game of chance. I am naive about many things. Oh, man. Wow. I think you get my point. Welcome to Sin Palace. Please place my currency. They play rock and roll music. In Go Go Money Wheel. So everyone says it's not grandma's? No. You don't know grandma's ticket? She released it. I disagree. You think you gotta give it back to grandma's? No, wait a minute. Now, you're not a grandma, but… Well, obviously, I'm not a grandma. You've also never been booted from a flight on the way to grandma's.

Yes, I have. All right. So let me hear it. Yeah. I'm qualified for this one. I got this one, yes. My grandma bought me a ticket. My grandma buys me tickets to her place all the time. I would give it back to her. I really would. I mean… Where's grandma gonna go? I don't know. You never… Do we… Are we assuming that she's a very boring grandma? Yes. Most grandmas are. That's not true. My grandma travels more than all four of us. It doesn't matter whether she's boring or not. Yes, it does. No, it doesn't. It's part of the story, man. No.

Yeah. It doesn't matter whether she's sedentary or… She paid… Hip-hop nation. She paid for you to come out there to see her. You didn't just sit there and have a bad time the entire time. I love going out to see my grandma. And for some reason, they said, hey, you know, I apologize so much for the inconvenience and the frustration of all the stuff that she had to go through, the layovers. Here's a free flight. I'd be like, well, you know, grandma bought me one. I can give it back to her. I mean, she's flown me out there a hundred times. Obviously, that's a… Well, she was an inconvenience. Right, but she was… She had to pay for you to come out there to see her. She's going to pay anyway. Yeah. Right, but why not just give back the added bonus? It's not an added bonus. Because if grandma wanted to buy a flight to somewhere, she'd buy it. I mean, I'm not saying it's wrong to keep it. I would just myself… I would give it back to grandma.

You're not a terrible person because you're like, okay, well, I'm going to keep it for myself. I would be… Well, then if you're not a terrible person, why don't you just keep it there? That'd make you an all-right guy. I think it'd be nice. Are you a better person? Hey, grandma, here's a one-way trip that you weren't planning on. I'm taking. Good luck using it in time. I thought I'd just give you an inconvenience after you helped me out. Well, fine, then. Ask her, hey, grandma, I got this from the flight that you purchased for me. Would you like it? If not, okay, I'll take it. Thank you. A question to the premise is, is it an ethical dilemma as to whether to keep it or not? No, it's not. I'm saying it doesn't matter whether grandma wants it or not, could use it or not. I'm asking, if you decide to keep it, is it a problem? That's like a church telling a small group what Bible verses to read. Inappropriate. I don't think that's anything to do with it. Totally a lie. Totally.

Totally wrong. Seriously, it's like taking your money to the game of a chance. I guess I don't see an ethical problem with keeping it, but I would say, hey, grandma, would you like the flight? You paid for me to come out there. It was your money. Would you like a free flight? If not, no, I don't want that. Okay, fine. I'll take it. Actually, I mean, grandma's probably going to say no anyway, right? Grandma's going to probably tell you to keep it, so if it eases your mind, I just call her. I would agree. I don't think it's the name of your business. You wouldn't tell grandma? Whether you were driving home or flying home or whatever, it doesn't matter. I guess she paid for it, but still. Yeah, she was the one who forked over the cash for you to go see her. It might be, grandma, this is really cool. I just doubled your money. I just doubled your gift. So you got two freebies. Yeah. You got the free flight out there, and then the flight that she paid for that…

What kind of vindictive grandma isn't happy for you? Yeah. She's going to have to get you out there in the first place. I'm not saying she wouldn't be happy for you. I would… I don't see… I'm not saying I see as the ethical problem with keeping it. I think I myself would ask, hey, would you like the flight? You stewarded your gift well. You had a gift. Yeah. You stewarded into double the gift. Well done. Good and faithful servant. You have doubled your flight. Yeah. I've trusted you with… You haven't done anything. What if it… You didn't do anything to get that flight. You offered to get bumped. Yeah. Yeah. You took an inconvenience. You could have said no.

They would have had to put you on the plane. Because usually it's a volunteer thing. Hey, the first five people come up here and… Yeah, I guess I didn't even think about that still. Still, I stand with where I was at. I think it'd be right to ask grandma if she would like it. So if they give you a free motel, you're going to invite her over? You'll sleep in the terminal. Grandma, I'm still in San Antonio. Fly out with me at this hotel. I'm going to sleep in the terminal just so we have this free hotel and we can argue over later. Well, they give you a voucher that's a flight for you or somebody you want to give it to. I'd say, grandma, do you want it? Your eyebrow movements are mesmerizing. Okay. Secular says, your mother has a point. Offer the ticket to your grandma. If you're lucky, she'll tell you to keep it and enjoy it. If she doesn't, at least you know you did the right thing. In parentheses, when you give in the true spirit of giving, it will come back to you. Or so it implies in Ecclesiastes. Oh, yeah. That's the implication. Only give because it will come back to you.

Solid biblical reference. Dan, we're in Ecclesiastes. Does it say this? Any ideas? Why? Yeah, boy. We're not quite there yet. I wish someone was studying Ecclesiastes apart from us. Small goods will be hitting that in the next nine months, probably. What was it? Giving. Giving in Ecclesiastes. Hold on. We'll see what we can do. Give. Send your grain across the seas, and in time, profits will flow back to you. Give alms to the poor, and it will be as seeds sown in good ground. Thou shalt find the reward of it in this world, so it is in the king's blood, and in the world to come. So, I don't know if that was straightforward. Thou shalt find it after many days. Want me to find one more? Yeah. No, you're going to sound alive from the past. My name's Ben. Thanks for hanging out with us.

Hey, if you're not signed up for the podcast, I would recommend it. Get the audio podcast. That one's right as rain. Shows up every week at some point during the week. If you're on the video cast, God bless you. It may not actually show up. We really do give it a shot, but the audio podcast, 100% reliable. You can check out all the archives from the previous shows. We are nearly dating back two years worth of shows on the program. It'll be a two-year anniversary in March. And to me, that's crazy, because that means we have been in this studio for almost a year. Wow. Time is flying here in the red and gray in the Pathway Studios. Man, what have we done with it, though? I don't know. We've not stewarded it well. Granny does not get a free flight. We'll have to have balloons. I've got to work on another compilation. I'll put something together. Hold on. I promised something else that we were going to talk about. Oh, yeah. No, that's a good point. We do need another misspelled coffee table book.

See? I do nothing well. I got a great idea. Look what I've done, baby. Dan. What was misspelled in it? My heart is in the right place every time I remember. What was it? The word excellence. Oh, that's right. Broadcasting excellence since something, something, and excellence was not accurate. Don't you think you should have someone check that before you publish it? That always occurs to Dan after it's gone to the printer. Sabbath. That's right. We were going to talk about the Sabbath, about what an appropriate Sabbath looks like. So we kind of talked about this a little bit before the show started. And I don't know. The basic question was, what does it look like to Sabbath? What is God's intention for the Sabbath? And are you doing it? Yeah. Are you doing it? I will concede that I don't think I'm doing it. I don't think I'm taking the appropriate Sabbath.

That was a punishable offense. I mean, it's, and yeah, we take it pretty lightly. The idea is to rest. Yeah. You know, and of course, by the time the Pharisees got around, they messed the whole thing up and just added all kinds of junk to it. But the idea is just to rest. Yeah. It doesn't mean you have to lay in a bed. I mean, do something different. Yeah. Don't continue in the same things. It's holy, right? It should be set apart different than what you were doing for your other six days that constitute your labor. So it's not, it's not even doing your labor, but lightly, right? It's not doing the same thing that you should be doing, just doing less of it or a different form of it. Like it really should be something different that is not the labor that you otherwise do. So what's, what's said for the people who have to work on Sundays? What the, the Sabbath, uh, I, and Dan, you can correct me if I'm, if I'm reading this incorrectly, but like, I'm not sure that it's saying that it has to be Sunday. Actually, it would be Saturday. It would be the Sabbath. It would be the Jewish Sabbath, but like when, when, when, when he says that the man

is, uh, the Sabbath is made for man, not man for the Sabbath. Yeah. Um, I, I'm not sure that I read that and say it's got to be on the, the weekend that we've set up by our calendar. Okay. So basically Sabbath a day. My Sabbath is definitely not Sunday. Yeah. You usually all day long. It's just, it is a crazy day. And by Monday I'm like pretty much French toast. Um, but I'm not very good at either. Uh, in theory I take a day off, but I usually don't, I, you know, I find something. Is it bad that I'm really good at the Sabbath then? I rock that commandment. I rock that one. I do the super Sabbath. I do the super Sabbath. I don't do anything regular. I think that you should celebrate the parts of your relationship with God that you do well. Wow. The chat question was, does the Sabbath include resting and praying and worship? You know, you know, some, some would say yes. And at least what I was taught was it just something different, something that just gets you disengaged from your normal week, from your normal work that is rest.

Uh, I like to include, you know, worship and, and maybe some praying and stuff. My, my perfect Sabbath, I had a perfect way, and it's my fault I don't do this, is to take like a day a week and just take a Bible and a, uh, and a journal and just go somewhere like in a cabin where no one can reach me and take, leave my phone behind and look over a lake and just kind of sit there and, you know, chill, read, have a little music going. And Sabbath, and Sabbath. I think maybe the, this, um, sometimes we, we mix the two as if the biblical requirement for Sabbath has to look a lot like the church services that we go to. And that's not the, that was not the Old Testament view at all. It was, it was, you sat at home and you couldn't even walk very far. You could go to the temple, uh, so many steps, but I mean, a lot of people couldn't go. You mean you, you literally, you had your food prepared ahead of time. You stay at home. Yeah. And just, and that, and that was an overly restrictive, but that wasn't God's intention of the Sabbath. Some, some had it so strict that if you were to swat a fly off your forehead, that was work and therefore you violated, you know, and that's where Jesus was like, guys, you know, relax, you know, don't breathe on the Sabbath. So, so to try to, I guess to maybe answer the questions that are coming up on the chat. Um, I, I think it is not, the Bible does not lay out exactly. Here's how you're going to spend your Sabbath. Right. It's, it's the, the distinction is, is what is different from the rest of the week? Um, the day was created to kind of give you a reminder to rest.

Don't overwork yourself. Don't, you know, wreck your body, wreck your relationships by working all the time, seven days a week saying set, take a day and set it apart. Take a Sabbath, do something different. Um, you know, generally does it, does it look lighter than your other workload? It might. I mean, but you may work harder on your Sabbath building the shed that you wanted to build in the backyard, um, then you do what you work, uh, because I, I work in an office building. Right. But it's, it's just, you're doing something different. You're not burning yourself out of the thing. And that, and I think is the clarification that comes when Jesus says the Sabbath was made for man. I didn't make a day because I wanted you to fit into it. So I could say you're following my rules. You know, Sabbath was, was made, um, for man as a reminder to do what God did. God even, you know, he, he created for six days and then said, I'm, I'm going to take a breather here as an example to you to not continue to work yourself to the bone and, and completely, you know, ignore the other things that are going on in your life for the work that that's been set out, which is, because work is healthy. Work is what I've set you to do. Adam worked in a world that was with, without sin, Adam still worked. And so your work is good. But what he's saying is, is that I also set a day that needs to be set apart. I don't want you doing the same thing.

You're going to burn yourself out. God worked six days, rested the seventh, said, there you go. There's your pattern. And I don't think, so you don't think that it was to have a day to focus on God. I, I would say, I don't think God set out a special day that said, this one should be focused on me. Right. I mean, that should be an equally, it should be equal throughout your week. It is an excellent time to do that. Exactly. Genesis two, three on the seventh day, God finished his work that he had done and he rested on the seventh day from all his work that he had done. So God blessed the seventh day, made it holy because on it, God rested from all of his work that he had done in creation. And I think some people to maybe take the word holy and think, well, if it's holy, then we should be praying and worshiping and singing and, and, you know, type of thing. Holy just means set apart. And that's his point. I set it apart. The work was done. I rested. You worked six days, set another day apart and, and, uh, and rest. Right. Maybe it only feels that way is because our life, uh, you know, like, like the modern, uh, thought is that you'd go to church on Sunday and you worship God on Sunday.

And if you have an, a living and breathing relationship with Christ and Sunday is a big deal, but it's not such, it's not everything. You know what I'm saying? Like there's the, where's, is there a biblical mandate that you meet once a week in a building with other believers? No, not, not in those terms that you should continue to gather. You should be part of a body of believers and you should gather as part of body believers, but it doesn't say like, you know, on, on every seventh day in the AM, put on your nice duds and go to a place I have assigned you. You know what I'm saying? Like it does, it does not necessarily that, say that. So, you know, I, you know, we, maybe you forced it, I mean, you know, maybe, you know, it just seems that, that people like to tie the two together because, you know, you have, we, you have a two day weekend, mostly because our founding fathers could not agree on a Sabbath, uh, because, uh, you know, the Jewish religion takes it on a Saturday, everybody else takes it on a Sunday and they didn't want anybody to be mad. So that's how we ended up with a two day weekend. And so, uh, you know, so basically we ended up with two days and, you know, they try to shove the Sabbath and, uh, the going to church on the seventh day, you know, and they're not necessarily, they're only paired because America paired them because God paired them. In, in Corinthians 16, first Corinthians 16, Paul is really talking about collecting money, but he saw him up, the saints were gathering on this day, he said on the first day of the week of every week, you should, uh, put aside something to store it up and then he was going to come later and collect it, you know, and give it to some poor people. And, uh, so I was, maybe it's another one of those things that was just assumed, of course

you gather on the first day of the week and there's your Sabbath and you get together and you do church and you fellowship and you worship and, and so maybe that's probably, it's, it's part of the history, but it's not necessarily the biblical mandate of, you know, you are to worship, you are to pray, um, on Sabbath. Yeah. So anyway, I mean, I guess I would be, I would, I wouldn't pass over it as if it's less important of the things that God has asked us to do than other things. I mean, it is, he's asked you to take a rest. He's set it aside. He's specifically done so. And I, and I think, um, uh, that's one that, that, uh, you know, the more, the more intentionally you are and focused you are on doing what God wants in your life, this actually tends to be the one that you miss the most, um, because you're, you're working hard, you're trying to reach people for Christ. You forget about yourself. Um, it's the same that there are, there are people who will sacrifice, um, unintentionally their families, their health, um, their mental stability, trying to do what they think God wants them to do. And as part of that, they're ignoring some of the things that God has built into their lives to say, I want you to take it easy. For our, our protection, for our health. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so I, but, and so I, and I think that's tough.

I think what Mike saying was right on is that, uh, culturally those two things seem mixed. And I think there are probably some church bodies that perpetuate that as this, the Sabbath is church attendance. Yeah. Like the keeping it holy is to act holy is to do holy things using holy, not as set apart, but holy as in what God would do. And, but we're, they're just not divining it, defining it correctly. Um, and it actually sets up a very pious standard that cannot be met. And frankly, it's anti-biblical because it makes it sound as if God's checking stuff off as opposed to, are you just adhering to, uh, are you succumbing to my love? And are you, you know, trying to follow the things that I put in place for your own benefit? All, everything that God has put into place is no-nos is because, uh, it's for your own benefit. He's trying to keep you from harming yourself. And that Sabbath is the same thing. The ground is not a Nancy. Good to know. That's not what I saw on the Facebook. Uh, you're listening to live from the path. And, uh, uh, I don't know. Mike, did you find one more? Uh, no, no, I was doing something different. So here was a, um, uh, oh wait, that's not what I wanted. I thought I found it. So I did.

There's something we talked about just a little bit earlier. So how can I make sure I'm applying what I'm learning in Bible study? Um, and, uh, here was, here was kind of the premise. Cindy was in the Bible study I led for three years. She always answered the questions and participated in the discussions. She accumulated a lot of knowledge, but her life never changed. I've puzzled a lot over people like Cindy. I've met quite a few over the years. It seems that some people never move beyond head knowledge to heart knowledge. There are numerous reasons for this. And, uh, the three below, um, could be potential problems in the Bible study. Everything all right, Dan? Okay. All right. So are we studying the Bible just to accumulate knowledge? Those who can rattle off chapter and verse but never become more like Christ may not truly believe that the God of the universe is addressing them personally. They see the Bible as an ancient document with interesting and wise information but not living and active. They see no need to apply it to their lives. This person comes to the scriptures with an analytical eye rather than by humbly asking God to transform their lives. They take pride in mastering the text, but they don't know how to let the text master them. They want to study Jesus, but don't really want to know him.

Um, second was, are we coming to the Bible with arrogance? The person who is not transformed by the word of God may come to it to prove his or her point. This person may have decided what he or she thinks or wants the Bible to teach. They may have been taught such ideas as a child, been drawn to the Bible because it preserves the lifestyle they want, or because it gives them power in certain choices. This person doesn't come to the word of God to let it transform them. Um, and said they use the Bible as a proof text to gain ammunition or selfish battles. This one is tough. Um, this, uh, this actually was just a conversation I had this week about, um, thinking things that seem completely reasonable to you, but the Bible is like, no, that's just, that's not going to, that's not how it's supposed to go down. Um, and the question is, is there's, there has to be a distinction between what I think is fine and what the Bible says is the way to go. Um, and making sure that you're coming to the word in that, in that respect, like seeking out what God has to say, um, in his own context, not what, not what it is that you think. Um, because ultimately that's, it becomes irrelevant. Um, and finally, are we reading the Bible through our baggage? Um, uh, my friend Cindy's biggest problem was that she really couldn't believe that God would bring her happiness. Um, I, you know, I find this one pretty, so sometimes recognizing what it is that God is actually promising and taking his word on it, right? I think one of the scales that's easily tipped is, is reading God's wrath, um, reading God's justice and how bad and negative sin is. And you believe that part, but you can read in the next sentence in the same Bible, in

the same collection of the letters or whatever, um, his never ending love and the depth of his graciousness. And, and we still want to hold on to a and not believe as firmly in B. And I think it's because a is a lot more practical for us, right? They can say your sin sucks. And I can look at my life and I say, I see sin. I suck. Right. And I can, I can, I can see that, but I have trouble. People, people have trouble connecting to God's love in that same way because they're, they're looking for things that they're not actually allowing themselves to be warmed over. It's because people are used to the worldly response, right? Like, like, uh, usually, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, how can you say that? Like an abridgment of the law. When you've done something against the law, there's an applicable punishment. What people aren't used to is when they disobey a command that they get grace and love instead. And that's why it's hard for them to accept it because there's not, it's not something they're used to. That's what makes our God holy. That's what makes him different set apart. Is that, is that usually you're used to getting what you deserve unless you're some kind of shyster. Yeah. Yeah.

But you know what I'm saying? You're used to getting what you deserve and you don't deserve grace. And so people don't know how to take that because they don't, you know, they, they can't ever get past the fact that it's like, I don't deserve what you're giving to me. It just doesn't make any sense that I would go against your ways and you would love me just as much as you did before. I didn't do anything wrong, you know? And so, I mean, that's, that's, that's a fairly common response to God's grace. When you first meet it first, you're, you don't believe it. And second, when you, when, as soon as you do, uh, that's the part that changes your life. When you actually buy into grace, like God has set it out, you know, you can't, what else can you do when you find out a God loves you so much that you, you know, that, that, that even though you've done wrong, he loves you the same and just as much as, as, as everyone else he's ever made. That's pretty tough to grasp. You know, it's hard to accept it. Yeah. You could spend your whole life trying to grasp that, to really, truly believe, you know, that, that there's a God out there that loves you with every bit of his heart and, and, and has a never ending line of forgiveness for you if you just believe that he's there and that his son died and, uh, you know, to, to keep you out of that trouble. And that's, that seems like a really hard thing to grasp. And you want to talk about, you know, the head knowledge versus a relationship with Christ. That one's it. And that one, that one's hard for me.

Yeah. I mean, I've been in the faith a while. That one's hard for me. I still can't, I still don't put the crucifixion in the correct perspective that I'd like it to be in. You know, I just, I don't know. I feel like I should be pained every time I think about it and then worshiping every time I think about it. And I do, but not to the extent that I should, you know what I'm saying? It should, it should be more. It should, I should not have to, I should not have a hard time trying to find a place to put God in my day-to-day life. Like he should run the whole thing. Yeah. It should be evident with every move that I make that the grace that I've been given and, you know, and ask yourself why it ain't. If it's not, why isn't it? You know, I mean, is it that easily, is it that easy to forget the grace that you've been given? I think it's harder because it's harder to recognize his truth. I think the biggest change from a new Christian to a maturing one is being able to take, is have that be just as much true, just as hardcore true, his grace and his compassion as his wrath, as the recognizing sin for what it is. Because I think that's, anytime where I feel like there's distance between me and God, it's always because I consider the sin thing especially true, right? And the compassion thing as being, well, but maybe not this.

Yeah. Maybe not as much as I thought. Maybe not to the extent that I thought. And the Bible doesn't give you wiggle room to think that, right? So it's not, and I can look at it, and if someone says, Ben, do you believe every word in that Bible is true? And I say, yes. I say, can I read that and say it's true? But there's still something, it's a mind thing, and it's transferring that mind thing to the heart thing. That's the maturity. And it's a tough thing. And frankly, you might be maturing through that thing for all your days because it is not near as fathomable as recognizing the destruction of sin in the world. I can look around and see that, right? But I don't know. That I see as a constant struggle, and I think it's something where I can recognize truth. My heart, recognizing sin, committed to heart. Understanding God's compassion and grace, still 75% head, 25% heart. You know, it's funny because we spend, even if it's subconsciously, we spend so much of our life trying to get people to like us, you know, wearing the right clothes. Like me, I put a lot of thought into my shirts. You know, the things you say, the things you do, you just want people to like you. And you never really get it because people don't really care, you know. Right. People kind of like you, whatever. But with God, he loves you unconditionally, no matter what. And we get what we really want, but we don't accept it. It's just really weird.

Part of our condition, I guess, as people is like, it's what we strive for with people. And there's God, the God of the universe, the creator, saying, man, I love you more than anything. And we're like, oh, no, no. Yeah, I'm not sure about that. I know me pretty well, and I'm pretty disgusting. There's no reason for you to like me. But we try to pretend like we're not disgusting to people until they will like us. But with God, we're like, I don't know. I think that's the way we are. You've been listening to Live from the Path. Thanks for joining us here tonight. As in every Monday night, we hear from 10 to midnight at livefromthepath.org. Next week, Adam Cates will be in the studio. Make sure to clear your calendar. Check that stuff out. You can get information about him on Facebook. He's got a fan page, Adam Cates, C-A-T-E-S. And the following week, Jeff Arendale will be in studio. Both of those guys sharing some stuff off their upcoming CDs. Both, Adam's has been released. Jeff's is coming up. We're going to send you out with a little bit of Justin Jordan-Anderson from last week. This has caught me by a surprise. Thanks for listening to Live from the Path. We'll see you next week.